Who would pay twice the price if the new BM Pocket 4K had Canon DPAF?

[wolf33d]

Only if you intend to buy the new Pocket: If BM were to release the Pocket 4K at twice the price but with Canon great DPAF, would you get it instead? 

I would. In 2018 that feature is that much important for me.

[jonpais]

For sure.

[webrunner5]

Who is to say it might not have a good AF in it now, or something as good as Sony has. AF is still up in the air on it. But I would not pay double for it as much as I use AF.

I don't really think Blackmagic builds much of anything themselves as far as I know. Why not just pay a royalty for a good AF system from Sony or someone else? Heck it is a Sony sensor, they ought to know how to make a good AF system work. Surely Sony is going to use the same sensor in a consumer camera themselves I would think? Well maybe not since it is m4/3 sized. Hmm.

[Cinegain]

Nah. It's in the name: it's a cinema camera. Get a RED, get an ARRI and you won't be getting IBIS & silky smooth C-AF either. I liked the GH2/BMPCC days. There was a systematic approach behind the madness. You used to take pride in honing your skills. You were forced to think about what you were doing. Now everyone's striving to have a camera handle like a smartphone, pressing a button and getting spoonfed medium format results or something. If you aren't going to use a cinema camera for cinema style shooting... get something else. 'The right tool for the job' might just be a Canon if what your scenarios need is their DPAF. No shame in that.

[webrunner5]

10 minutes ago, Cinegain said:

Nah. It's in the name: it's a cinema camera. Get a RED, get an ARRI and you won't be getting IBIS & silky smooth C-AF either. I liked the GH2/BMPCC days. There was a systematic approach behind the madness. You used to take pride in honing your skills. You were forced to think about what you were doing. Now everyone's striving to handle like a smartphone, pressing a button and getting spoonfed medium format results or something. If you aren't going to use a cinema camera in cinema style environments... get something else. 'The right tool for the job' might just be a Canon if what your scenarios need is their DPAF. No shame in that.

I agree with that statement, but I am a Old Turd. I think young people Have grown up with good, to great AF and they are going to demand it like it or not. I think even Arri, Red is going to have to come up with DPAF or better down the road or their in trouble. You are allowed to turn it off LoL.

Heck it is all just Electronics to make AF happen. Nothing mechanical body wise. Sure a new Sensor, but they come up with new ones every 6 months lately anyhow. There is no real reason not to make a 65mm Panavision camera have killer AF.

[Cinegain]

3 minutes ago, webrunner5 said:

I agree with that statement, but I am a Old Turd. I think young people Have grown up with good, to great AF and they are going to demand it like it or not. I think even Arri, Red is going to have to come up with DPAF or better down the road or their in trouble. You are allowed to turn it off LoL. Heck it is all just Electronics to make AF happen. Nothing mechanical. Sure a new Sensor, but they come up with new ones every 6 months lately.

Yeah, on the one hand innovation of course allows for more creativity, because you open up new possibilities. So it's always great to have the option obviously. Just... not a 'lets pay twice the price' kind of option, if what it is is a cinema camera after all.

[webrunner5]

Just now, Cinegain said:

Yeah, on the one hand innovation of course allows for more creativity, because you open up new possibilities. So it's always great to have the option obviously. Just... not a 'lets pay twice the price' kind of option, if what it is is a cinema camera after all.

Yeah but Blackmagic is sort of giving away this new 4K camera don't you think? ?

[newfoundmass]

Twice the price? No. $2,000? Yes. I'm really that not obsessed with auto focus. 

[cantsin]

DPAF is a patented, highly proprietary technology to which Blackmagic has no access. (Just like IBIS.) One should not forget that BM is a video electronics company whose cameras are essentially just ProRes/RAW field recorders with a lens mount.

[SR]

1 hour ago, Cinegain said:

Nah. It's in the name: it's a cinema camera. Get a RED, get an ARRI and you won't be getting IBIS & silky smooth C-AF either. I liked the GH2/BMPCC days. There was a systematic approach behind the madness. You used to take pride in honing your skills. You were forced to think about what you were doing. Now everyone's striving to have a camera handle like a smartphone, pressing a button and getting spoonfed medium format results or something. If you aren't going to use a cinema camera for cinema style shooting... get something else. 'The right tool for the job' might just be a Canon if what your scenarios need is their DPAF. No shame in that.

