Improving GH5 colour - comparison with 5D3 RAW

[mercer]

5 minutes ago, webrunner5 said:

The 5D3 is a cool as hell camera. Better than the BMPCC in reality. But as it stands right now, I see it as more of a novelty camera than a practical full use camera.

If I had to make a living tomorrow with either a 5D3 or a GH5, well you know my answer to that ditty.

Again not trying to be contrary, but I'm not so sure about that either. The 5D3 is a professional stills camera and more than enough, even with its factory firmware, for wedding videos. The Canon badge also still pulls a lot of weight in the industry, I assume. But before I say any more and get castrated here, the GH5 is the best camera ever invented and the only option for any level of filmmaker and all other camera companies should stop making cameras...?

Anyway, my original point is this... the author disliking Panasonic color and having to create a workaround to make it look like Canon color is more a testament to his abilities than it is a plus for the GH5.

[AaronChicago]

@hyalinejim Great job with making the Panasonic reds less orange and ACTUAL red. Here is a shot where the tubes were solid red, the poker table was red, and the guy's shirt was red/black. It was looking a bit orange naturally till I added your LUT.

 

[tweak]

1 hour ago, webrunner5 said:

The 5D3 is a cool as hell camera. Better than the BMPCC in reality. But as it stands right now, I see it as more of a novelty camera than a practical full use camera.

If I had to make a living tomorrow with either a 5D3 or a GH5, well you know my answer to that ditty.

But it might be a BSOD in Windows 10. No real later support for it looks like. Are you running Windows 10?

 

As above, I don't know many people who would consider a 5D3 a novelty... takes a way better picture than a m43 sensor, it's multi purpose and better low light abilities are a big thing for some people. Anyway, how many people here are actually making a proper living off this stuff? I'm just shooting test vids  .

What is windows?

[webrunner5]

8 minutes ago, tweak said:

As above, I don't know many people who would consider a 5D3 a novelty... takes a way better picture than a m43 sensor, it's multi purpose and better low light abilities are a big thing for some people. Anyway, how many people here are actually making a proper living off this stuff? I'm just shooting test vids  .

What is windows 10?

LoL, I figured you for some kind of strange person that would use a Apple computer. No wonder yo have a 5D3!!   Well I must admit I have a iPhone 6s plus sad to say at times. Apple computers, well no way in hell LoL. I am retired, not Donald Trump!

Maybe you won it in a contest?? That would take you off the hook.

I have built every desktop computer i have ever owned for going on 20 years, probably hell of a lot longer, the way I want it, not what Apple wants, for about 1/3 the price they want.

[tweak]

5 minutes ago, webrunner5 said:

LoL, I figured you for some kind of strange person that would use a Apple computer. No wonder yo have a 5D3!!   Well I must admit I have a iPhone 6s plus sad to say at times. Apple computers, well no way in hell LoL. I am retired, not Donald Trump!

Apple phones suck way harder than apple computers... still it's a decent battle none the less. I've always used Apple, I got angry recently with how crap they are going now and thought about switching systems, used Windows again and asked myself what the hell I was thinking. Resolve 14 with MLVFS is great for my uses.

If you were Donald Trump you wouldn't know how to edit a video so which system you have would be mere semantics. 

[webrunner5]

2 minutes ago, tweak said:

Apple phones suck way harder than apple computers... still it's a decent battle none the less. I've always used Apple, I got angry recently with how crap they are going now and thought about switching systems, used Windows again and asked myself what the hell I was thinking. Resolve 14 with MLVFS is great for my uses.

If you were Donald Trump you wouldn't know how to edit a video so which system you have would be mere semantics at such point. 

True, very true.

I ONLY have a Apple phone so I can use Facetime with my Kids, Grand Kids, Friends. Other than that they can stick it up, well Cook's ass.

[Emanuel]

37 minutes ago, squig said:

"The GH5 needed like 12 nodes" Call me practical, but I'd rather jump in front of a bus.

Anthony, c'mon... And what about 5D3 ML RAW?? This has stopped anyone to shoot 5-star outcome? ;-)

[j.f.r.]

