The impact of 5D Mark III raw and what does Vincent Laforet think of it?

[MatthewP]

I think the muted response from pros is either one of two things:

 

1) the current status of the recording mode is written off as not particularly useful due to the current limit on recording time, and also the potential for dropped frames, which isn't very forward thinking as I'm sure these factors will improve over time.

 

or

 

2) they've been asked by Canon not to endorse the new hack in any way, as people are likely to follow the pro's opinions like sheep.

 

 

Just speculation. Useless. I'm going to sign off and do something productive now.

[MatthewP]

Not sure of the term for it, but when someone is moving horizontally, pixels
Appear and kind fizz behind them in their wake.
Thanks,
Tim

 

 

That's to do with h.264 encoding, rather than the RAW mode. Frames in RAW are unrelated to each other, so such an artifact inherently cannot exist in RAW, which is one of the reasons why it's so great.

 

Using StaxRip to encode the h.264 file would allow you to change the settings and ensure that such artifacts are reduced. (I may do a tutorial on this sometime).

[ScreensPro]

Better to stick to reporting about the great work ML are doing.

 

You are doing them a disservice by making this issue about you and the other bloggers.... Who cares if they have a different opinion than you or even what motivates them.

 

You are doing good work reporting and testing the ever changing ML advances. That's all we need.

[skyefootage]

Does anyone know – if one updates the 5D mkiii with Magic Lantern software can the camera still be setup to “old” Canon standard settings, or will it now only shoot RAW? Obviously, some project would be nice to shoot more than a few seconds per gig!

[Halycon]

Opinions aside...all I know is the Canon 5D MK3 I used yesterday (shooting in raw) was a huge, huge improvement on the 5D I was using the day before...

It is that much better!!! and I mean that much better...a great camera even greater by the guys at ML!

Out of interest, my testing yesterday took place in Singapore (a hot day even by Singapore standards) and I did not detect any noticeable heat issues. I admit they were short takes but to be honest the sort of shoots I do are mainly like that anyway.

So all the talk aside...if you already own a Canon 5D Mark III your world just got a whole better! Exciting times indeed!

Thanks again to the team at ML and to you as well Andrew...great work all round!

[kedbear]

Better to stick to reporting about the great work ML are doing.

 

You are doing them a disservice by making this issue about you and the other bloggers.... Who cares if they have a different opinion than you or even what motivates them.

 

You are doing good work reporting and testing the ever changing ML advances. That's all we need.

Couldn't agree more. Using this situation to, frankly, bitch is just not useful. It's just another big ego from the other side of the coin. This blog is great for dedicated testing and giving to the DSLR/low budget indie community, why smear it with this behaviour? Why make personal attacks? Honestly i don't think you'll look back on it and be proud of it, whereas you can be very proud of all the effort you've put into informing the indie community.

 

I remember a post a while back where Andrew turned his nose up at Shane Hurlbut's decision to use the C500 when he thought it shoud be the F55 etc for his new film, and suggested it was due to being sponsored by Canon. I mean that is an ego i'm sorry. Specs aren't everything. What if Mr Hurlbut chose the C500 because he and the director liked the IMAGE better for the particular look they were going for, and what if it was better in low light than other cameras? Turns out Mr Hurlbut did in fact test a wide variety of cameras including the F55 and F65 and had perfectly valid non conspiratorial reasons for not using them.

 

I mean come on, why act this way? Lets all be honest here. Andrew you're dedicated to the low budget indie market, and right now it's a great place to be with the ML hack. Why not stick with that?

[AnotherDave]

Vincent isn't a filmmaker anymore... He is a salesman. Philip Bloom is too.

This hack keeps this camera viable until people actually NEED 4k in the home.... Which is at least 5-15 years away.

With every new camera, there is a new gadget... Something for Vincent and Philip to 'review' and endorse so you will buy it.

Are they paid for it, no (maybe)... But they certainly profit from it - not just but clicks on ads on their sites... but as long
As they can stay relevant they can keep working.

I like them, and honestly think Philip is pretty cool... But I wouldn't take their opinions about a camera hack and the future
of anything as fact. They are salesmen for a booming industry!

[Jim Mitchell]

I'll care what he thinks when he writes, produces, directs, and edits a feature length film that goes to a multiplex. 

[kedbear]

Vincent isn't a filmmaker anymore... He is a salesman. Philip Bloom is too.

This hack keeps this camera viable until people actually NEED 4k in the home.... Which is at least 5-15 years away.

With every new camera, there is a new gadget... Something for Vincent and Philip to 'review' and endorse so you will buy it.

