Magic Lantern Raw Video

[kidzrevil]

@kye you are spot on ! In the end its definitely about the end result because you can get awesome images out of LUTs. I love using LUTs for quick grades and tetrahedral interpolation does an amazing job of improving the rendering of any LUT. Still these days I trust the floating point operation of RCM or ACES because of how it handles the image. My end results are always better

[Don Kotlos]

Here is another unique use of ML

https://petapixel.com/2018/04/10/this-short-film-was-shot-at-2520mm/

 

[kidzrevil]

@Don Kotlos wow

[Neufeldt]

That London footage is incredible.

[hmcindie]

Damn that London footage = socks blown.

Here's a recent fight choreo test we did with the 5d raw at 60p with one shot with the rx10ii.

 

 

[mercer]

2 hours ago, hmcindie said:

Damn that London footage = socks blown.

Here's a recent fight choreo test we did with the 5d raw at 60p with one shot with the rx10ii.

 

 

So cool. Did you shoot with the regular build for your 60p? And which shot was RX10ii... I couldn’t pick it out at first glance on my phone. 

[kaylee]

7 hours ago, mercer said:

Did you shoot with the regular build for your 60p?

yeah, how do i do 60p?? ?

also: guys i got verified on this site by a former member who has been bullied a lot so he doesnt want to reveal himself but pm me if u wanna do it. the western union fees killed me but it was sooo worth it

[Nikkor]

There is circulating new hack called Enchanted Lamp EL, it enables 4K @ 120 on the 5d mkiii 

PM me if you are interested, no PayPal accepted

[hmcindie]

On 21/04/2018 at 3:42 AM, mercer said:

So cool. Did you shoot with the regular build for your 60p? And which shot was RX10ii... I couldn’t pick it out at first glance on my phone. 

I shot with the experimental build 1920x6xx 14bit compressed at 60p. Rx10 is the wide slowmo flip (aerial at 250fps) at the end.

[Stathman]

Looks like ML for 80D is just around the corner.

First 1080p 14bit DNG sample in post #291.

https://www.magiclantern.fm/forum/index.php?topic=17360.msg200539#new

[Drew Allegre]

Anyone have experience with this error??

5D3 1.2.3 4K Crop build

When I try to load raw modules I get:
"Linking...

tcc:error: undefined symbol 'lossless_decompress_raw'

    [E] filed to link modules"

Regular nightly build works with no issues.  I've tried clearing the card, formatting, reinstalling.  Can't figure it out.  Posted on the ML forums, but it's been 6 days and my post is still sitting there waiting on approval from a mod.  

 

[kye]

The recent announcement of the BMPCC 4K has prompted me to do a lot of thinking about cameras in general and what features are useful etc, and I've realised that ML RAW has a killer feature that seems to be relatively unique - the 3x Crop mode.

Is anyone else finding the crop mode to be a big differentiator against other cameras?

It turns my Sigma 18-35 on my 700D into a 29-56mm and 87-168mm lens, which combined with the fact it switches with only a single menu option change, and doesn't require the purchase / carrying / changing of additional lenses, makes it a hugely competitive feature IMHO.  I know this is only in ~1080 and not 4K, but the fact it's RAW goes somewhat to making up for this when compared to cameras that compress their 4K output.

I suppose with something like the BMPCC 4K you could just record RAW and then crop in post, but you'd be throwing away a lot of data in post.

In theory, a 32MP (or above) sensor can have a 2x (or more if greater than 32MP) crop and still have enough pixels for 4K.  It would be great if someone used a 50MP sensor and had a 4K pixel binning mode for the full sensor, and then a 2.5x crop mode for a 1:1 pixel 4K mode, but I suppose all the manufacturers would rather sell you more lenses than add the flexibility.

 

[kaylee]

good point.

i have to play around with crop mode, havent really done so. any disadvantages/pitfalls to watch out for? id imagine camera shake is more noticeable...?

[kye]

12 minutes ago, kaylee said:

good point.

i have to play around with crop mode, havent really done so. any disadvantages/pitfalls to watch out for? id imagine camera shake is more noticeable...?

Camera shake is a lot more noticeable for sure.  I don't know of any other issues with it but I haven't used it much yet so YMMV.

I doubt it's relevant to most people, but be aware that changing the resolution also changes the crop factor, but this is true in either crop or normal mode.

