Fuji X-H1. IBIS, Phase Detect 4K beast?

[Emanuel]

Indeed, I believe we should cultivate here polygamy, healthy attitude to have with cameras... :-)

[Kisaha]

@Django I have no horses in this race, but GH5 is a video orientated hybrid camera, while the GH5s is a video camera disguised as a hybrid camera, and like the A7s series, only a few (there is one here in this forum!) will use it mainly as a photographic tool. My impression is that the X-H1 is a hybrid camera, with advanced video capabilities, for a Fuji. I do not see a lot of people from the Sony, Panasonic, Samsung (yes, us!) camp to change to Fuji because of this camera. Some will; most, definitely not. 

Every new camera is good for the overall competition between manufacturers, that is good for us, potential customers and users. We need as many as possible!

It is definitely impressive that the Fuji is so high, but there is the rest of the world to account for, and the rest of the world, in more than one senses, is a lot bigger than the U.S market. You are a bit unfair to the GH5 also, because it is a 1 year old camera, and I am sure it was pretty high on those charts when new, actually, in my European country, the camera was back ordered until the end of May, beginning of June, because Panasonic couldn't cover the pre orders. Even the XLR thingy wasn't available until later in summer (or was it September?). 

From your chart, very interesting things also are that a very expensive A7rIII is at #4, and Panasonic G7 are #6 and #7! 

Thankfully there is a right tool for everyone these days.

[Django]

@Kisaha i wasn't referring the GH5 as low ranking but the GH5S (currently at #59) as it is also a recently announced flagship camera. the GH5 is doing good of course (#18) as are other "older" cameras and low budget ones too. here is the link (rankings get updated hourly): https://www.amazon.com/Best-Sellers-Electronics-Mirrorless-Cameras/zgbs/electronics/3109924011#1 

of course it's to be taken with a grain of salt as it only represents sales from a single outlet/region yet i was surprised to find the H1 ranking so high up considering it's not even released. i think Fuji has struck a really good price/feature/design ratio.

 

@anonim .. it's kind of obvious a flame war gets started when people from various competing systems step in just to berate a camera/system. it's happened here, trust me. as an outsider though this may give you several perspectives as there is no perfect camera for everyone.

 

[mechanicalEYE]

I like GAP athletic fit jeans, and I just cant wrap my head around how anyone would think GAP loose fit jeans are any good.

 

[jonpais]

@Django So suddenly it’s a crime to so much as suggest that  Fuji might have made better use of the LCD screen real estate; to ask whether Fuji might have been able to come up with a larger battery and include a headphone jack like Sony rather than requiring the purchase of a bulky and costly battery grip; to question the decision not to allow recording to both SD cards simultaneously; to encourage photographers to think about whether an aperture ring is really more efficient than a thumbwheel; to point out the half dozen or more bugs in the pre-production units; to remind readers that it took six months before a firmware update addressing the eye sensor bug of the X-T2 was issued; to speculate whether there was enough space for a full HDMI port rather than a micro HDMI; to expect a higher resolution LCD in a flagship camera; to alert filmmakers of the absence of zebras and a remote app that cannot record at a higher resolution than 720p; and so on. 

[Django]

@jonpais a crime no. but stating the above repeatedly over & over is excessive and reeks of negative bias. you've made these points clear pages ago, why not give it a rest and move on? camera clearly isn't for you.. me personally none of what you list there is even close to being a deal breaker and aperture ring control (along the ISO/SS top dials) is what drew me to Fuji in the first place.. different strokes for different folks

[jonpais]

my comments are clearly not for you; why don’t you move on?

[Matthew Hartman]

4 hours ago, Tim Sewell said:

This thread's going on longer and proving more divisive than bloody Brexit!

Despite several attempts at peace, humor, relating, conceding.

I just had a fucking talk with my 13 year old child about a contingency plan if someone comes into his school and starts shooting it up. He is scared as hell. Can you blame him?

