NAB 2018 - Kinefinity and Atlas Lens Co Orion Anamorphic

[jonpais]

Good nite.

[mercer]

3 hours ago, jonpais said:

My guess is you are making this all up; that you have some axe to grind; that you conveniently lost the business card and can’t even recall the name of this major distributor you supposedly spoke with. Because you are straight up calling Dan Kanes a liar and seem to think you know more than all the filmmakers who’ve handled these lenses and specialists like Tito. Why don’t you stop spreading malicious gossip? According to your tale,  you chatted it up with some anonymous person at NAB who just happens to be an authority on all things anamorphic; and not only that, you didn’t even trouble yourself to do any fact-checking. We get it already - you were disappointed in the build quality and feel the natural human desire to lash out at somebody. That's like totally understandable, man. But this isn't a rumors site. Maybe fb would be more appropriate. Better still, why don't you confront Dan Kanes face-to-face? Any coward can post shit on the internet.

Congratulations, you have just received my first downvote, and probably only downvote... something I swore I would never do because I really don’t find them productive and I believe they only create animosity... which is the exact opposite reason for visiting this forum.

But I honestly don’t know what to say about your recent posts, Jon? I’m thinking that maybe you have some personal issues going on in your life because you used to be one of the most friendly, jovial, and helpful members of this forum. But now you are full of such vitriol, and vindictive behavior. I sincerely apologize for bringing this up publicly, but this is getting out of hand now.

In this specific instance, you were asking DBounce for his review of the lenses, but then when you heard HIS honest impression, you went on full out attack mode... to the point of calling him a liar with ulterior motives?!?!

C’mon man it’s just camera stuff, it’s not worth having a stroke over. 

[tweak]

I can't be bothered reading all this cr@p, but anyone who repeatedly brings up a "rumour" with zero proof to it's existence, either has something against whatever it is, or is an idiot (possibly both). It's pretty childish  to perpetuate rumours, if you were ever on the receiving end of such a situation you would understand why.

[Julien416]

There was a topic about that rumour last year. Seems it was deleted by Jon who was a still moderator at the time. Because this rumour was disturbing I tried to retrace where it was coming from. A lot of the original messages involved got erased but here what supposedly happened from what I was able to gather online.

Last year on reduser forums, when the atlas Orion were announced, John Barlow from rectilux posted some mail exchanges between him and the guys behind Atlas that had taken place months before. They were asking John how much it would cost to rehouse shneider cinelux anamorphic projection lenses with a rectilux. The deal never got through but when Atlas showed their Orion lens, the lens signature was so close to a shneider cinelux coupled to a rectilux that a lot of people in the very small anamorphic world asked themselves if they had not done a rehousing with another partner, hence the barlow mail leaks.

The thing is that the technology Atlas used to focus its anamorphic group is called a variable diopter. The same exact method used by rectilux. However this very simple technology is widely used in the anamorphic world and doesn't belong to John Barlow. I am pretty sure the new cooke anamorphics use it, the iscorama also used it - it was even patented - and I know it was also used back in the 50's in some exotic french anamorphics. Let's say this clue is inconclusive.

Another thing to add is that it's highly unlikely to imagine Atlas buying all the cinelux online and rehousing them. 

But still. There were some messages between Barlow and the Atlas founder unless the former is lying. 

So what really happened ? My personnal opinion, which is absolutely not a fact, is that Atlas might have have been inspired by a cinelux / rectilux combination to built their prototype with a third party partner (let's say a chinese optics factory). But the housing is undisputably 100% atlas, glasses are also 100% cut from brand new optic glass. There is no way it's a rehousing. I bet the coating is a new formula as well. Remains the optic formula which is nothing new, as anamorphics is simple as it can be by today's standards.

The truth is we will never know. Everyone is inspired by other's people work so I have no problem living with the small possibility that Orion was inspired by cinelux lenses. It kinda looks the same but it looks great, and the housing looks genuinely good. It's certainly more expansive than buying a cinelux and a rectilux but you won't have to deal with fishy clamps ... Sure anamorphics cine lens are way too expansive but that's the way it is. High demand, etc. Fun fact : 6 or 7 years ago, a DOP I know bought a kowa anamorphics series for 5000€. You'd be lucky to get it under 50K nowadays... 

[DBounce]

2 hours ago, tweak said:

I can't be bothered reading all this cr@p, but anyone who repeatedly brings up a "rumour" with zero proof to it's existence, either has something against whatever it is, or is an idiot (possibly both). It's pretty childish  to perpetuate rumours, if you were ever on the receiving end of such a situation you would understand why.

I merely said that’s what I heard at the show. Had you read through “the crap “ you would have seen that I contacted the CEO of Atlas for clarification.

[tweak]

1 minute ago, DBounce said:

I merely said that’s what I heard at the show. I contacted the CEO of Atlas for clarification.

Oh in that case... perpetuate away!

[DBounce]

1 minute ago, tweak said:

Oh in that case... perpetuate away!

Like you’re doing? I dispelled the rumor with the emailed response from Dan at Atlas Lens Co. 

[tweak]

1 minute ago, DBounce said:

Like you’re doing? I dispelled the rumor with the emailed response from Dan at Atlas Lens Co. 

Sorry, I must have mistaken all your previous posts. Great job.

[Raafi Rivero]

... Anywayz.... I got to test the Atlas Orion 40mm on the Kinefinity Mavo. (am also the talent in a few shots since it was just a small number of us). Some of the shots are from another test the night before. I like performance of both lens and camera:

 

[DBounce]

44 minutes ago, Raafi Rivero said:

... Anywayz.... I got to test the Atlas Orion 40mm on the Kinefinity Mavo. (am also the talent in a few shots since it was just a small number of us). Some of the shots are from another test the night before. I like performance of both lens and camera:

 

Thanks for the video. I think yours is one of the first outside of the company. But honestly, everything looks cinematic in slow-mo... even an iPhone. Outside of music videos, the usefulness of slow-mo is limited. Why no normal speed video? I think that would really help to show how this camera and lens would feel for narrative work. Did you shoot anything at 24p? If so I would love to see it.

 

[Raafi Rivero]

About half the shots in that are 24p. And nearly every shot in the first 5.5mins (and more than half overall) in my Terra 4k review are regular motion. But you can judge parts of image quality based on a still frame. David Fincher shoots everything in slow-motion, btw, then delivers almost everything in regular speed just so has the option - so there's your utility.

I agree that the next hurdle is to use the cameras for narrative stuff. Working on something in that arena now. Stay tuned.

[jonpais]

4 hours ago, Raafi Rivero said:

... Anywayz.... I got to test the Atlas Orion 40mm on the Kinefinity Mavo. (am also the talent in a few shots since it was just a small number of us). Some of the shots are from another test the night before. I like performance of both lens and camera:

 

Thank you much, Raafi. This lens is gorgeous. The slo mo does not prevent me from seeing the beautiful saturated colors and insanely wonderful oval bokeh this lens is capable of (as well as how awesome the Mavo is going to be). Looks like you can get really close with that lens as well. Really appreciate your sharing this!

[zerocool22]

Yeah I am digging theses lenses(ecept the blue flare, which reminds me of slr magic). If I sell all my lenses and do some more jobs, I can afford one of them. a 50mm anamorphic should be pretty versatile.