C-LOG coming to 5D mk IV

[jcs]

As long as they are listening, how about tweakable Canon Log 2? I've gotten nice results from tweaking Slog2 on the A7S II, and love Canon Log 2 on the C300 II, would be nice to have something similar for the 1DX II (tweakable means we can tune the curve somewhat to make the best use of the 8-bits available. Unless of course they'll give us 10-bit (might be 8-bit hardware though...)). I'll bet they could improve the full frame modes too if they wanted to.

[Asmundma]

8 hours ago, jcs said:

I created a Clog emulation in May 2016, right after purchasing the 1DX II. Along with Highlight Tone Priority (HTP) it appeared to be useful at first. However it became clear in production that skintones became challenging so I stopped using it (still use HTP). Actual Clog which isn't just a picture profile could be useful (highlights and preserving skintones), especially for matching other Canon cameras quickly. I was able to quickly grade GH5 log footage so a convergence on log formats that can be graded similarly is very helpful in production.

 

 

Can you explain the difference between clog and a picture profile 'clog'?

[jcs]

52 minutes ago, Asmundma said:

Can you explain the difference between clog and a picture profile 'clog'?

True CLog uses a log gamma curve using low-level camera data so maximum dynamic range and highlights can be preserved. A picture profile doesn't have access to the low-level data, so true log is not possible, and thus there is no actual increase in dynamic range. Boosting the shadows with the gamma curve in a picture profile can do bad things to skintones, which shouldn't happen with true CLog. A log-like picture profile might be helpful in high dynamic range shots such as outdoors by boosting the shadows before compression and Highlight Tone Priority to help with the highlights. Would test skintones in this case before an important shoot.

[Jaime Valles]

14 hours ago, Andrew Reid said:

http://www.eoshd.com/2016/09/now-available-eoshd-picture-profiles-brings-c-log-canon-dslrs-including-1d-x-mark-ii-5d-mark-iv/

Wake the fuck up!

Hey, man, I already purchased EOSHD C-LOG from you! I would just be very upset if Canon added the official Canon LOG to the 5D4 and ignored the 1DX2

[tomekk]

12 hours ago, jcs said:

I created a Clog emulation in May 2016, right after purchasing the 1DX II. Along with Highlight Tone Priority (HTP) it appeared to be useful at first. However it became clear in production that skintones became challenging so I stopped using it (still use HTP). Actual Clog which isn't just a picture profile could be useful (highlights and preserving skintones), especially for matching other Canon cameras quickly. I was able to quickly grade GH5 log footage so a convergence on log formats that can be graded similarly is very helpful in production.

 

 

That would be an advantage to using a clog profile and difference would be much greater to what Andrew is saying. 

[Dunjoye]

The C-log would be a welcomed improvement to the 5d mark iv imo. But it's not a deal breaker 

No disrespect to these user made log profiles. They are great but they just don't have the same kick as the C-log.

An improvement on the crop however would be a big bonus.

 

I think the log would be more appreciateon on the 1dx mark ii .

The 1dc with a dpaf improvement would be my deal choice, however I believe they are done with the camera. 

 

[Matthew19]

5 hours ago, Dunjoye said:

The C-log would be a welcomed improvement to the 5d mark iv imo. But it's not a deal breaker 

No disrespect to these user made log profiles. They are great but they just don't have the same kick as the C-log.

An improvement on the crop however would be a big bonus.

 

I think the log would be more appreciateon on the 1dx mark ii .

The 1dc with a dpaf improvement would be my deal choice, however I believe they are done with the camera. 

 

DPAF starts at the sensor level. DUAL PIXEL. It's not an upgrade option on the 1dc. 

[jcs]

Anyone with access to both the 1DX-II (or 5D4 etc.) and the 1DC could perform a test to see how much better CLog is vs. the log-like picture styles for both dynamic range and skintones (the harder part). @Luke Mason noted the 1DC with CLog has more DR but not much more info here: 

 

[kaylee]

7 hours ago, Dunjoye said:

An improvement on the crop however would be a big bonus

thatd be huge id like to see that

if canon – through software updates – starts selling a clog enabled 5d4 with a crop that is reasonable.... wow, that would be pretty ironic. i mean better late then never but jeez...

[Ty Harper]

As promising as all this is, doesn't it kind of begin to undermine the official difference between the 'C' and non C lines? And in bigger terms does it signal a significant and deeper shift in Canon's marketing strategy and philosophy moving forward?

[Matthew19]

4 hours ago, jcs said:

Anyone with access to both the 1DX-II (or 5D4 etc.) and the 1DC could perform a test to see how much better CLog is vs. the log-like picture styles for both dynamic range and skintones (the harder part). @Luke Mason noted the 1DC with CLog has more DR but not much more info here: 

 

I have access to both cameras but refuse to buy a fake c-log picture profile. 

