Nikon Z6 features 4K N-LOG, 10bit HDMI output and 120fps 1080p

[Attila Bakos]

9 minutes ago, Mokara said:

They should be, unless you are talking about RAW feed. Regular HDMI video would simple be an uncompressed form of what is normally recorded in camera.

With RAW you would need to apply those corrections yourself since all you are getting is data directly off the sensor without any processing applied to it.

No not RAW, I wanted to know if the Z6's 10bit 4:2:2 N-LOG over HDMI has these corrections.

[webrunner5]

1 hour ago, Attila Bakos said:

No not RAW, I wanted to know if the Z6's 10bit 4:2:2 N-LOG over HDMI has these corrections.

I doubt anyone knows that yet? I would guess it doesn't, at least in Photo mode. I use DXO, and it does it automatically if I Want for photos. Now video, hmm.

[IronFilm]

14 hours ago, Attila Bakos said:

No not RAW, I wanted to know if the Z6's 10bit 4:2:2 N-LOG over HDMI has these corrections.

I'd be quite surprised indeed if it doesn't

[arant.joseph]

I, for one, and looking forward to Andrew's review of the Z6.  His review was literally the reason I bought the d750, and he was dead on in his assessment.  I use my camera less for video and more for astrophotography, but all the same, making the jump to 4k would be nice, but not at the expense of selling my d750 when the Z6 comes out as subpar....

[BasiliskFilm]

My thought on lenses. If the performance of adapted F mount glass is near-native (including 3rd party F mount) , particularly for action photography, then this becomes a very attractive hybrid platform. Second, the Z6 seems competitive (compared to A7III), but native glass is pretty pricey. On Sony the Tamron 28-75 makes for a budget/quality/lightweight option, so Nikon/Tamron needs to make that happen too. An f4 zoom is not enough, I might as well shoot on ASPC. The fact that Tamron waited until Nikon and Canon were bringing out full frame mirrorless to produce a FF zoom lens suggests they were not only thinking of selling this lens on E-mount.

[BTM_Pix]

Amongst all the debate about what Nikon has got right or wrong about this camera, I think one thing that everyone must surely agree on is just how badly wrong they got it with the demo setups at the launch events.

It wasn't just that it was bad in its own right - although it was - but it was also how much worse it was comparatively to what Sony gets up to at their versions of these events.

In Jared Polin's video above he illustrates this huge gulf and you just have to wonder how anyone from Nikon thought that what they laid on was even adequate let alone comparable.

Of course Sony has a much bigger budget for this stuff than Nikon but its not like we are talking about them launching a new speedlite or a consumer compact, this is about a crucial new line for them. 

I'm not sure how anyone is gleaning anything particularly useful about these cameras based on the output we've seen from these events as everyone who has posted their content is, quite understandably, couching everything they say in relation to how mediocre at best the shooting conditions were.

Sony makes it very easy for everyone who attends and reports on those events to get decent images whereas Nikon seemed to have approached it like some sort of challenge to them to make a silk purse out of a sow's ear.

Weird.

[Django]

I don't know Sony might be better but their events still have silly setups too imo..

mirrors galore..

harsh backlights exposing nasty grid artifacts.. 

 

[jonpais]

It's an extremely rare occurrence. 

[webrunner5]

10 minutes ago, Django said:

I don't know Sony might be better but their events still have silly setups too imo..

mirrors galore..

harsh backlights exposing nasty grid artifacts.. 

 

"The striping does seem to be limited to certain lenses: the Sony FE 85mm F1.8 is particularly prone to this issue" From DPR. It is internal reflections causing it in the lens. No clue if they have fixed the problem?

https://***URL removed***/news/6974141509/sony-striping-heres-the-fix

[Mark Romero 2]

7 minutes ago, jonpais said:

Have you seen grid artifacts anywhere besides in that single memorable shot? 

Since I spend a LOT of time on Sony forums on dpreview, with all due respect to @Django I will answer that with a "no."

The only things people shooting with Sony still complain about are ergonomics and lens selections.

