Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera 4K

[JeremyDulac]

8 hours ago, drm said:

Thanks for sharing. I have had blown out skies like that recovered when using Highlight Recovery as well. Captain Hook said that Highlight Recovery should really have been called "Highlight Rebuild" because it rebuilds the highlights from the other channels when one of the channels is clipped. He also said that the recovered area is only black/white because they don't know what color to make the recovered areas. So really, we should avoid using Highlight Recovery if we are interested in getting the most accurate image. In your footage, I would much rather have some detail in the sky rather than having it blown out.

At ISO 400, at least the clipping point is a full 100%. At ISOs below 400, the clipping point is lower. As you increase the ISO up to 1000, the area above middle gray increases. So, your sky shot with ISO 1000 should have more detail than the sky shot at ISO 400. I don't think that I have a sky shot handy. Have you tried 400 vs. 1000 on this scene to see if there are noticeable differences?

Right, so I suppose the highlight recovery tool serves two functions? In un-clamping highlights a lower than 400 iso value as Gerald said, and also rebuilding detail in certain clipped situations, but not all.

Does it help to change iso in post to get more highlight detail, or does that only work when exposing? I will try it right now and share.

Update: I just tried it and it doesn't seem to make a difference - in fact I think there may be less detail it seems... which I am wondering if that is because it is not "real" detail and therefore doesn't interact the same with iso in terms of detail in the stops the same?

[alanpoiuyt]

Here's an example of Highlight Recovery on - off shot at ISO 1250. Note the outside blue chair cushion & foliage frame right and interior sun highlight next to interior planter.

 

[Kisaha]

Every week a different thing..whats going on with this camera?

I do not mind using an ext batt, and for the price I ll use a vND, but it seems there are a few dos and donts.

What you guyd think, and what are the things we have to be careful when shooting with one?

[Anaconda_]

I’ve been sticking pretty strictly to iso 400 and 3200 and controlling my exposure with a vnd and have absolutely zero problems. 

I think the thing with the highlight recovery is that you can now compare two different options. With a lot of other cameras, if the highlights are blown, tough luck. Now you can compare, so there’s one more thing to consider while shooting. It’s far from a problem and if anything, I see it as a bonus. Just like many things, don’t rely on it and have it as an emergency backup.

It’s like a ‘don’t worry we’ll fix it in post’ kind of thing. Thinking that way about audio, lights or any other aspect of film making is a bad idea, so why do it with video? 

[alanpoiuyt]

27 minutes ago, Kisaha said:

Every week a different thing..whats going on with this camera?

I do not mind using an ext batt, and for the price I ll use a vND, but it seems there are a few dos and donts.

What you guyd think, and what are the things we have to be careful when shooting with one?

Well I know I could never do this on my A7III or EOS R. Try to concentrate on the sky

 

[drm]

1 hour ago, alanpoiuyt said:

Well I know I could never do this on my A7III or EOS R. Try to concentrate on the sky

 

That is a dramatic difference in the sky. This is where I use highlight recovery (rebuild) too. It makes the camera seem like it has a greater dynamic range than advertised. Since the clouds are already white, it doesn't hurt much that we can't recover all of the color detail in those sections.

Scenes with that much dynamic range are problems for most cameras, particularly at the P4K price point. I think you would have to spend at least 5K to get close to enough range for this (perhaps VLog on the S1). Even the C200 is limited to about 3 usable stops of over exposure and it costs about 4 times as much as the P4K.

[mercer]

You’ll always get the best image shooting at the native iso with BM cameras... CDNG, Braw, or ProRes.

[The ghost of squig]

I shoot at either 400 or 3200 ISO and ETTR for the lowest noise. It's essential to overexpose by at least a stop and recover the highlights in post to minimise the blue sky macroblocking issue.

[Mattias Burling]

I always ETTR on the BMCC/BMPCC but not on the new BMPCC4K. I used the native ISOs and tried to get as close to the final exposure as I could in camera. With the new color science it's been a winning concept for me.

I still have never been able to create any type of "blue sky macro blocking", and I've owned two separate units.