The fact few people if any can tell the difference lets us know all we have too.......

 

Both cameras look great and if most people here cannot tell the difference, 99.9% of the audience will not be able too either......

 

Go and create the project you've always wanted, the camera is no longer an excuse /

 

[hyalinejim]

1 hour ago, AaronChicago said:

@hyalinejim Great job with making the Panasonic reds less orange and ACTUAL red.

 

 

Good to hear Aaron! It's real knife edge stuff trying to spread out hues that are compressed, and to compress hues that are spread out - especially with a low contrast, low saturation profile like VLog. Sometimes an additional correction is needed on top of the lut, nudging an individual hue one way or the other. But you're right. Reds from the GH5 are almost always quite orange.

One caveat with the lut is that sometimes reds will become quite oversaturated. This works well for getting nice skintones, but if you have bright red clothing or a traffic sign it can get overblown. Pulling back on the red saturation helps in this scenario.

[Emanuel]

3 hours ago, mercer said:

Again not trying to be contrary, but I'm not so sure about that either. The 5D3 is a professional stills camera and more than enough, even with its factory firmware, for wedding videos. The Canon badge also still pulls a lot of weight in the industry, I assume. But before I say any more and get castrated here, the GH5 is the best camera ever invented and the only option for any level of filmmaker and all other camera companies should stop making cameras...?

Anyway, my original point is this... the author disliking Panasonic color and having to create a workaround to make it look like Canon color is more a testament to his abilities than it is a plus for the GH5.

LOL Glenn... Nothing wrong to make the greenish Panasonic to look like the redish Canon. This means choices :-)

Just now, Emanuel said:

This means choices :-)

[webrunner5]

11 minutes ago, Emanuel said:

LOL Glenn... Nothing wrong to make the greenish Panasonic to look like the redish Canon. This means choices :-)

YIKES!

[Emanuel]

Just now, webrunner5 said:

YIKES!

LOL ;-)

[hyalinejim]

7 hours ago, webrunner5 said:

I like the second set on all of them better. If that is the GH5

Yes, the GH5 is second.

 

15 hours ago, squig said:

I can stretch the DNGs a lot more and get more latitude from them.

For sure, the 5D files have much more malleability than 10bit VLog. You can really go to town on Magic Lantern RAW - it's a much thicker file. It's almost pristine (except for ugly shadow noise).

 

5 hours ago, mercer said:

my original point is this... the author disliking Panasonic color and having to create a workaround to make it look like Canon color is more a testament to his abilities than it is a plus for the GH5.

But I think that it is actually a testament to the GH5 that I can do that. And what I've presented here is only the realisation of my preferences. The point that I want to make is that the 10bit 422 files are robust enough to undergo a fair bit of colour correction / grading. To me, the VLog coming from the camera is a "raw" material with massive potential, as the (properly) RAW footage from the 5D3 is a beginning, and not an end in itself. In the main GH5 thread you mentioned that there was a range of quality in the posted videos for the GH5, from video-ish to something more satisfactory. Believe me, if Magic Lantern RAW was accessible to the same kinds of users - and in the same numbers - as the GH5, you'd see a hell of a lot of bad 5D3 ML videos.

 

6 hours ago, deezid said:

already created some presets and luts, so Panasonic's color science is no big issue anymore

Exactly. You need 12 nodes or 20 minutes work to match this with that. But when the groundwork is done, you're in business. Today I made a nice lut that combines the Canon-like colour with a Lightroom film emulation preset. I loaded this into the camera as a monitoring lut and exposed until it looked good in the viewfinder. Came back and slapped the lut on and each shot was perfect. It took as long as it does to Ctrl+C and Ctrl+V.... with maybe a small WB and curves adjustment beforehand This is the look that I'm into at the moment. In a year's time I might be into something different.

 

3 hours ago, j.f.r. said:

Go and create the project you've always wanted, the camera is no longer an excuse /

 

Big time!

 

[Emanuel]

Winner LUT and shooter! :-)

[squig]

3 hours ago, Emanuel said:

Anthony, c'mon... And what about 5D3 ML RAW?? This has stopped anyone to shoot 5-star outcome? ;-)

I'd shoot with a D90 if I had to.