[kye]

One thing that you might watch out for is the resolution if you're planning on switching in and out of crop mode.  With my 700D I found it has different resolutions available in crop mode vs normal mode, and when I set the resolution in one mode it was within the writing speed of my card, but then when I swapped crop modes it was over what I could write continuously.  

It seems to be that you can "choose" a resolution that's greater than what the camera can do and ML then uses the closest possible mode, which I found was different in crop vs non-crop modes.

If you're taking lots of time between shots or if you're not maxing out your cards write speed then you're fine, although I'm not sure what people do when they can't shoot in the resolution they're outputting in.  With the 700D I'm shooting in something like ~1700 pixels wide and outputting in 1920 wide so perhaps slight changes in resolution don't matter as much because I'll be scaling up anyway, but your situation might be different.  Downscaling is probably fine too.

In terms of crop mode being a Killer Feature it might sway me into buying a 5DIII in order to have it.

My camera options are currently:
The first option is the XC10 which I already own, which has high bitrate 4K video, a long zoom, great ergonomics and battery life, good image stabilisation, but doesn't do shallow depth of field.
The second option is the 700D with Sigma 18-35 f1.8 that I also already own, which has RAW in ~1700 pixels wide (possibly more with the SD controller hack), with crop mode it is reasonably long zoom range, does shallow depth of field spectacularly well, but doesn't have as good ergonomics and has no image stabilisation.

My alternatives to the above are that I could sell them and get a BMPCC 4K, 5DIII or 80D with ML, A7III, or whatever else has been released by the end of the year.  I'm in Italy for a month later in the year and was planning on taking the XC10 and 700D so will be able to put them both through their guerrilla film-making paces and really get to know them both.  I've shot a few trips with the XC10 (maybe 20 days filming total) and it feels familiar and comfortable in the hand, but haven't used the 700D / ML in the wild yet.
Considering that I'd basically have to sell everything and start again with a new camera & lens system for most of the above it's not a decision I'll be making quickly or without proper testing and evaluation.

[Deadcode]

2 hours ago, kye said:

One thing that you might watch out for is the resolution if you're planning on switching in and out of crop mode.  With my 700D I found it has different resolutions available in crop mode vs normal mode, and when I set the resolution in one mode it was within the writing speed of my card, but then when I swapped crop modes it was over what I could write continuously.  

2496x1080 is the max rez in crop with 700D, with 3,34x crop factor according to ml raw calculator With new hacks, you can go higher.

It seems to be that you can "choose" a resolution that's greater than what the camera can do and ML then uses the closest possible mode, which I found was different in crop vs non-crop modes.

If you're taking lots of time between shots or if you're not maxing out your cards write speed then you're fine, although I'm not sure what people do when they can't shoot in the resolution they're outputting in.  With the 700D I'm shooting in something like ~1700 pixels wide and outputting in 1920 wide so perhaps slight changes in resolution don't matter as much because I'll be scaling up anyway, but your situation might be different.  Downscaling is probably fine too.

Crop factor changes in both crop mode and full sensor mode too. Just like the amount of captured detail

In terms of crop mode being a Killer Feature it might sway me into buying a 5DIII in order to have it.

3.5K resolution is only available in crop mode but you can do it with 700D too with the experimental builds

The second option is the 700D with Sigma 18-35 f1.8 that I also already own, which has RAW in ~1700 pixels wide (possibly more with the SD controller hack), with crop mode it is reasonably long zoom range, does shallow depth of field spectacularly well, but doesn't have as good ergonomics and has no image stabilisation.

With 10 bit, compression, and SD controller hack you can record in the highest resolution almost every time

My alternatives to the above are that I could sell them and get a BMPCC 4K, 5DIII or 80D with ML, A7III, or whatever else has been released by the end of the year.  I'm in Italy for a month later in the year and was planning on taking the XC10 and 700D so will be able to put them both through their guerrilla film-making paces and really get to know them both.  I've shot a few trips with the XC10 (maybe 20 days filming total) and it feels familiar and comfortable in the hand, but haven't used the 700D / ML in the wild yet.
Considering that I'd basically have to sell everything and start again with a new camera & lens system for most of the above it's not a decision I'll be making quickly or without proper testing and evaluation.