Beautifully put. I am a little fatigued by people nitpicking about a camera that is nothing short of a miracle at that price. In fact, option-wise, it's never been easier to be a filmmaker. I suppose one of the downsides of a forum largely focused on tech is, it becomes a vortex of endless demands and a mindset that the right camera is never in the present, but at a near future, just around the corner.

 

[Shirozina]

or put another way - would you buy a C200 instead of the BMPCC 4k if it was 1/2 the price.........

[zerocool22]

2 hours ago, webrunner5 said:

I agree with that statement, but I am a Old Turd. I think young people Have grown up with good, to great AF and they are going to demand it like it or not. I think even Arri, Red is going to have to come up with DPAF or better down the road or their in trouble. You are allowed to turn it off LoL.

Heck it is all just Electronics to make AF happen. Nothing mechanical body wise. Sure a new Sensor, but they come up with new ones every 6 months lately anyhow. There is no real reason not to make a 65mm Panavision camera have killer AF.

Well the cinema users are using manual lenses, DPAF will not work. DPAF is great for wedding and events and such, but for scripted work nope. Heck they don't need to, a wireless focus operator will give you more control and better results.

So no I would not even pay 100€ for it as I am also shooting mostly manual lenses.

[Inazuma]

No because I would likely use it with vintage glass

[kye]

4 hours ago, Cinegain said:

Nah. It's in the name: it's a cinema camera. Get a RED, get an ARRI and you won't be getting IBIS & silky smooth C-AF either. I liked the GH2/BMPCC days. There was a systematic approach behind the madness. You used to take pride in honing your skills. You were forced to think about what you were doing. Now everyone's striving to have a camera handle like a smartphone, pressing a button and getting spoonfed medium format results or something. If you aren't going to use a cinema camera for cinema style shooting... get something else. 'The right tool for the job' might just be a Canon if what your scenarios need is their DPAF. No shame in that.

I think this post is silly.

It's the equivalent of saying that if you want a smartphone that's silly because you could have all the functionality by just buying all of these things:

The reason that we wouldn't buy all those other things and prefer a smartphone is that all those other things are way too large to carry around and be practical, plus they're really expensive......   just like cinema cameras are way too large to carry around in many situations, and are really expensive.

I get that this might be good advice for you, maybe because your priorities are equally fulfilled by either option, but that's not true for many other people.

I voted Yes because if Canon made such a camera I would buy it.  However, if the Pocket 2 doesn't have good autofocus then that would be why I'm not buying it.

If it had good AF, that would be absolutely killer!

[jonpais]

heck, I'd pay $100 more today if my GH5 had better AF.  

[JordanWright]

I wouldn't be able to justify double the price for a single feature because I almost never use autofocus. However, If they released a version for only £100-200 more expensive or if they introduced some sort of upgrade, I might grab that instead for the rare occasion that I would use it.

[Damphousse]

5 hours ago, Shirozina said:

or put another way - would you buy a C200 instead of the BMPCC 4k if it was 1/2 the price.........

 

$1295 with resolve is just too good of a price.  It is a no brainer price.  $3,500 is waaayyyyy too much.   It may be a killer price for a C200 but it is still in a different league than a BMPCC 4k.

[Inazuma]

2 hours ago, jonpais said:

heck, I'd pay $100 more today if my GH5 had better AF.  

I thought they sorted it with the latest firmware?

[DBounce]

6 hours ago, cantsin said:

DPAF is a patented, highly proprietary technology to which Blackmagic has no access. (Just like IBIS.) One should not forget that BM is a video electronics company whose cameras are essentially just ProRes/RAW field recorders with a lens mount.

Samsung uses DPAF in their smartphones, so clearly some form of it is available. Granted it’s a smaller sensor, but the performance is snappy, and there is no hunting.

[BTM_Pix]

5 hours ago, Inazuma said:

No because I would likely use it with vintage glass

TechArt making a version of their AF for MF lenses adapter for MFT would be a huge seller just for this camera alone, let alone all the other MFT cameras.

I've just ordered the E mount version so may revise this opinion if its shit