webrunner5 Posted July 5, 2018 Share Posted July 5, 2018 3 hours ago, ntblowz said: Anyway I predict a7s3 coming autumn 18 in that thread, I wonder if that still holds or get pushed for winter release If Nikon is really coming out with these Mirrorless cameras I think Sony Has to announce something new to keep Sony's name alive during that news cycle. Maybe the A7s mk III, And a New A9 mk II. ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gene K Posted August 22, 2018 Share Posted August 22, 2018 DJI is about to announced a 10 bit consumer drone camera of all things, of Sony doesn't include 10 bit in the a7s iii, it will be yesterday's camera the day it's announced. Kisaha and Geoff CB 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanveer Posted August 23, 2018 Share Posted August 23, 2018 11 hours ago, Gene K said: DJI is about to announced a 10 bit consumer drone camera of all things, of Sony doesn't include 10 bit in the a7s iii, it will be yesterday's camera the day it's announced. So true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 On 8/23/2018 at 3:48 AM, Gene K said: DJI is about to announced a 10 bit consumer drone camera of all things, of Sony doesn't include 10 bit in the a7s iii, it will be yesterday's camera the day it's announced. I’d like to see Prores RAW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members BTM_Pix Posted August 25, 2018 Super Members Share Posted August 25, 2018 15 minutes ago, jonpais said: I’d like to see Prores RAW. Whatever became of Atomos urging everyone to lobby their congressman to get manufacturers to output RAW over HDMI? It all seemed to go very quiet after all those videos from NAB of one of their chief's telling everyone to do it. Intrigued me that the video posted in the Nikon frenzy thread saying Atomos helped Nikon develop N-LOG so I would've thought that would have been an opportune moment for them to persuade a manufacturer to do it if it was indeed possible. And it would've given Nikon a bit of a coup as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
froess Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 prores was never that common on consumer cameras other than blackmagic. even on sony cameras, you have to pay for that option. it's an expensive codec because of apple. so i don't understand all of the sudden this requests for prores raw. it only works with final cut at the moment and if you don't have prores, most likely you're not going to get prores raw. that's why you see proprietary codecs, xavc, avc, canon xf avc, etc webrunner5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanveer Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 11 minutes ago, froess said: prores was never that common on consumer cameras other than blackmagic. even on sony cameras, you have to pay for that option. it's an expensive codec because of apple. so i don't understand all of the sudden this requests for prores raw. it only works with final cut at the moment and if you don't have prores, most likely you're not going to get prores raw. that's why you see proprietary codecs, xavc, avc, canon xf avc, etc ProRes RAW is proprietary monopoly. And shamelessly so. If anything, it should probably be boycotted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted August 25, 2018 Share Posted August 25, 2018 Let them boycott if after a7s III Prores RAW is announced at Photokina in September. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRenaissanceMan Posted August 26, 2018 Share Posted August 26, 2018 9 hours ago, jonpais said: Let them boycott if after a7s III Prores RAW is announced at Photokina in September. Eh...I ain't switching to Final Cut anytime soon. Boycott after DaVinci announces Resolve support for ProRes Raw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
froess Posted August 26, 2018 Share Posted August 26, 2018 would love an increase in megapixels, like 16 or close to that. lower iso for slog and a better evf. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted August 26, 2018 Share Posted August 26, 2018 21 hours ago, sanveer said: ProRes RAW is proprietary monopoly. And shamelessly so. If anything, it should probably be boycotted. 80% of productions currently record in Prores, and we’ll soon see Prores RAW widely adopted in the industry, so good luck with that! If your argument is that Apple holds the rights, then by that logic, we should throw out all patents! Just out of curiosity - what precisely do you mean by ‘shamelessly so’? You mean like a woman of ill repute showing off her wares on 8 mile road? ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Collins Posted August 26, 2018 Share Posted August 26, 2018 39 minutes ago, jonpais said: 80% of productions currently record in Prores, and we’ll soon see Prores RAW widely adopted in the industry, so good luck with that! If your argument is that Apple holds the rights, then by that logic, we should throw out all patents! Just out of curiosity - what precisely do you mean by ‘shamelessly so’? You mean like a woman of ill repute showing off her wares on 8 mile road? ? I dont agree. We have been through all this with stills. JPEG is a universal open format that everyone uses - I doubt we would use it, if it was a format licensed from Canon. DNG is a 'raw format' that Adobe claims is 'open' but as it owns it, it hasnt received widespread adoption apart from in Adobe products in the last 10 years. Inherently a raw video format doesnt have any need of ownership/patents because it is simply a format for 'raw data' coming off the sensor. It is not trying to cure cancer. And conceptually making 'raw' proprietary is an 'oxymoron' rather like paying a clothes company for the privilege of walking around in the raw. If you think that paying a company for the privilege of taking 'raw' data off a sensor is a workable concept then I just think you are being heroically optimistic. Of course, Apple would presumably argue that 'prores raw' isnt actually 'raw' but is 'doctored raw' which is fine apart from the fact they are misrepresenting what they are selling in the first place. BTW can we have a source for the '80% of productions currently record in prores'? