ND64 Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 What do we want? 12bit 4:4:4 Where do we want it? Internal When do we want it? Now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyalinejim Posted February 11, 2017 Share Posted February 11, 2017 5 hours ago, Eric Calabros said: What do we want? 12bit 4:4:4 Where do we want it? Internal When do we want it? Now. We've had it for 3 years on the 5dMkIII Magic Lantern, if you don't mind not having 4K. What would be helpful is a 2 shot comparison of a scene with some areas of flat colour like blue sky in 8bit VLog versus 10bit VLog, with the clips available for download. That should show the benefit of 10bit. Remember the chroma artifacts in 8bit VLog on the GH4? That wasn't evident on 10bit that went out to an external recorder, IIRC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
racer5 Posted February 12, 2017 Share Posted February 12, 2017 The difference is in grading. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kidzrevil Posted February 23, 2017 Share Posted February 23, 2017 You'll notice high bit rate before you'll notice high color depth (10 bit). Maybe you'll notice the difference on LOG footage but definitely not with a REC709 gamma profile designed for 0-255 luma range... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted February 23, 2017 Share Posted February 23, 2017 On 2/11/2017 at 1:51 PM, Eric Calabros said: What do we want? 12bit 4:4:4 Where do we want it? Internal When do we want it? Now. You can spend $50,000.00 USD on an Arri Amira package and not get 4K 12bit 4:4:4. And you want this in a consumer priced camera for $2,000? If your company needs it so badly, you could always rent the Panasonic VariCam 35 ($55,000). Would you care to share some footage explaining exactly how 4K 10bit 4:2:2 is holding you back creatively as a filmmaker? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TwoScoops Posted February 23, 2017 Share Posted February 23, 2017 On 12/02/2017 at 7:31 PM, racer5 said: The difference is in grading. This. You're not gonna see that much difference in straight OOC footage. Geoff CB 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sam Posted February 23, 2017 Share Posted February 23, 2017 3 hours ago, jonpais said: Would you care to share some footage explaining exactly how 4K 10bit 4:2:2 is holding you back creatively as a filmmaker? Well when your delivery format calls for the very large color space of rec. 2020 when combined with pq or hlg EOTF's, this could certainly limit the look and style of a piece by image manipulation, especially when compounded by compression during aquisition and a camera with inadequate dynamic range. Will this hold you back? Nope. People contently listen to highly compressed streaming music and mp3's on cheap speakers and even cheaper headphones generally without realizing what they are missing. Ignorance is bliss! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted February 23, 2017 Share Posted February 23, 2017 2 hours ago, sam said: Well when your delivery format calls for the very large color space of rec. 2020 when combined with pq or hlg EOTF's, this could certainly limit the look and style of a piece by image manipulation, especially when compounded by compression during aquisition and a camera with inadequate dynamic range. Will this hold you back? Nope. People contently listen to highly compressed streaming music and mp3's on cheap speakers and even cheaper headphones generally without realizing what they are missing. Ignorance is bliss! The point isn't that the industry doesn't use or need 12bit 4:4:4: it's that complaining that a $2,000 camera doesn't have it that strikes me as out of touch with reality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emanuel Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 IMHO, the trouble on this camera is far beyond to be... 10-bit 4:2:2 LOL but latitude, DR. A few samples clearly show it. Once again, on the shooter... Nothing more, period. (even the high ISOs coupled to denoising attempts by the camera maker to mimic larger sensor size competition can be disappointing but it is meaningless...) C'mon, that's ridiculous! Anyways, only talent will be the last frontier. Never these devices of nowadays, at this level. End of story :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Shasha Posted February 24, 2017 Share Posted February 24, 2017 The GH5 is the first time I am willing to trade dynamic-range for ergonomics. I am absolutely sick of rigging up cameras, if not with external monitors, than with shoulder-rigs and whatnot. For my personal shooting style, the 5-Axis on-sensor IBIS, high-res EVF and LCD, and 10-bit internal, make up for the lack of dynamic-range and usable 12,800ISO (which I wouldn't even use, anyway). Ken Ross, webrunner5, Don Kotlos and 1 other 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ND64 Posted March 1, 2017 Share Posted March 1, 2017 On 2/23/2017 at 10:07 PM, jonpais said: The point isn't that the industry doesn't use or need 12bit 4:4:4: it's that complaining that a $2,000 camera doesn't have it that strikes me as out of touch with reality. We didn't complain. We Want! and no its not being out of touch with anything. Today electronics are able to deliver it at $2k price range, but its a capability %98 of the target market will probably never use, so to Japanese camera makers its just a clear wasting R&D money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sam rides a mtb Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 Bumping this thread. I've run a few tests though don't have them with me as I'm traveling, but I could see a significant difference with some heavy grading. Straight out of camera, even on 10-bit monitor, I couldn't see any difference. When I'm back home and have some spare time, I'll try to post some of my findings and tests. In the meantime, anyone do any of these side by side tests? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sam rides a mtb Posted December 23, 2017 Share Posted December 23, 2017 Not my footage, but one example: Jonesy Jones and webrunner5 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anonim Posted December 24, 2017 Share Posted December 24, 2017 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ki Rin Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 Are there any comparisons of 8-bit vs 10-bit not using VLog? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webrunner5 Posted August 31, 2018 Share Posted August 31, 2018 This comparison about Data rates to me is even more telling. To the average person they would not see the difference between 144 mbps, or heck 12 mbps. Probably a reason the original C100 looks so good at 25 mbps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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