Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera 4K

[Don Kotlos]

11 minutes ago, Logan said:

3. I'm hoping you can use something like an Anker powercore through USB-C. I'd be satisfied with that plus a few LP-E6s.

I believe the USB-C can only be used to charge the LP-E6 while the camera is powered off. When the camera is powered on then the USB-C can only be used as an external storage and not power. 

[Logan]

3 minutes ago, Don Kotlos said:

I believe the USB-C can only be used to charge the LP-E6 while the camera is powered off.

I haven't seen that anywhere, is there a source?  BM site says you can charge via usb-c but nothing about the camera being on or off.

[Tone1k]

3 hours ago, markr041 said:

I am glad you are rooting for Blackmagic and their anticompetitive strategy to increase market share. Stick to shooting video, you do not have a clue about the welfare consequences of business strategies and competition. Bundling is well known as an anti-competitive practice that hurts consumers. In this case, there are other editors that can or will work with the video from the new camera (duh, you think other software companies do not want people to use their software with the new camera?), and we should have the choice of what editor we want. Note, again, I have Resolve Studio - so this is not anti the software. But, I and all others that bought the software already lose from this practice. And those who do not want to use Resolve also lose. Who wins? BM. The only thing you have right is that they are trying to boost sales of Resolve, at the expense of consumer welfare.

Anticompetitive? Haha, now I've read it all. Give people more than what they expect for a steal of a price and some will still complain. Get a grip. Sell the dongle on ebay or buy another 'more competitive' camera for just over a grand that does internal 4k 12bit RAW and 10 Bit ProRes at 60p etc. 

The only thing ant competitive about BM is that they have just blown the competition out of the water.

Argh, that's why I try to avoid forums like this. People always whinging!

[jonpais]

On 4/9/2018 at 4:29 PM, Nikkor said:

That's the ugliest thing I've seen in years, it looks like some digital camera prototype from the 90s.

 

 

[kaylee]

Petition to start a thread called Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera 4K Footage, for footage, if there ever is any

[jonpais]

I'm guessing it'll be one or two more months. At least, with the original Pocket, I believe it was a few months before release that John Brawley uploaded the first sample footage. But as always, i could be mistaken.

Not Pocket footage, but a comparison between the GH5 and the Ursa Mini Pro 4.6K is enlightening, if for nothing other than color science. Granted, Matthew's using Natural profile, 4K 60p, 100Mbps. And the crop is different between the two cameras. But it really makes me wish Panasonic would allow turning down sharpening and NR in the GH5.

 

[TwoScoops]

^ Reading the comments, URSA is on the right there. I actually prefer the GH5.

[Anaconda_]

Does anyone think you could use the USB C for something other than power and storage?

What about say an external sound card with as many xlrs as you like all recorded to a new audio track? That would be great for events or live music shoots.

What else could it be used for?

[dbp]

1 hour ago, TwoScoops said:

^ Reading the comments, URSA is on the right there. I actually prefer the GH5.

Same, assumed the URSA was the one of the left.

[Snuff]

I have recently got for my old Pocket a good power solution. It works more than 5 hours with this power bank powered by 5x hi quality 18650 batteries. You can also put it in a cell phone tripod mount to attach it to the camera. You need to get a LEMO connector to power a new BMPCC4K. 

1. Power Bank 5x18650 QD 185-TY ($20.8) https://www.dhgate.com/product/18650-power-bank-case-battery-holder-output/388633847.html

Size: 13cm* 8cm*2.0cm (5.1' x 3' x 0.8').

2. 5x VariCore New Original 18650 NCR18650B Rechargeable Li-ion battery 3.7V 3400mAh ($14.7) https://ru.aliexpress.com/item/4pcs-lot-2015-100-New-Original18650-3-7V-3400mah-NCR18650B-Lithium-Rechargeable-Battery-For-Panasonic-batteries/32433452171.html

3. Universal Cell Phone Tripod Mount ($3.9) https://ru.aliexpress.com/item/OOTDTY-Universal-Cell-Phone-Tripod-Mount-Clipper-Vertical-Bracket-Holder-360-Degree-Adjustable-4XFC-Drop-Ship/32833106727.html

3. 2 pin LEMO connector for BMPCC4K ($7.3) https://ru.aliexpress.com/item/LEMO-Connector-FGG-0B-2-3-4-5-6-7-9-Pin-Male-Connector-0B-FGG/32836029840.html

 

[SR]

14 hours ago, Logan said:

Honestly, at $1300...who cares. BM is trying to get more people into the resolve ecosystem and as others have said it isn't actually a cost for them at this point to include the software. 

Exactly. This camera could be priced at $2000 and it'd STILL be a steal.

[jonpais]

25 minutes ago, SR said:

Exactly. This camera could be priced at $2000 and it'd STILL be a steal.

Don't say that too loudly.  

But come on, not only have we not seen any footage yet, we've got no idea of the operability either.

I'm hoping for the best too, however...

[Axel]

We deserve a Brawley short film asap. Apart from that, I already preordered at my german seller. The worst things hat could happen are these two:

1. Because the sensor is just 4k, you will probably get some moire in 4k RAW, like with the old Pocket for HD. It will probably be perfect in ProRes UHD and RAW in 1080.

2. there might be infrared pollution because the sensor won't be coated against it. You were practically forced to stack two filters on top of every lens: IR-cut and Vari-ND.

