Shell64 Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 3 hours ago, Patrick B. said: Oh wow. So all you lose is super HFR and CFAST? Looks like less DR too. Hmmm Pretty much. I think it has the gh4 sensor, so low light will be crap. But still one of the most capable and feature rich cameras for that price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newfoundmass Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 Eh, hard pass then. They really need work on their marketing. Keeping track of all the variants is confusing. I also don't think we needed a stripped down cinema camera with a five year old sensor, maybe that's just me though? It doesn't seem that much more advanced than the E1 that they ran a fire sale on a year ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shell64 Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 12 minutes ago, newfoundmass said: Eh, hard pass then. They really need work on their marketing. Keeping track of all the variants is confusing. I also don't think we needed a stripped down cinema camera with a five year old sensor, maybe that's just me though? It doesn't seem that much more advanced than the E1 that they ran a fire sale on a year ago. Feels like they took the e1 and swapped the processor for 10 bit lol. I hope the e1 gets a raw hack as it already got hacked for high bit rates on personalview.com. I wish I bought one of these at $250 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drm Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 2 hours ago, Shell64 said: I wish I bought one of these at $250 Hi @Shell64. If you are serious about buying an E1, I have two sitting in their boxes on a shelf in the other room. One has been taken out and sat on my desk a bit for testing, the other is still in the box. Let me know if you are interested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronFilm Posted August 1, 2019 Author Share Posted August 1, 2019 8 hours ago, newfoundmass said: Ah, I didn't see anything about raw shooting, just pro res, but that would make sense since, as it is, there's not much of a market for it given the Pocket 4K. Not everyone wants raw. I work on tonnes of sets, and I very very very rarely see raw used. (as in almost never, I can't recall the last time! I guess the last shoot I did with a RED? Although those are often highly compressed raw, not too different overall quality than someone shooting ProRes XQ etc) The Z Cam E2C is unique as there is NOTHING ELSE on the market which can do 4K 10bit internally for sub $1K webrunner5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronFilm Posted August 1, 2019 Author Share Posted August 1, 2019 8 hours ago, KnightsFan said: The E2C has a completely different sensor. The E2 is the GH5 sensor, is the E2C the GH4 sensor? (after all the E1 used the GH4 sensor as well, but without the 10bit internal recording) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thephoenix Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 https://www.newsshooter.com/2019/08/01/z-cam-e2c-worlds-smallest-interchangeable-lens-mount-4k-10-bit-color-cinema-camera-for-799/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newfoundmass Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 10 hours ago, IronFilm said: Not everyone wants raw. I work on tonnes of sets, and I very very very rarely see raw used. (as in almost never, I can't recall the last time! I guess the last shoot I did with a RED? Although those are often highly compressed raw, not too different overall quality than someone shooting ProRes XQ etc) The Z Cam E2C is unique as there is NOTHING ELSE on the market which can do 4K 10bit internally for sub $1K I get all that but I think I'd just get a used GH5 at that point, if only for the better sensor. Or the Pocke4K. Don't really see the advantage of this over those two, outside of it being a couple hundred dollars cheaper. But by the time you add an external monitor, mic, etc. you're in the same ballpark as the others really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightsFan Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 The e2c (and the e2, to some extent) has features aimed at live streaming. They have ethernet ports on the back, and the e2c even supports POE. Much simpler to stream with than any dslr or cinema camera. No accessories required. IronFilm, webrunner5 and andrgl 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drm Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 1 hour ago, KnightsFan said: The e2c (and the e2, to some extent) has features aimed at live streaming. They have ethernet ports on the back, and the e2c even supports POE. Much simpler to stream with than any dslr or cinema camera. No accessories required. I use the GH5, GH5s, & P4Ks to livestream (multicam) many times per week and have produced literally hundreds of episodes of content with them. I used to livestream with the JVC LS300s, until I sold them all, due to poor dynamic range and poor low light performance. I am admittedly biased as I get paid to do this professionally. You can live stream with all sorts of equipment, if you know what you are doing. You can even livestream with many of the action cams if you wanted to do so. I wonder how successful they will be if they intend the camera be used for live streaming. I suspect that low-end streamers will use their phones and people who are doing this more professionally will go right past this camera for something better. For example, a low-end streamer could use a Canon M50 + encoder and have about the same amount of money invested. (not apples-to-apples, but similar $) When I am selecting a camera to use on paying live broadcasts, a *lot* more goes into the decision that just the cost of the camera. I am certainly open to looking into the camera further. Perhaps it would be great for that purpose. For me, though, I think I would just purchase the regular E2 (which I believe also streams) to get the better image quality. KnightsFan 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shell64 Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 18 minutes ago, drm said: I use the GH5, GH5s, & P4Ks to livestream (multicam) many times per week and have produced literally hundreds of episodes of content with them. I used to livestream with the JVC LS300s, until I sold them all, due to poor dynamic range and poor low light performance. I am admittedly biased as I get paid to do this professionally. You can live stream with all sorts of equipment, if you know what you are doing. You can even livestream with many of the action cams if you wanted to do so. I wonder how successful they will be if they intend the camera be used for live streaming. I suspect that low-end streamers will use their phones and people who are doing this more professionally will go right past this camera for something better. For example, a low-end streamer could use a Canon M50 + encoder and have about the same amount of money invested. (not apples-to-apples, but similar $) When I am selecting a camera to use on paying live broadcasts, a *lot* more goes into the decision that just the cost of the camera. I am certainly open to looking into the camera further. Perhaps it would be great for that purpose. For me, though, I think I would just purchase the regular E2 (which I believe also streams) to get the better image quality. This camera reminds me of a RED or an older Blackmagic camera. You get drawn in by the amazing specs and the low price considering those specs but then you end up having to buy a bunch of accessories just to make the camera usable. Yes a used gh5 would be similar priced to the total amount of the e2c with accessories, but the gh5 is overall superior. Who wants to use a gh4 sensor in 2019? Not me! apparently I accidentally quoted the previous post. Whoops! Kisaha 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kisaha Posted August 1, 2019 Share Posted August 1, 2019 34 minutes ago, Shell64 said: Who wants to use a gh4 sensor in 2019? Not me! Not even in 2015, and the GH4 10bit was a joke. webrunner5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emanuel Posted August 9, 2019 Share Posted August 9, 2019 : -) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ntblowz Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 New Firmware released with ZRaw IronFilm 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kisaha Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 What's Zraw?! Another one, more tests, more decisions. Things have speed up quite considerably in video terms. Exciting times, and I do not want anyone to complain about it! Never we had so good video quality for so cheap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members BTM_Pix Posted August 13, 2019 Super Members Share Posted August 13, 2019 53 minutes ago, Kisaha said: What's Zraw?! The sort of announcement that makes RED's lawyers do this : Here is a very quick clip that someone has done with it presumably straight after downloading it judging by the timing. Kisaha 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kisaha Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 Do not know about IQ yet, I am going to have a rest for the next few days until the TV season starts next week (so I do not want to look at a bigger screen than my phone) but Z offers: ProRes/H.265/4K 160fps (it is good to have 120fps at least, I have only used 100/120fps twice!),240fps 1080p with no crop - no crop 1080p is a huge deal, still delivering and shoot 95% in 1080p, even though I am expecting more 4K for 2020, still a huge portion of my video projects will be 1080p. Just perfect to stick a NPF battery at the back, I really like the form factor and I am using the SmallHD Focus with every camera anyway, just can't stand 3-3.5" anymore and the Pocket needs an additional monitor, sadly. Nice aloy also, I am not a big fun of the plasticky Pocket. I also have those CF cards (actually 1) and now they have Zraw..if they drop a hundrend or 2 the next couple months they will be a no brainer.. Pocket has the color science and the free Resolve science, and 500-600€ less. Do they have a good servicing reputation in Europe at all? What do you do if you have a hardware problem? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick B. Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 I heard on the Facebook group they had to abandon Cineform raw so I’m wondering if this is uncompressed. Worried the workflow will be cumbersome having to transcode in their custom app. The prospect of smaller, easy to edit BRAW and ProRes RAW are more enticing to me at the moment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick B. Posted August 13, 2019 Share Posted August 13, 2019 Although they also just added custom LUTs with the new firmware which was the only other feature I really wanted that it was missing. Hmmmm IronFilm 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IronFilm Posted August 14, 2019 Author Share Posted August 14, 2019 14 hours ago, BTM_Pix said: The sort of announcement that makes RED's lawyers do this : RED lawyers are either fvcked or useless, or both: This guy is taking a sledgehammer to the RED company! Showing what a load of B.S. that they've built their entire company upon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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