[Emanuel]

Thanks @Mattias Burling for your input but why not ETTR exactly going on P4K...? Puzzles me... : ) CS is working there, no doubts, but as Anthony posted, you blow up your results if not address any eventual trouble there with ETTR as much as the earlier models : -)

[The ghost of squig]

1 hour ago, Mattias Burling said:

I always ETTR on the BMCC/BMPCC but not on the new BMPCC4K. I used the native ISOs and tried to get as close to the final exposure as I could in camera. With the new color science it's been a winning concept for me.

I still have never been able to create any type of "blue sky macro blocking", and I've owned two separate units.

Both CDNG units? Even compressed raw?

Exposing in the middle on my Braw unit, the macroblocking is clearly visible. Between 1 and 2 stops over you have to look hard for it but it's still there. It's there in ProRes too so it's not exclusively a Braw issue. BMD have been very quiet on this flaw, which is disappointing.

[Emanuel]

Buddy, you know why you've always been one of my fav posters for years if not longer than a decade now, wherever you are ; ) a breeze welcome to any users community again, thanks to you too @Andrew Reid : -)

[The ghost of squig]

19 minutes ago, Emanuel said:

Buddy, you know why you've always been one of my fav posters for years if not longer than a decade now, wherever you are ; ) a breeze welcome to any users community again, thanks to you too @Andrew Reid : -)

Thanks.

You get a punchier image with ETTR: more contrast and saturation, and less noise; but you'll get maximum latitude exposing in the middle @ 400 ISO, albeit with a bit more noise.

[Emanuel]

Indeed. The same difference we'll find out between ISO 1000 and 1250...

5 minutes ago, The ghost of squig said:

Thanks.

You get a punchier image with ETTR: more contrast and saturation, and less noise; but you'll get maximum latitude exposing in the middle @ 400 ISO, albeit with a bit more noise.

 

[The ghost of squig]

Just now, Emanuel said:

Indeed. The same difference we'll find out between ISO 1000 and 1250...

 

Not as dramatic. Best to light for 400 or 3200 for maximum latitude and lowest noise...

[Mattias Burling]

1 hour ago, Emanuel said:

Thanks @Mattias Burling for your input but why not ETTR exactly going on P4K...? Puzzles me... : ) CS is working there, no doubts, but as Anthony posted, you blow up your results if not address any eventual trouble there with ETTR as much as the earlier models : -)

Not exactly sure what you are trying to say, could you try to rephrase it?

1 hour ago, The ghost of squig said:

Both CDNG units? Even compressed raw?

Exposing in the middle on my Braw unit, the macroblocking is clearly visible. Between 1 and 2 stops over you have to look hard for it but it's still there. It's there in ProRes too so it's not exclusively a Braw issue. BMD have been very quiet on this flaw, which is disappointing.

I don't see it in Prores nor Braw. All is well in both the units I had.

34 minutes ago, The ghost of squig said:

Thanks.

You get a punchier image with ETTR: more contrast and saturation, and less noise; but you'll get maximum latitude exposing in the middle @ 400 ISO, albeit with a bit more noise.

I didn't ETTR on the BMPCC4K to get more punch and contrast and to combat the Sony-like colors 

[The ghost of squig]

11 minutes ago, Mattias Burling said:

I didn't ETTR on the BMPCC4K to get more punch and contrast and to combat the Sony-like colors 

?

12 minutes ago, Mattias Burling said:

I don't see it in Prores nor Braw. All is well in both the units I had.

Maybe your northern sky just isn't blue enough. ? Have you tried a polariser?

[Emanuel]

47 minutes ago, The ghost of squig said:

Not as dramatic. Best to light for 400 or 3200 for maximum latitude and lowest noise...

I find the gap between ISO 1000 and 1250 much of a surprise as far as noise concerns : -)

29 minutes ago, Mattias Burling said:

Not exactly sure what you are trying to say, could you try to rephrase it?

In short, why not also ETTR along the P4K as much as with the previous Blackmagic cameras?

 

...to combat the Sony-like colors...

Loved that one! : -)

[JordanWright]

I find the best results when I expose correctly with the Pocket 4k. I also almost always stay at 400.

[Emanuel]

13 minutes ago, JordanWright said:

I find the best results when I expose correctly with the Pocket 4k. I also almost always stay at 400.

It depends a lot on the situation. Not jack of all trades... ; -)