[jonpais]

The pricing does seem unusual to me. This is like midrange consumer ILC territory, like the G85. When the original Pocket was released, it was selling for what, $995.00? And the GH3 retailed for $1,300.00 at the time I believe. So the Pocket was 30% less than the Panasonic. Now, the Pocket II is going up against the GH5s, so 50% less. And yet many think this is going to kill off not only the Lumix, but many of the lower end cinema cameras as well, at least for budget filmmaking. Before anyone goes off on me, I'm not knocking it, just thinking out loud.

[Snowfun]

8 minutes ago, jonpais said:

...Now, the Pocket II is going up against the GH5s...

I do wonder how many consumers in reality will actually find themselves thinking GH5/GH5s or Blackmagic (“who?”) Pocket 4k when making a camera purchase.

Yes, enthusiasts reading this and other fora might well have that debate but in the real world of consumer electronics I doubt whether the two cameras do compete. 

We might tend to highlight and compare similarities and features but for most people the two cameras are worlds apart?

[cantsin]

32 minutes ago, jonpais said:

Now, the Pocket II is going up against the GH5s, so 50% less. And yet many think this is going to kill off not only the Lumix, but many of the lower end cinema cameras as well, at least for budget filmmaking. Before anyone goes off on me, I'm not knocking it, just thinking out loud.

The Pocket 4K doesn't have AF, a flip/tilt display, an EVF, weather sealing, fanless operation, WIFI (including remote monitoring), will have only rudimentary still photography functions, and may require IR cut filters on the lens.

A lot of people who are now considering the Pocket 4K as an alternative to the GH5/s may find out that their shooting style is severely limited by these missing features. 

And, as @Snowfun wrote above, the two cameras aren't in the same market. You can't even buy a Blackmagic Camera at a normal photo camera retailer.

[sanveer]

44 minutes ago, jonpais said:

 

The pricing does seem unusual to me. This is like midrange consumer ILC territory, like the G85. When the original Pocket was released, it was selling for what, $995.00? And the GH3 retailed for $1,300.00 at the time I believe. So the Pocket was 30% less than the Panasonic. Now, the Pocket II is going up against the GH5s, so 50% less. And yet many think this is going to kill off not only the Lumix, but many of the lower end cinema cameras as well, at least for budget filmmaking. Before anyone goes off on me, I'm not knocking it, just thinking out loud.

 

I am repeating myself and re-interatinf what someone said in the forum already.

Blackmagic probably made great losses on the Ursa and other cameras. They were not prepared for losses in the Professional Filmmaking and Broadcast cameras. And they realised that their most successful product till date was probably the BMPCC. They also realised that 3D printing can produce materials as solid as steel or cement, and/or, found a Chinese manufacturer who knows the secret recipe for all the composites in the Boing 787 planes (like someone else mentioned here), which is way more durable than aviation grade aluminium. So they decided to create a camera that may literally put many other manufacturers out of business.

If in the meanwhile they think of charging another $199 and unlocking 10-bit 120fps at 4k, and 4-2-2 10-bit H.265, that would cause a gang war with Arri, Panny, Sony and RED hiring people to just bump off Grant. 

 

Btw the acquisition of eyeon Software and Fairlight (both hardqare and software) has made the Blackmagic Suite even better. It is actually a replacement for a lot more than just colour and grade.

It is good that the monopoly of the industry leaders is ending. 

[jonpais]

5 minutes ago, cantsin said:

The Pocket 4K doesn't have AF, a flip/tilt display, an EVF, weather sealing, fanless operation, WIFI (including remote monitoring), will have only rudimentary still photography functions, and may require IR cut filters on the lens.

A lot of people who are now considering the Pocket 4K as an alternative to the GH5/s may find out that their shooting style is severely limited by these missing features. 

And, as @Snowfun wrote above, the two cameras aren't in the same market. You can't even buy a Blackmagic Camera at a normal photo camera retailer.

All good points. As I said, just thinking out loud. First, super happy I can use my lenses on the camera without an adapter. If they used the same battery, that would have been the icing on the cake. I haven't preordered, but if I get the Pocket, I think I'd see this as a companion to my Panasonic cameras, not as a replacement. But who knows? 

[sanveer]

Actually it does seem to suggest having AF (even if it's as bad as the one on the GH5 and GH5s), and the Bluetooth is for monitoring. If it does monitoring well enough, one may not miss the articulating screen (and maybe use a phablet or tablet for monitoring instead). Bluetooth is far lower energy than WiFi, though the question is how well can it be used to actually control the camera. 

I guess more questions will keep getting answered as the actual product starts hitting shelves. 

 

[Axel]

Pocket and Lumix share something, but it's hard to say what it is exactly. I'd say the Pocket 4k in a way is like a minimalist GH5 or GH5S. The naive fallacy was to think the BM came cheaper. Without IS it definitely needs some kind of rig (imho the less the better). It needs stabilization more desperately than the HD Pocket, and it may be harder to operate on a gimbal (no CAF, the AF is just a function that sets focus once, but doesn't keep it during the shot). It also has no flip out screen, so an external monitor might be necessary (one has to see how good the display is). It doesn't stop there. After two or three month you make a list. And if you add all expenses you might find that you could as well have bought a GH5.