Making sense of the new Blackmagic Production Camera and Pocket Cinema Camera

[Andrew Reid]

No one has mentioned yet that the Production Camera only comes with Resolve Lite, not the full version. So to fairly compare, at least cost, between Production and it's little brother, we should say that BMPC costs $4990 and BMCC costs $2995

 

I don't think that's right at all. It comes with a full version of Resolve 10.

[HurtinMinorKey]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cWjdFcziXpI

 

@ 2:00

 

BM employee- "A little less dynamic range, a little less sharp"

[J.P]

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

 

If you record a format, then compress it, and it looks the exact same after playback, then it is "visually loss-less".

 

If you record a format, then compress it, and you lose no information whatsoever (including detail that can't be seen upon native playback) then you have a true loss-less format. 

 

It sounds like the compressed Raw is going to throw away some information.

 

Lets not confuse things further with "visually lossless" and "true lossless" :)

 

It's either lossless or lossy compression. And BM states that the PocketCC does lossless compressed CinemaDNG, that's all we need to know. Is anyone e.g debating wether an unzipped text file reaaaaally is the same as the original? No :)

[HurtinMinorKey]

Lets not confuse things further with "visually lossless" and "true lossless" :)

 

It's either lossless or lossy compression. And BM states that the PocketCC does lossless compressed CinemaDNG, that's all we need to know. Is anyone e.g debating wether an unzipped text file reaaaaally is the same as the original? No :)

 

 

But I've yet to see Black Magic claim that the compressed RAW on the BMPC is lossless?  They were the ones calling it "visually lossless", and why would they qualify lossless, if it was indeed just lossless?

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image_compression

 

from the article.

 

"The lossy compression that produces imperceptible differences may be called visually lossless."

 

I'm willing to bet that you will lose a lot of flexibility in grading with this "compressed RAW".

[Bruno]

BM employee- "A little less dynamic range, a little less sharp"

 

A little less sharp could also be a good thing, more film like and less prone to aliasing. :)

[J.P]

But I've yet to see Black Magic claim that the compressed RAW on the BMPC is lossless?  They were the ones calling it "visually lossless", and why would they qualify lossless, if it was indeed just lossless?

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image_compression

 

from the article.

 

"The lossy compression that produces imperceptible differences may be called visually lossless."

 

I'm willing to bet that you will lose a lot of flexibility in grading with this "compressed RAW".

 

This is where I saw claims of it being lossless: http://www.blackmagicdesign.com/products/blackmagicpocketcinemacamera/techspecs

 

lossless compressed CinemaDNG RAW

 

But agreed, reading more from forums and seeing video reports is really confusing  :wacko:

[Caleb Genheimer]

So the BM Production 4K camera is EF mount, not M43 (makes sense), but have they fixed the flange distance issues?

Um . . . hate to break it to ya, but all camera mounts have a specific flange focal distance (FFD) that cannot be changed. EF mount is EF mount, you don't "fix" the FFD. The only way to fix it is to switch to a different mount that has a shorter FFD. EF-M would've been a better choice for that reason. Still Canon and EF-comaptible (with adapter) for all the Canon lens lovers out there, but short FFD (compared to EF) for all of us that want to adapt lots of lenses.

[Andrew Reid]

Don't think that is what Tim is referring to Caleb.

 

The spec flange for EF is 44mm and this is what Blackmagic went with.

 

The actual flange on EOS DSLRs is more like 43.5mm to allow for some tolerance for infinity and AF micro adjustments. This wasn't factored into the Blackmagic Cinema Camera as it would have knocked cinema glass off their marks.

 

Still think they should dump EF and go for E-mount.

 

I bet you anything there will be an E-mount version of the 4K camera come the end of the year.

[chauffeurdevan]

This is where I saw claims of it being lossless: http://www.blackmagicdesign.com/products/blackmagicpocketcinemacamera/techspecs

 

 

But agreed, reading more from forums and seeing video reports is really confusing  :wacko:

 

Watch out, you're mixing Pocket specs with Production 4K specs.

 

Pocket : Lossless DNG compression

Production 4K : Lossy DNG compression

 

John Brawley confirmed that the visually lossless compression the 4K is actually lossy compression. However, it should be 12bits. So some Adobe DNG specs update should follow !

[acmeman]

Hi Andrew, do you think there's much of a future for the EF BMCC? Do the other mounts ie. E or MFT have the same FFD problems between lenses? I'm asking this because my wides, tokina 11-16 & canon 10-22 don't quite hit infinity below f4 below about 14mmm. If I'm not using cine glass should I get this adjusted? Would you?

 

 

Don't think that is what Tim is referring to Caleb.

 

The spec flange for EF is 44mm and this is what Blackmagic went with.

 

The actual flange on EOS DSLRs is more like 43.5mm to allow for some tolerance for infinity and AF micro adjustments. This wasn't factored into the Blackmagic Cinema Camera as it would have knocked cinema glass off their marks.

 

Still think they should dump EF and go for E-mount.

 

I bet you anything there will be an E-mount version of the 4K camera come the end of the year.