This is not a conversation a parent living in 2018 in the U.S. should be having with their child, and then you have otherwise sensible people here getting worked up over a stupid object, that has a tiny bit less of this, or a tiny bit more of this. Really? 

This thread needed some perspective a long time ago. 

[anonim]

6 hours ago, Matthew Hartman said:

This is not a conversation a parent living in 2018 in the U.S. should be having with their child

Obviously not, or it shouldn't be, but it is so call reality.

Personally, I'm very interested, because for me it highly, as psychological pattern of human nature (especially in technically superior and most influential side of world), explain some more serious troubles or suffering around the world - also indifference toward these troubles. So, maybe it's not bad idea as add-alternative educational course to your son, to join to thread like this: he can learn very much - because:

@Django

When answer to all, by @jonpais sumarized, totally relevant comparable weakness for me as potential buyer is - all of that are "peanuts", what does it mean?

When Andrew Reid, as some other tests (XH1 vs Sony 7RIII), indicate that flog is comparatively very prone to banding, and answer is, approximately "Could you look better, you have to be wrong" - what does it mean?

When someone (one of devoted user of Fuji) immediately after my involving in this thread wrote me PM claiming that I'm Jon Pais's "buddy" (although I live 5000km far away from him, with life background that couldn't be more different and bombing experience with American brutal colonial policy) and as benefit disclose me how Jon is in fact immoral - what has to be my answer?

When someone in PM warns me to shut up, otherwise that someone also will react otherwise - how I have to feel at your opinion?

My sadly answer, being also sadly suggestion to @Matthew Hartman's son is: not retreat, not give ground when somebody shout out trying to scare you - because, if you not thwart him, tomorrow the same person will beat you, or scaring some other men, than finally shoot at you.

I have simply motive here: I want to sell my GH5 because I can return my money after several jobs (I always buy secondhand or in the gray market) and I'm interesting in better newer solutions, and I waited that Fuji system include IBIS in offering. GH5s deeply disappointed me asking real 800$ more (market buying price) rushing to keep attention, not knowing how to resolve IBIS problem with new sensor, offering better ISO3200 usability and mostly software solution to mostly gimickly higher ISO values. Fuji X-H1 has all comparative weaknesses that Jon summarized, year after GH5 and also with 500-600$ higher buyers price (with grip). Actually, I'm very unsatisfied that for me it seems the best to keep GH5 and lose money some months later.

If you extensively explain your point of view and with arguments questioned some weakness for the benefit all of us, and if someone's answer to that is quasi-threatening PM, or "rubish", or "peanuts" or "fan boy" or "are you disfunctionally blind, look that image OOC" - don't expect that I will withdraw. Matter of principle, training to stay fit in more severe , but formally similar, circumstances that scare lovely Matthew's son. (Unfortunately, in my life I had to learned this lesson overmuch.) Finally, here I can read and maybe little bit exercise and make better my broken English So, frankly, thank you guys of native English for tolerant patience to my ackwardness...

 

[Mattias Burling]

The post about threatening PMs is directed to me and is a lie. His English just isn't good enough to understand what was being said. If I had known that it was that bad I would have used different wording. I have now pushed the ignore button on him so it won't happen again.

The only PMs that can be viewed as something even close to "threats" in my message box is from a moderators who didn't like the answer to a question they got.

Out.

[Emanuel]

This is going out of control, I see. First time ever I've heard about threats here or any other forum I frequent. I think this calls the intervention of moderation to use the conversation method to begin with in order to calm down and prevent the conflict escalation. Going higher if/when strictly necessary to also follow the respective understanding of the facts especially when there are visible communication barriers to comprehend people from different parts and much distinct linguistic backgrounds in the use of a 2nd language included. Diplomacy applies. I also believe Andrew as owner of this place will appreciate to know whatever is going on behind the curtains. We visit his home after all. This care is not only there. Begins here at first place. Where inflammatory replies -- insidious provocations to somehow quote someone else but requalifying the meaning should also stay away. To take position is one thing. To fracture another one. But then we are talking about something else, not cameras anymore. I'd suggest you might add print screens on that you claim. No need to post the whole dirty laundry not even the name of the user as you've paid the attention to. Only the threats. No more need to flame the hordes here. We could evaluate the whole thing much better. On the other hand, persuasive techniques handling the conflict usually work out more efficiently so this can refrain to become repeated experiences over again, even as example for the future.