BMPCC4K will be available as early as the september of 2018. 5D III is a good choice but you can do "almost the same" with the 700D. 80D cant do ML right now. A7 III is pricey compared to others, and can not record in raw.

 

[kye]

4 minutes ago, Deadcode said:

2496x1080 is the max rez in crop with 700D, with 3,34x crop factor according to ml raw calculator With new hacks, you can go higher.

3.5K resolution is only available in crop mode but you can do it with 700D too with the experimental builds

I think mine won't let me select above the ~1700 pixel wide, even in crop mode.

I'm using the "magiclantern-crop_rec_4k.2018Mar10.700D115.zip" - is this the right version to get the extra resolution?

TBH the different builds and lack of documentation is really confusing..

4 minutes ago, Deadcode said:

With 10 bit, compression, and SD controller hack you can record in the highest resolution almost every time

I've been watching the SD controller hack thread as people get good results and occasionally someone kills a card and waiting for it to be stable enough to start using.  I'm not sure how long it will be until it gets added to the crop_rec branch?

4 minutes ago, Deadcode said:

BMPCC4K will be available as early as the september of 2018. 5D III is a good choice but you can do "almost the same" with the 700D. 80D cant do ML right now. A7 III is pricey compared to others, and can not record in raw.

I mentioned the 80D as I noticed that Alex (who I believe is developing the 700D crop_rec port) appears to have paused posting in the 700D thread but is active in the 80D thread.  I did also note that they're not even up to the point of ML loading, but the thread certainly indicates that people are looking at it.  Considering it's got DPAF, is reasonably priced, and (if the comment in the thread is correct) it has 80MB/s write speeds, it would be a great camera body to have ML on.

I realise that the A7III can't do RAW (which isn't that important to me - I'm happy with either RAW 1080 or high-bitrate 4K) and that it's expensive - especially with the Sony lenses!, but I'd still look at it as it gives a huge low light performance boost from both my XC10 and the 700D.  In a way it should also "just work" which I get the impression that ML is still a fair way away from.

[Deadcode]

3 minutes ago, kye said:

I think mine won't let me select above the ~1700 pixel wide, even in crop mode.

I'm using the "magiclantern-crop_rec_4k.2018Mar10.700D115.zip" - is this the right version to get the extra resolution?

You have to add the module manually from the experimental page

TBH the different builds and lack of documentation is really confusing..

Yup, in the old times everything was well documented, now you have to dive deep in forums..

I've been watching the SD controller hack thread as people get good results and occasionally someone kills a card and waiting for it to be stable enough to start using.  I'm not sure how long it will be until it gets added to the crop_rec branch?

Just use the experimental version with "safe settings" which is already tested by others

I mentioned the 80D as I noticed that Alex (who I believe is developing the 700D crop_rec port) appears to have paused posting in the 700D thread but is active in the 80D thread.  I did also note that they're not even up to the point of ML loading, but the thread certainly indicates that people are looking at it.  Considering it's got DPAF, is reasonably priced, and (if the comment in the thread is correct) it has 80MB/s write speeds, it would be a great camera body to have ML on.

80D could be an awesome camera for ML RAW, i hope they will make it. Because if they do, 5D4 hack could be possible... (same Digic processor?)

 

 

[kye]

9 minutes ago, Deadcode said:

You have to add the module manually from the experimental page

Just use the experimental version with "safe settings" which is already tested by others

I assume you're referencing "90a58a5 lossless: experimental resolution overriding that should cover all DIGIC 5 models (to be tested)" ?

I am yet to add modules manually, so that's another learning curve I'm yet to ascend.  Considering that the crop_rec_4k is called "bleeding edge", and then we're talking about adding modules, and especially modules that say "to be tested" in the description...  I feel like we've run out of words for how many disclaimers should be applied!!

[Deadcode]

11 minutes ago, kye said:

I assume you're referencing "90a58a5 lossless: experimental resolution overriding that should cover all DIGIC 5 models (to be tested)" ?

I am yet to add modules manually, so that's another learning curve I'm yet to ascend.  Considering that the crop_rec_4k is called "bleeding edge", and then we're talking about adding modules, and especially modules that say "to be tested" in the description...  I feel like we've run out of words for how many disclaimers should be applied!!

Most of your questions has been already answered in the crop_rec on steroids thread

After you read the whole thread you will be crop rec recording master :D. It's heavy stuff.