9 minutes ago, webrunner5 said:

"The striping does seem to be limited to certain lenses: the Sony FE 85mm F1.8 is particularly prone to this issue" From DPR. It is internal reflections causing it in the lens. No clue if they have fixed the problem?

https://***URL removed***/news/6974141509/sony-striping-heres-the-fix

Sony Techno Geek Extraordinaire  Jim Kasson has looked into the striping issue pretty extensively and come up with some observations that are well worth reading if one is concerned about this. His findings were that the a7 III had striping as bad as the a9, and noted that despite the a9 and a7 III having similar striping, no one complains about the striping on the a9. He did find that the a7R III has less striping of the third-generation cameras.

https://blog.kasson.com/a7riii/sony-a7iii-pdaf-striping-faqs/

Personally, I am starting to warm up a little  bit more to the idea of buying a Z6 as a hybrid camera.

If I could rig out the Z6, adapter, Ninja V, and a UWA Lens on to a Ronin S with handles or a Ronin M, and if it provides a killer image with plenty of dynamic range in an easy-to-work-with egg nog... I mean N-Log, then I think it will be worth the weight / hassle / expense I guess.

I still find Nikon colors the best... just personal prejudice I guess, and the highlight rolloff has so far looked pretty good as well.

[webrunner5]

7 minutes ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

Since I spend a LOT of time on Sony forums on dpreview, with all due respect to @Django I will answer that with a "no."

The only things people shooting with Sony still complain about are ergonomics and lens selections.

Sony Techno Geek Extraordinaire  Jim Kasson has looked into the striping issue pretty extensively and come up with some observations that are well worth reading if one is concerned about this. His findings were that the a7 III had striping as bad as the a9, and noted that despite the a9 and a7 III having similar striping, no one complains about the striping on the a9. He did find that the a7R III has less striping of the third-generation cameras.

https://blog.kasson.com/a7riii/sony-a7iii-pdaf-striping-faqs/

Ahh , so it is more of a PDAF problem. Interesting. Nikon might end up with the same problem on the Z7. Yeah that Jim Kasson guy is a smart cookie LoL.

[Django]

you guys seemed to have missed my point.It was about Sony not always doing a particularly great job of staging launch events like it's been implied. surely the guy who thought it was a good idea to place that backlight in that angle got the boot considering the online shitstorm it created heh..

[webrunner5]

4 minutes ago, Django said:

you guys seemed to have missed my point.It was about Sony not always doing a particularly great job of staging launch events like it's been implied. surely the guy who thought it was a good idea to place that backlight in that angle got the boot considering the online shitstorm it created heh..

It was a camera roll out. Nobody, probably even Sony, didn't know about the problem. Hell they probably gave the guy a raise! Nah, not a raise, Nikon hired him, hell maybe he already Did work for Nikon?

[Mark Romero 2]

7 minutes ago, Django said:

you guys seemed to have missed my point.It was about Sony not always doing a particularly great job of staging launch events like it's been implied. surely the guy who thought it was a good idea to place that backlight in that angle got the boot considering the online shitstorm it created heh..

Well... it was only "backlight" if the photographer chose that particular angle to shoot from. I could be wrong, but I thought the way sony set it up that the photographers there could shoot from pretty much anywhere... and as Jim Kasson explains, it is really only in certain situations with it being more prominent with certain lenses.

But the people who have gone to both Sony and Nikon events claim that the Sony events are better set up than the Nikon ones.

Should that fact influence anyone's decision to buy one camera over another??? No, not at all.

[Django]

@Mark Romero 2 not really interested either in who's is better. my point is simply that most of these press events including sony aren't really ideal to judge sample pics from. 

47 minutes ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

Since I spend a LOT of time on Sony forums on dpreview, with all due respect to @Django I will answer that with a "no."

The only things people shooting with Sony still complain about are ergonomics and lens selections.

The only things? speak for yourself, some of use would also enjoy better weather sealing, 10-bit, stronger codec, venice color science.. etc

Guarantee you gap with newfound MILC competition would seriously narrow if they address these points in the future, which they hopefully will!

 

[BTM_Pix]

1 hour ago, Django said:

I don't know Sony might be better but their events still have silly setups too imo..

mirrors galore..

harsh backlights exposing nasty grid artifacts.. 

 

Absolutely they're not 100% ideal either and you make a very valid point but at least those images are approaching somewhere where you would be interested enough in them to then look closer for defects. 