PS: You beat me with your post, Mattias. Good from you to come here and drop your entry to clarify and tell from your angle once disclosed.

[anonim]

11 minutes ago, Mattias Burling said:

Out.

How many time you will be "Out", Mattias. Ok, I'm very sensible to any sign of threatening. So lets your PM to me that I didn't ask for public:

 

Mattias Burling / BACK STORY

"Hey, I have no intention of getting into some lame argument with why I don't take crap from fanboys. 
But regarding your quote of what I said to Jonpais. Just thought I let you know the backstory.

He went on a rant on some guy for filming some test shots of an asian lady.
That discussion led him to ask me a question to which I replied that I found it funny since test shots of asian ladies is something he also does a lot.

He then censured the conversation, deleted posts and started sending me PMs.
I then asked him to stop sending me PMs. I didn't even care about the censorship.
He then banned me from the forum and thats why he got canned as soon as Andrew saw it. I didn't even have to tell him. 

I have chosen to take the high road and not mention anything about it to him or anybody else. But when he kept pushing and tried to start a flame war I said what I did. Now I still intend to let the matter rest. But if you also keep pushing on this subject I will eventually have to let it out.

Just a heads up since he seems to be your buddy. The other stuff is ok. I stand behind my words to Kisha since he is a fanboy who has no respect for others opinions. He thinks this is a tech forum for crying out loud."

Than Anonim / ANSWER

"

Hi Mattias, first of all I'd like to say thanks for some of instructive presentations of yours - of course, about cameras and lenses - at your youtube channel.

No, I'm not at any sort of Jon Pais buddy - it sounds so funny, because I'm far far away from Vietnam and, I'd say, even more far away from complete Jon's life background as it looks to me from forum.

"But if you also keep pushing on this subject I will eventually have to let it out."

I hope that it is not some sort of threat or prescribing - language misunderstanding wise, 'cause English is not mine and your native one? Because, if it really has some trace of threat-intention, please not use it - it is enough that you imagine yourself to hear something like that and choose a way how to react... As you, of course, know very well, sharpness and reactiveness are not unique property of nobody...

I don't know Kisaha, am I wrong that at forum topics he is one of the extremely fond - and, as most of others, sometimes very enthusiastic  -  to NX1?

(All in all, about this concrete topic and your PM - I think that there's not any necessity to be too spicy, especially to you, because you are obviously smart man... I don't know what to say more.

Maybe, BTW, because you are publicly known for me, and contrary is not the case - to litlte bit present myself. I'm actually and mostly an novel-writer with some sort of reputation which is totally unimportant - Collected works etc. - but I also sometimes make documentaries and shorts - enjoying world of colors and images... And, regarding some of your concrete coments - I have done several scientific disertations, also two from Psychology which is one of mine formal-educational background But everything of that sort is, in fact, mostly boring as deeply melted in this consumers world that I can't whithstand...)

So, please - any grain of judging tone toward myself via PM is completely needless and useless.

Sincerely admiring you nice try-and-leave suggestions about photo/video stuff - I wish you also good weekned, and I hope - very soon, presentation of new Fuji acchievement."

 

SO - "But if you also keep pushing on this subject I will eventually have to let it out." - I feel as attempt of subtle threating.

I really don't ask anybody to disturb me with such disgusting message. If somebody have some problems with someone else, why I have to know it and believe secret messager?

[Inazuma]

This is possibly the most out of control thread I've ever seen in this forum.  

I think we should get a thread lock @Andrew Reid and start a new clean thread with just camera info and debate. 