Are they paid for it, no (maybe)... But they certainly profit from it - not just but clicks on ads on their sites... but as long
As they can stay relevant they can keep working.

I like them, and honestly think Philip is pretty cool... But I wouldn't take their opinions about a camera hack and the future
of anything as fact. They are salesmen for a booming industry!

Eugh. What a disrespectful comment. Honestly... take a look at yourself first. What do you actually know about how much Mr Laforet works in the industry and what he's shooting?

[Andrew Reid]

Sorry but respect is earned. If Vincent hasn't earned it with that particular forum member, he's entitled to have an opinion that is disrespectful.

 

Logical no?

 

PS I respect the guy, like him personally. Don't always have to AGREE in order to respect someone.

[AnotherDave]

I didn't say I don't respect him.  But, he is a salesman - plain and simple.

 

Honestly, it's a touch disrespectful that you would assume I was being disrespectful.  

 

My hypothesis - Vincent Laforet and Philip Bloom are salesmen.  Prove me wrong?

 

This is Vincent Laforet's IMDB page.

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm3667064/?ref_=fn_al_nm_1

 

&

 

This is Philip Bloom's imdb page

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2423275/?ref_=fn_al_nm_1

 

As I said, I genuinely like Philip Bloom as a personality.  

 

But (mostly) everything they're listed as doing coincides with the release of a new camera or gadget.

 

They aren't filmmakers, they're bloggers and salesman.

 

Stanley Kubrick would have jumped all over a full-frame RAW digital camera that could shoot 12,800 ISO with his 0.96 lens for $3k.

 

These guys are here, as pawns, for a BOOMING industry of camera technology.  *my opinion.  (and again, Philip is cool)

 

A hacked camera that is 1 year old (especially one that they both took a blogger's dump on) isn't profiting them in any way.

[kedbear]

Sorry but respect is earned. If Vincent hasn't earned it with that particular forum member, he's entitled to have an opinion that is disrespectful.

 

Logical no?

No, people should be treated with a basic level of respect when you don't actually know what you're talking about, which is the case when accusing Vincent Laforet of just being a salesman. He's given enough to be given a basic level of respect i believe. Anyway, i'm not going to argue anymore, lets do some positive and informative posts instead?

[Neil Hartop]

Can I just say a big thankyou to people like Andrew Reid and Luke Neumann who have been champing what ML have been doing.

 

I was very surprised to hear PB very very very long blog trying to convince people that raw is a hassle (I really dont feel like it is) and found it crass that he breaks up his paragraphs by trying to sell stuff. I left a comment telling him that and in return I got a personal email back  asking 'explain myself'. I sent him a reply saying Im a fan of his sites and a regularly follow what he does but I dont understand why he has to break up his blog with all his ads? Why cant he just have them on the side? Well I got a rather snippy email back from him and I thought better to email again as im getting to old for email wars! He then posted it on his blog as if to make an example of me. felt a little thrown to his lions and he didnt take the time to mention that I was singing his praises in the email I sent him. that didnt seem to matter as he took it as I was attacking him.

 

Anyway im so done with PB. But in turn,  im glad theres people like Andrew Reid who can see when hes jumping down someones throat for having the audacity to disagree with him...

 

 

Neil

[kedbear]

I didn't say I don't respect him.  But, he is a salesman - plain and simple.

 

Honestly, it's a touch disrespectful that you would assume I was being disrespectful.  

 

My hypothesis - Vincent Laforet and Philip Bloom are salesmen.  Prove me wrong?

 

This is Vincent Laforet's IMDB page.

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm3667064/?ref_=fn_al_nm_1

 

&

 

This is Philip Bloom's imdb page

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2423275/?ref_=fn_al_nm_1

 

As I said, I genuinely like Philip Bloom as a personality.  

 

But (mostly) everything they're listed as doing coincides with the release of a new camera or gadget.

 

They aren't filmmakers, they're bloggers and salesman.

 

Stanley Kubrick would have jumped all over a full-frame RAW digital camera that could shoot 12,800 ISO with his 0.96 lens for $3k.

 

These guys are here, as pawns, for a BOOMING industry of camera technology.  *my opinion.  (and again, Philip is cool)

 

A hacked camera that is 1 year old (especially one that they both took a blogger's dump on) isn't profiting them in any way.

IMDB doesn't define whether you're a working professional or not. I've been working 6+ years and my imdb was slim until recently. I'm sure you're aware that a music video, commercial or corporate job does not go onto IMDB. Just check out Claudio Miranda's imdb before he shot Benjamin Button for example.

Film looks nicer than 5DMKIII RAW, i'm sure Kubrick would have stuck with film given the choice of the two!