There is a night and day difference between the overall aesthetic of those Sony images and those from the Z7 launch.

The vast majority of the output I've seen from the Z7 hasn't been worth the click and the zoom as far as I'm concerned.

Does it mean that I think the output from the camera is or will be shit in general terms?

After four decades of using Nikon cameras (which is a confession rather than a boast by the way  ) I'm inclined to believe it probably won't be shit.

If I came to this from never having used their gear or was looking to change though then I'd have looked at the stuff from the launch and had serious doubts about what the fuss was all about.

If you take DPReview as a yardstick of this then look at the reaction to the sample gallery of the Z7.

Even factoring in the usual hysteria on there, it is overwhelmingly scathing and in this case I have absolutely no issue with that because how else are people supposed to react to such underwhelming output from a £3.5K camera?

The blame for that I'm afraid and the potential consequences of it are Nikon's because they controlled the parameters of those launches and are responsible for what has ended up out there. 

Including the banding by the way that Polin's video exhibits. 

I'm conscious of the fact that I have not had too much positive to say about these new cameras but I want to stress again that I had/have as much if not more vested interest in Nikon getting things right and establishing themselves in mirrorless as most people, even if I knew ahead of time that these ones would likely not be the most appropriate for me.

So I want Nikon to do well with these cameras and any negativity that I have been raising is genuinely coming from a place of concern rather than one of hate. 

Basically, even from a purely selfish point of view, I want them to do well enough with them that they are still in the game when it comes round to them making versions of it that I would actually want to buy and that means they need to sell these ones to everyone else.

I haven't seen much to fill me with the confidence that they have made the best of the platform they had to impress, let alone slay, the wider world outside of a core "You had me at Nikon" audience.

Worse than that, there really hasn't been much in the way of an outpouring of love from some of the quarters that I would have expected either.

That doesn't mean they are absolutely slating it but I do get the feeling that there is a slight amount of this going on with them

 

I suppose my general point here is that there are undeniably some issues that have irked people about the system as a whole (price, lens lineup, single card slot, ergonomics etc) that are gaining even greater traction because they aren't being mitigated by anyone being able to convincingly say "Yeah but forget all that, just look at the images coming off this thing". 

I think that Nikon shot themselves in the foot by not offering an environment where that kind of counter point could be generated.

None of that means Nikon have created a bad camera system but I do think it amounts to them having created a bad impression.

That can change when they start delivering the cameras and people start doing real reviews of course so it will probably be a blessing that there is a short time between the launch event and actual delivery.

[Django]

FWIW as I pointed out in the other thread, DPR just added a bunch of sample pics from Japan, including exterior night scenes at high ISO (up to 25,600) which i find much more interesting then anything from the NYC launch event..

[BTM_Pix]

2 minutes ago, Django said:

FWIW as I pointed out in the other thread, DPR just added a bunch of sample pics from Japan, including exterior night scenes at high ISO (up to 25,600) which i find much more interesting then anything from the NYC launch event..

Yes, I agree, some of those ones are far more interesting than the NYC ones.

[Danyyyel]

So found a bunch of video in Italian that come from a blog or magazine. So one very good news, and one not so good. The good news is that the 120 fps looks good resolution wise and that slowmo video shows how good the video autofocus is. I mean at normal speed it would be impossible to see any miss. The bad news is rolling shutter, Dpreview already stated that the DX mode was good but full frame one a little bit less. More test would be good to judge it and cannot compare without side by side test. 

 

 

 

[Trek of Joy]

RS will probably be pretty bad on the 45mp sensor. It would have been nice if they did a couple whip pans, then we can compare the pole across the street with other cameras. I'd expect the Z6 to be better than the Z7, sensor readout should be a little quicker.

Chris

2 hours ago, Django said:

FWIW as I pointed out in the other thread, DPR just added a bunch of sample pics from Japan, including exterior night scenes at high ISO (up to 25,600) which i find much more interesting then anything from the NYC launch event..

I was thinking the same thing, especially given they're pre-prod jpeg's. Sunstars on the 24-70 look good and the bokeh on the 35/1.8 I wish Sony would build looks great.