[Mattias Burling]

10 minutes ago, anonim said:

How many time you will be "Out", Mattias. Ok, I'm very sensible to any sign of threatening. So lets your PM to me that I didn't ask for public:

I tried but you kept me in the conversation by claiming that I "threatened" you.
Why in gods name would you say that if you wanted me to leave the conversation?

All my message was about was trying not to further argue about something that lead to a devoted moderator getting canned. For the sake keeping things calm.
Im totally fine with you posting the messages. But now I have lost all respect for you.

I say I don't want to discuss this camera further until there are actual users in the thread. And try to stay away.
You answer by making a poll about how pathetic I am and saying I threatened you...
 
Honest question here, do you understand why that might bring me back to the thread?
Or don't you understand the question?
 

 

3 minutes ago, Inazuma said:

This is possibly the most out of control thread I've ever seen in this forum.  

I think we should get a thread lock @Andrew Reid and start a new clean thread with just camera info and debate. 

I believe you are right. I won't post anything in this thread again. But there are some things I wont let go unanswered.
Taking cheap shots to try and force someone back into a conversation just to say "how many times are you out".. nope, won't stand for that kind of crap. 

 

[anonim]

2 minutes ago, Mattias Burling said:

Why in gods name would you say that if you wanted me to leave the conversation?

If I want so, I'd say so.

 

2 minutes ago, Mattias Burling said:

 But now I have lost all respect for you.

Frankly, I'm not feel it bad. Your message disturb me and really don't deserve respect.

4 minutes ago, Mattias Burling said:

You answer by making a poll about how pathetic I am...

 

Yes, you announce to us such important thing that you going to Sunday holiday, after putting ingenious poll, leaving thread to whom...look in your own words.

8 minutes ago, Mattias Burling said:

Honest question here, do you understand why that might bring me back to the thread?
Or don't you understand the question?
 

 

 

[Mattias Burling]

10 minutes ago, anonim said:

Frankly, I'm not feel it bad. Your message disturb me and really don't deserve respect.

Im totally fine with that. And I see you avoided my question. Thats fine to, I don't need an answer.
Now, please, don't drag me into this conversation again. Because as some have pointed out, its so derailed it deserves to be locked. 
If I had known you would have been "threatened" by a PM I obviously wouldn't have sent it. 

Out (but I will jump right back in if someone tries to take a cheap shot. I hope I don't have to.)
 

[anonim]

I think I understand first. But I'm afraid it is not that, that  you like to, or can admit.

[Robin Billingham]

I quite like the slight cyan shift in the blue skies, almost like a touch of that orangy blue look you see a lot of but in a good way.

I think the Eterna profile with the extra dynamic range mode could be a great route to a pretty cinematic image for those with limited colour skill or less time (both me). I think having a great deal of the look baked in helps with the 8 bit too, i think its quite a unique feature for this camera.

Hope im not droning on too much. Just buzzing about having placed my pre order (never done that before)

[anonim]

7 minutes ago, Mattias Burling said:

Im totally fine with that. Now, please, don't drag me into this conversation again. Because as some have pointed out, its so derailed it deserves to be locked. 
If I had known you would have been "threatened" by a PM I obviously wouldn't have sent it. 

Out (but I will jump right back in if someone tries to take a cheap shot. I hope I don't have to.)
 

Matias, don't be such twofaced man - you have fully week to answer and said it was not slightly or more threatened words. It is obvious that you tried, even with PM to involved me in your conflict with someone else. Now you note someone's trying to involve you... To locked a thread is fastest way to clean your message with slandering content.

[Emanuel]

Let's moderate the tone of accusations addressed to each other, OK? I speak in general for everyone, myself included if/when necessary. Respect is good and keep the teeth in the right place. Ad hominem attacks only show weak arguments or the complete lack of them. Indirect invectives to inject and fuel the rupture don't help either. People are here to have fun and make friends, not the opposite!

:-)