[Fritz Pierre]

52 minutes ago, hyalinejim said:

But I think that it is actually a testament to the GH5 that I can do that. And what I've presented here is only the realisation of my preferences. The point that I want to make is that the 10bit 422 files are robust enough to undergo a fair bit of colour correction / grading. To me, the VLog coming from the camera is a "raw" material with massive potential, as the (properly) RAW footage from the 5D3 is a beginning, and not an end in itself. In the main GH5 thread you mentioned that there was a range of quality in the posted videos for the GH5, from video-ish to something more satisfactory. Believe me, if Magic Lantern RAW was accessible to the same kinds of users - and in the same numbers - as the GH5, you'd see a hell of a lot of bad 5D3 ML videos.

Great job with matching these two cameras...for those preaching the 5D as the holy grail...it's your opinion...nothing but subjectivity there...I remember one critisism of the GH5 being that you can actually match it with the 5D...or have to...lol....well only if that's what you're looking for...I prefer Panasonics image over Canon...what does that mean?...NOTHING....to be exact...just my taste...my preference...just like yours....and it holds the same weight...if the 5D is the image you're loving....happy for you...as I'm happy with my Panny cameras....

[mercer]

1 hour ago, hyalinejim said:

But I think that it is actually a testament to the GH5 that I can do that. And what I've presented here is only the realisation of my preferences. The point that I want to make is that the 10bit 422 files are robust enough to undergo a fair bit of colour correction / grading. To me, the VLog coming from the camera is a "raw" material with massive potential, as the (properly) RAW footage from the 5D3 is a beginning, and not an end in itself. In the main GH5 thread you mentioned that there was a range of quality in the posted videos for the GH5, from video-ish to something more satisfactory. Believe me, if Magic Lantern RAW was accessible to the same kinds of users - and in the same numbers - as the GH5, you'd see a hell of a lot of bad 5D3 ML videos.

I am not here to knock the GH5, as I don't own one and cannot speak first hand about its quality. I may still purchase a GH5 someday. I cannot deny its allure. I have seen some insanely great work from it, yours included. The motorcycle video that Emmanuel posted the other day is also some of the nicest video I've seen from it, but there seemed to be a growing consensus, based on your labor, that the GH5 is better than a 5D3 with ML Raw and I believe they misconstrued the point of your work here. Or maybe I did. Either way, nice job. And food for thought. 

[webrunner5]

3 hours ago, Emanuel said:

Winner LUT and shooter! :-)

Winner Winner Chicken Dinner.

[deezid]

4 hours ago, hyalinejim said:

Exactly. You need 12 nodes or 20 minutes work to match this with that. But when the groundwork is done, you're in business. Today I made a nice lut that combines the Canon-like colour with a Lightroom film emulation preset. I loaded this into the camera as a monitoring lut and exposed until it looked good in the viewfinder. Came back and slapped the lut on and each shot was perfect. It took as long as it does to Ctrl+C and Ctrl+V.... with maybe a small WB and curves adjustment beforehand This is the look that I'm into at the moment. In a year's time I might be into something different.

Amazing work. If Panansonic would just give us an option to bake in our Luts... Record -> Edit -> Done, lol

[webrunner5]

I think whats been made aware on this threads  that both of these cameras, hell ANY video camera, can be molded into what You want it to look like. There are LuTs for everything in this day and age, and guess what you can even make your own.

No 2 people I think ever see the same thing in reality exactly the same. I know women see a lot different than men do, colors wise they say, even on a lot of things not related to Video!!

So I guess that is why there is so many video camera makers, with so many different cameras. But this still proves the old saying, you have to go out and shoot, shoot, shoot, to get good at it, and with both of these cameras being new in a sense it will take time to learn them.

I think I have learned something here, and that is we all have different needs wants, and desires. And that is what makes life interesting. And nobody got in a fist fight.  Now that is how great this Forum is. Well done.

Wow hyalinejim that is a impressive looking Stadium next to the Landsdown Tennis Club. Soccer maybe??