GH5 Noise Reduction @high ISOs simply sucks...

[Chrad]

56 minutes ago, R2me24 said:

I understand its under exposed. I shoot a lot of weddings and dont have control of my lighting. My point to this was that my footage doenst look like every other gh5 video Ive seen out there as far as noise is concerned.

I think every other GH5 video would look similar to your test if pointed at a scene that isn't even visible at ISO 200.

[Vesku]

1 hour ago, jonpais said:

The best way to avoid noise is to ETTR and reduce in camera sharpening.

Would you prefer ETTR with iso12800 if the alternative is a bit dark image at iso3200. Usually in dark places there is no light (luxury) to do ETTR. I prefer darker image with less noise. In dark scene I think the image should look dark too. I may also use longer shutter speed before upping iso. I may even use 1/15s with 30P (GH4).

[jonpais]

2 minutes ago, Vesku said:

Would you prefer ETTR with iso12800 if the alternative is a bit dark image at iso3200. Usually in dark places there is no light (luxury) to do ETTR. I prefer darker image with less noise. In dark scene I think the image should look dark too. I may also use longer shutter speed before upping iso. I may even use 1/15s with 30P (GH4).

You could be right Vesku; but if you're going after a moody scene in a narrative film, expose to the right, then bring mids and shadows down in post. 

[Chrad]

If there's no luxury to overexpose, I've found  underexposure of one stop or less on a moderate ISO to look pleasing on the Lumix cameras.

[kidzrevil]

18 hours ago, jonpais said:

You could be right Vesku; but if you're going after a moody scene in a narrative film, expose to the right, then bring mids and shadows down in post. 

That will deteriorate the image if you bump up the ISO to expose brighter so its worth keeping that in consideration as well

[jonpais]

26 minutes ago, kidzrevil said:

That will deteriorate the image if you bump up the ISO to expose brighter so its worth keeping that in consideration as well

Actually, I haven't done any scientific measurements or anything, but often exposing to the right could mean as little as 1/3 of a stop more exposure than I was used to giving, so we're definitely not talking about a stop more exposure or anything like that. An added advantage of exposing to the right, for me anyway, is that it also usually entails opening up the iris a little more, which means a bit shallower depth of field. But I've also read that the GH5 can handle a little underexposure and pushing in post, so I wouldn't lose any sleep over this or anything. Give it a try, see if you like the results; I have, and I like what I'm seeing: if it doesn't work for your workflow, that's cool too. 

[jonpais]

19 hours ago, Vesku said:

Would you prefer ETTR with iso12800 if the alternative is a bit dark image at iso3200. Usually in dark places there is no light (luxury) to do ETTR. I prefer darker image with less noise. In dark scene I think the image should look dark too. I may also use longer shutter speed before upping iso. I may even use 1/15s with 30P (GH4).

Hi Vesku, when we say ETTR, we're not talking about anything extreme; there should still be pixels in the deepest shadow areas.

[Vesku]

2 hours ago, jonpais said:

Hi Vesku, when we say ETTR, we're not talking about anything extreme; there should still be pixels in the deepest shadow areas.

I thought ETTR is the brightest exposure before important highlights are clipping.

I ment earlier that when we have the widest aperture and longest shutter speed in low light we have only iso to work with. I dont want to rise iso for ETTR then. I use normally f 3.5 kit lens so I must think this quite often indoors.

[jonpais]

50 minutes ago, Vesku said:

I thought ETTR is the brightest exposure before important highlights are clipping.

I ment earlier that when we have the widest aperture and longest shutter speed in low light we have only iso to work with. I dont want to rise iso for ETTR then. I use normally f 3.5 kit lens so I must think this quite often indoors.

In the waveform monitor above, the highlights are just touching 100 IRE. This clip was shot at f/2 or f/2.8. 

[Vesku]

5 minutes ago, jonpais said:

In the waveform monitor above, the highlights are just touching 100 IRE.

Those are little dots of specular shines. The actual whites (plate, wall) are not very white. This does not look like ETTR for me but it looks OK. I would expose like this.

[jonpais]

1 minute ago, Vesku said:

Those are little dots of specular shines. The actual whites (plate, wall) are not very white. This does not look like ETTR for me but it looks OK. I would expose like this.

You don't want to lift exposure until there are no more pixels in the shadows. Here's an example of an image that has been slightly overexposed. In your EVF or LCD, the left end of the histogram should still be touching the farthest shadow area. 

[Vesku]

25 minutes ago, jonpais said:

You don't want to lift exposure until there are no more pixels in the shadows. Here's an example of an image that has been slightly overexposed. In your EVF or LCD, the left end of the histogram should still be touching the farthest shadow area. 

In very low contrast scene there is no black or white. It is not always necessary to have black pixels for example in a foggy day. I dont usually judge exposure watching black level. In my GH4 there are shades in black even when the histogram shows crushed blacks. Maybe the GH5 waveform is more accurate.

But about the topic. Is there any consensus if the GH5 NR is good enough? I use always NR -5 with my GH4.

[jonpais]

5 minutes ago, Vesku said:

In very low contrast scene there is no black or white. It is not always necessary to have black pixels for example in a foggy day. I dont usually judge exposure watching black level. In my GH4 there are shades in black even when the histogram shows crushed blacks. Maybe the GH5 waveform is more accurate.

But about the topic. Is there any consensus if the GH5 NR is good enough? I use always NR -5 with my GH4.

Actually, this is OT. I've shown numerous examples of my own work, I've shared detailed information for getting consistently good exposures while reducing noise and increasing DR, which is as applicable to the GH5 as it is to the G85.

[Emanuel]

 

 

[Emanuel]

 

[Davey]

1 hour ago, Emanuel said:

 

This is suffering form the Sony zombie look, which (appropriately so) is most apparent at night - those skin tones need the EOSHD Pro Color treatment

[Emanuel]