[AnotherDave]

This is true: IMDB doesn't list commercials, music videos, or corporate videos... because they aren't films.

 

I am saying, which you are disrespectfully assuming is an attack, that he is a salesman - selling you products, and selling himself to

that industry.  Is he an artist?  Maybe.  Is he an independent filmmaker? No.  But he certainly tries to make you think he is...

 

His opinion is rooted in the fact that a hacked 5D3 is worth to him what a production manager sees it as renting for on LensRentals.com - $116/day.  Why would he want a commercial to shoot with that when he can get them to rent a c500 from him for $900/day and it'll do basically the same thing?

 

I'm not disrespecting him, I am merely warning you to not take his word as fact.  He is making assumptions about an early stage hack and attempting to dissuade people from seeing it as professional.

 

He isn't an independent filmmaker, he is a salesman.  The last time you saw him, in fact, he was attempting to sell you a $15k stabilizer.

 

Vincent Laforet = Salesman.

[AnotherDave]

No, people should be treated with a basic level of respect when you don't actually know what you're talking about, which is the case when accusing Vincent Laforet of just being a salesman. He's given enough to be given a basic level of respect i believe. Anyway, i'm not going to argue anymore, lets do some positive and informative posts instead?

I'm not accusing him of anything.  He is always popping up to sell you a new product.  Furthermore, I'm not arguing either... this is my opinion.

 

Andrew is doing scientific camera testing, and runs a blog to inform people.  Vincent sells you toys.

 

I prefer the scientific point of view that (regardless of the backend processing) this does pose an interesting development to the industry.

 

Andrew has a ton of my respect as I have been reading his blog for a long long time.

 

Vincent is always trying to sell me something, and I don't take everything he says at face value.

 

Also, 5D3 raw is amazing.  ML FTW!!!! :-)

[AnotherDave]

Furthermore, I don't like Vincent's movies very much.  He is a bad storyteller.  *my opinion.

[Nick DG]

Somebody has to explain to me WHY anyone would care what Laforet thinks. WHY? He was at the right place at the right time five years ago and made a couple of low light tests, which he called "films" (hello a "film" has to have a story, a plot), Canon rewarded him by letting himd direct one of the C300 promotion films and.... and that's it. All he's done since then is to heavily promote the most expensive equipment and vendors in this industry, who, btw, sponsor his site. And like someone else said, why would anyone be surprised by the fact that he said "we should be focusing on the C series..." You're asking Canon's public relations guy to tell you what the best choice is ... come on! I'm a Canon user myself, but I need to find the best tool for the buck and all Canon has done since they accidentally started the DSLR revolution is to try to push everyone upmarket by rationing technology.

[AaronChicago]

Somebody has to explain to me WHY anyone would care what Laforet thinks. WHY? He was at the right place at the right time five years ago and made a couple of low light tests, which he called "films" (hello a "film" has to have a story, a plot), Canon rewarded him by letting himd direct one of the C300 promotion films and.... and that's it. All he's done since then is to heavily promote the most expensive equipment and vendors

Not true. He directs commercials for huge brands. You've probably seen a couple and didnt know it.

[Shawn_Lights]

I try to look at things from multiple perspectives. I shoot for myself and also for clients so I have to look at things in a different light.

The practicality of the 5D raw is important to look at. However, not in the total misunderstanding way some professionals are (heating). I think recording time and the CF cards price:footage ratio is something we have to look at. There is practical things to be considered.

I can't for the life of me understand why one wouldn't find this breakthrough exciting. It's simply amazing what the ML team has done and it should be treated as such.

Where I differ from Andrew is (unless they fix the recording times) I wouldn't have the 5D raw as my A cam. Well even if they fix the recording time I may still use it as a B cam. Reason being not all jobs require raw and I rather not have to shoot h.264. It can be my A cam for certain things that require stealth and doesn't require controlled subjects. Thinking nature type stuff. 

So I would go for the BMCC 4k + 5D3 raw. BMCC will handle my main stuff, but I can always go to the 5D for those full frame needing shots or establishing/scenery shots. I can get wider on the 5D and I think I can use that creatively.

I'm also a fan of 16mm since I came from shooting on the Bolex and Arri-S. I will still have the pocket camera in my arsenal. Sometimes I need a greater dof etc.

So for me I think the 5D raw fits into my system. I agree that the practical aspects need to be considered, but it's very early in the development and this is a free upgrade on a old camera.

I never the type to go with one camera so people may not like this post of mine. I find using each cameras' strengths works best for me. I'm not married to any one of them. The dismissiveness of some of the bloggers is frankly annoying.