[jcs]

15 minutes ago, Matthew19 said:

I have access to both cameras but refuse to buy a fake c-log picture profile. 

You can create your own with Canon's Picture Style editor, or I released two free versions before the paid versions came out, here, and here. Mine are unlocked so you can see the curves and change them. I also tested CineStyle (also free, but locked)- didn't see much difference between my version (think their's was a little flatter). The folks who made paid versions probably spent a lot more time tuning the settings than I did. I only spent a few minutes and didn't try to match CLog etc., just did it by eye.

[Django]

http://www.canonrumors.com/c-log-update-to-canon-eos-5d-mark-iv-not-just-a-firmware-update/

[kaylee]

5 minutes ago, Django said:

http://www.canonrumors.com/c-log-update-to-canon-eos-5d-mark-iv-not-just-a-firmware-update/

what tha heck

[Nikkor]

8 minutes ago, kaylee said:

what tha heck

They don't want to make the update file availabe on the internet because it would make it easy for Hackers to give any Canon Camera this extra picturestyle. They did the Same with the dualpixel Update on their C line.

[kaylee]

oh snap... thanks~!

[zerocool22]

Hopefully they will enable 4k full frame 10bit HDMI out(internal is too much too ask I think) with clog which would mean around 13.5 stops of DR? That would bring canon back to its former glory.

[sudopera]

So potential 5D customers that are more interested in video now matter all of a sudden, maybe the sales are not going so good with the stills crowd.

It seems to me that Canon relies to much on fanboyism, like old wars Canon vs Nikon, but in my opinion new generations have much less brand loyalty. For me, best example of this was NX1, yes maybe Samsung didn't sell enough units to stay in business, but just look how many forum members here own them and do some great work. All those guys weren't afraid to switch to a new player in camera business because they knew they are getting a very capable camera for a good price, and it can serve them well for a few more years without a problem.
Now there is Fuji XT2 that shoots 4K video and probably has even better colors (IMO) than Canon straight out of camera, and with those great picture profiles you even have the option to create different moods in camera without much grading, for a fast turnaround. And also lets not forget best looking JPEG stills straight out of camera in the business.

On the stills side of things, lets say I want to buy FF DSLR in that price range, why would I go for 5D IV, when there is Nikon D810 with still better DR, more than enough resolution and lower price point.

Also, switching glass is easier than ever these days when you have all those Sigmas now that are even better in some cases than their Canikon counterparts, but are much more affordable.

I really hope that they are feeling the breath of competitors down their neck, because who wouldn't go back to Canon if they do things right for us video guys in the future.

[hijodeibn]

3 hours ago, Nikkor said:

They don't want to make the update file availabe on the internet because it would make it easy for Hackers to give any Canon Camera this extra picturestyle. They did the Same with the dualpixel Update on their C line.

My Gosh….another $500 update?

[hijodeibn]

30 minutes ago, sudopera said:

So potential 5D customers that are more interested in video now matter all of a sudden, maybe the sales are not going so good with the stills crowd.

It seems to me that Canon relies to much on fanboyism, like old wars Canon vs Nikon, but in my opinion new generations have much less brand loyalty. For me, best example of this was NX1, yes maybe Samsung didn't sell enough units to stay in business, but just look how many forum members here own them and do some great work. All those guys weren't afraid to switch to a new player in camera business because they knew they are getting a very capable camera for a good price, and it can serve them well for a few more years without a problem.
Now there is Fuji XT2 that shoots 4K video and probably has even better colors (IMO) than Canon straight out of camera, and with those great picture profiles you even have the option to create different moods in camera without much grading, for a fast turnaround. And also lets not forget best looking JPEG stills straight out of camera in the business.

On the stills side of things, lets say I want to buy FF DSLR in that price range, why would I go for 5D IV, when there is Nikon D810 with still better DR, more than enough resolution and lower price point.

Also, switching glass is easier than ever these days when you have all those Sigmas now that are even better in some cases than their Canikon counterparts, but are much more affordable.

I really hope that they are feeling the breath of competitors down their neck, because who wouldn't go back to Canon if they do things right for us video guys in the future.

Canon is still selling cameras like hot pancakes, they have been in the business for many years and will stay on it many more, the best example of this was Samsun NX1 experiment , great features but they were not able to sell enough units to stay in business, Canon cameras have the best image, everybody like it, yes, they are expensive, but the cameras have low depreciation, most of them retain their value for a long time and don`t become outdated the next year, there is a reason people still keep buying canon even in a crowded market with so many cheap options out there, if 5d IV get C-log and a better crop, even with the $500 update, I will be looking my wallet the next year waiting for a discount, extra many from heaven, whatever, to get one of this, and i am sure a lot of people will be doing the same…..