How will Canon, Sony, etc. respond to Blackmagic Ursa Mini Pro?

[photographer-at-large]

Lower prices, new models?

[mercer]

They won't. Or maybe one of them will offer to buy them. 

[Andrew Reid]

They don't need to.

[fuzzynormal]

6 minutes ago, photographer-at-large said:

Lower prices, new models?

Are you curious if they will literally respond by adapting their products, or are you just wondering what they're doing next?  Their production pipeline stretches over years.

[Kisaha]

I am expecting a C100markIII announcement, or else I see myself going for the FS5, the variable ND filter is a good reason as it is already. 

In the end, as I see it, even a JVC LS300 for 3000euros (we already have one) is great to bring some bread on the table and the budget can be spend on lights and/or some sound equipment (Zoom F4 anyone?!) to complete my set.

This announcement is quite exciting, but I do not see taking too many customers from Canon and Sony, even though they will definitely take some. This camera seems like a work-sheep, not a work-horse.

I am waiting for the first reviews and future announcements from other companies, just hope to push Canon and Panasonic make a move, at last.

I just can't understand how Panasonic is out of this game with a Varicam Ultra Light Tiny, C100/FS5 killer!

[hijodeibn]

Canon is not going to do anything, no need at all, and Sony will continue doing the same thing, crapy skin-tones in 6-month depreciated cameras……GH5 is the big winner here, it is going to sell like french fries, I think the only that could have stopped in some portion the mayor GH5 Tsunami should have been the announcement of a pocket v2….

[webrunner5]

4 hours ago, Kisaha said:

 

 

I just can't understand how Panasonic is out of this game with a Varicam Ultra Light Tiny, C100/FS5 killer!

Yeah as far as I can tell Panasonic is not selling Varicams as fast as they can make them. They are not going to take lots of Sony F55, and Arri Alexa buyers with it.

They need a 2500 to 3000 dollar camcorder. A new AF100! Where the hell is it!

[Django]

One area where Sony/Canon destroy BMD is ISO performance. Ursa's base ISO is 400/800 and maxes out at 1600. This alone rules them out of quite a few situations..

[jcs]

ARRI will release the ARRI Nano 4K, for $5K  

[kgv5]

36 minutes ago, Django said:

One area where Sony/Canon destroy BMD is ISO performance. Ursa's base ISO is 400/800 and maxes out at 1600. This alone rules them out of quite a few situations..

BM cameras doesnt have any internal noise reduction. You get it with free davinci resolve, it is very advanced and gives great results. I think canon/sony does something internally in this regard. They are better for sure but we really dont know how much better.

[webrunner5]

Anyone buying a $6,000.00 camera can probably afford some decent lighting equipment. But yeah, would be nice if it was a stop or two higher. You have to remember that BM has not really been around that long, and they have brought out a Ton of equipment in a damn short time. They are learning.

This whole website is full of people that admire their products. Pretty amazing for a startup company. 

[Django]

It isn't so much about "affording decent lighting equipment". if you're shooting run & gun, events, weddings etc.. you don't have time to set up lights on every shot.. that's where Canon/Sony cams come in handy. I don't see those type of shooters switching over. For all the marketing, BMD cams are still mostly cinema cams in their ISO handling. They're trying to compete with Red/Arri on a budget. Amazing for studio & narrative with controlled lighting or sunny california outdoor shoots but for other types of shooting or low light conditions they're far from ideal. You'll get all kinds of noise & block artefacts that Da Vinci for sure can't solve..

Also I hope they've fixed that magenta cast issue the 4.6K sensor had!

[Kisaha]

@Django for this, and some other reasons, I said above "This announcement is quite exciting, but I do not see taking too many customers from Canon and Sony, even though they will definitely take some. This camera seems like a work-sheep, not a work-horse."

[Jimmy]

13 hours ago, jcs said:

ARRI will release the ARRI Nano 4K, for $5K  

Imagine that!

But even if it was just 1080/24p only with the alexa sensor... I'd be all over it... that sensor is pure magic 

[mercer]

1 hour ago, Jimmy said:

Imagine that!

But even if it was just 1080/24p only with the alexa sensor... I'd be all over it... that sensor is pure magic 

Hell, if Arri came out with a 720p Super 35mm camera that shot 24p/60p in arri log and arri raw, I'd give them $2000.

[hyalinejim]

Cinelog for MLRAW will give you Arri-like colour. Just sayin'!

[mercer]

Is CineLog from Vision?

The Markii is getting dirt cheap now, it may be worth a look. I love my 50D, but lack of any audio makes it a tough production camera. Am also interested in the 70D with ML Raw and DPAF. 

[hyalinejim]

http://www.cinelogdcp.com/cinelogc-connects/

It's for transcoding DNGs to Log masters. It gives you a Cineon-like gamma curve in Alexa Wide Gamut colour space. Interestingly, I shot an X Rite chart on 5D3 and the values matched uncannily closely with Alexa chart shots I found online. I'll try to dig them out.

[jcs]

13 minutes ago, hyalinejim said:

http://www.cinelogdcp.com/cinelogc-connects/

It's for transcoding DNGs to Log masters. It gives you a Cineon-like gamma curve in Alexa Wide Gamut colour space. Interestingly, I shot an X Rite chart on 5D3 and the values matched uncannily closely with Alexa chart shots I found online. I'll try to dig them out.

I was gonna say for 1080p, 5D3 RAW, with the exception of DR and highlights (though you can do a lot with Adobe Camera RAW if you have the processing time), is the Baby Alexa Deal of the Century...

[hyalinejim]

Here's a screengrab of an ISO200 chart shot in daylight balanced lighting I found at this link:

http://www.drewmoe.com/digitalnoise.shtml

Here's a shot I took of a chart in sunlight on a 5D3. Brought it into ACR, applied Cinelog C profile, brought it into Rec709 After Effects and exported as RGB TIFF:

I brought them in to Photoshop and blurred both shots to eliminate noise and masked off the squares. I placed Cinelog behind Arri and used a quick curves adjustment to match the exposure using the bottom squares (because the Arri shots had a Rec709 lut applied and the Cinelog is still in Cineon gamma). This is the result, Arri is the set on top and 5D3 ML Cinelog C is the set underneath:

It's not an exact match, but it's not bad considering these are shots from 2 different cameras from 2 totally different shoots... and also when you consider the price difference. I'd love to get both cameras side by side to shoot the same chart at the same time.