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted August 26, 2018 Share Posted August 26, 2018 27 minutes ago, Robert Collins said: I dont agree. We have been through all this with stills. JPEG is a universal open format that everyone uses - I doubt we would use it, if it was a format licensed from Canon. DNG is a 'raw format' that Adobe claims is 'open' but as it owns it, it hasnt received widespread adoption apart from in Adobe products in the last 10 years. Inherently a raw video format doesnt have any need of ownership/patents because it is simply a format for 'raw data' coming off the sensor. It is not trying to cure cancer. And conceptually making 'raw' proprietary is an 'oxymoron' rather like paying a clothes company for the privilege of walking around in the raw. If you think that paying a company for the privilege of taking 'raw' data off a sensor is a workable concept then I just think you are being heroically optimistic. Of course, Apple would presumably argue that 'prores raw' isnt actually 'raw' but is 'doctored raw' which is fine apart from the fact they are misrepresenting what they are selling in the first place. BTW can we have a source for the '80% of productions currently record in prores'? Sure, Jeromy Young’s talk at NAB 2018. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webrunner5 Posted August 26, 2018 Share Posted August 26, 2018 ProRes RAW has one downside over DNG Raw. It has 1 1/2 stops less Dynamic Range. But not too many cameras can even shoot in DNG Raw so probably not a big problem for most. This is a DJI video on the X7. But it has a lot of info about ProRes Raw and even some tips on FCPX using it. https://forum.dji.com/thread-158286-1-1.html mercer 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mercer Posted August 26, 2018 Share Posted August 26, 2018 11 minutes ago, webrunner5 said: ProRes RAW has one downside over DNG Raw. It has 1 1/2 stops less Dynamic Range. But not too many cameras can even shoot in DNG Raw so probably not a big problem for most. This is a DJI video on the X7. But it has a lot of info about ProRes Raw and even some tips on FCPX using it. https://forum.dji.com/thread-158286-1-1.html Wow. Drooling over here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
webrunner5 Posted August 26, 2018 Share Posted August 26, 2018 There is a ProRes Raw HQ also. I don't know much about it. it is like 300mbs. It has a higher data rate than ProRes Raw. it probably has more DR. How much more, I don't know. 19 minutes ago, mercer said: Wow. Drooling over here. Yeah that is pretty amazing seeing how it is from a Drone! An Expensive Drone, but yeah, Wow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted August 26, 2018 Share Posted August 26, 2018 1 hour ago, Robert Collins said: I dont agree. We have been through all this with stills. JPEG is a universal open format that everyone uses - I doubt we would use it, if it was a format licensed from Canon. DNG is a 'raw format' that Adobe claims is 'open' but as it owns it, it hasnt received widespread adoption apart from in Adobe products in the last 10 years. Inherently a raw video format doesnt have any need of ownership/patents because it is simply a format for 'raw data' coming off the sensor. It is not trying to cure cancer. And conceptually making 'raw' proprietary is an 'oxymoron' rather like paying a clothes company for the privilege of walking around in the raw. If you think that paying a company for the privilege of taking 'raw' data off a sensor is a workable concept then I just think you are being heroically optimistic. Of course, Apple would presumably argue that 'prores raw' isnt actually 'raw' but is 'doctored raw' which is fine apart from the fact they are misrepresenting what they are selling in the first place. BTW can we have a source for the '80% of productions currently record in prores'? I’m not sure your argument is convincing, Rob. Paying someone so I can walk around in the buff is different from dozens of software engineers working together for months. If it’s just data off the sensor, then anyone should be able to cook it up in their kitchen, right? Anyhow, the only person I could find who thought it was a conspiracy is Vitaly at PV, and he’s a bit of an eccentric. I’ve seen lots of industry leaders and respected filmmakers who have nothing but great things to say about ProRes RAW, and none of them mention anything about deceptive marketing practices or say it should be free. But camera manufacturers and Atomos will be offering it in their products at no extra cost to the consumer. In fact, Atomos has already given free updates to owners of their recorders and the Panasonic EVA1 firmware update v.2.0 added it, along with a couple other companies. Anyhow, nobody’s forcing anyone to use ProRes RAW - you can shoot other RAW formats if you like. Just as I’m free not to buy a certain cinema camera because they intentionally leave out a middle codec. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolf33d Posted August 26, 2018 Share Posted August 26, 2018 23 hours ago, jonpais said: I’d like to see Prores RAW. THIS. Gimme ProRes RAW everywhere. This is the real deal. 9 hours ago, TheRenaissanceMan said: Eh...I ain't switching to Final Cut anytime soon. Boycott after DaVinci announces Resolve support for ProRes Raw You should. jonpais 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonpais Posted August 26, 2018 Share Posted August 26, 2018 Atomos has a close working relationship with many of the leading camera manufacturers, so anything is possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRenaissanceMan Posted August 27, 2018 Share Posted August 27, 2018 13 hours ago, wolf33d said: THIS. Gimme ProRes RAW everywhere. This is the real deal. You should. I work on a custom tower, so laptop comparisons don't apply to me at all. Plus I vastly prefer the functionality and UI of Windows; there's no way I'm switching to a new NLE just for ProRes RAW, let alone a new OS . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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