Super Members Mattias Burling Posted October 27, 2018 Super Members Share Posted October 27, 2018 14 minutes ago, frontfocus said: At the same time I don't get, why anyone should praise the Canon for things that it's not. This is the reason why canon gets away with a lot of awful decisions Any examples if things it is not but still gets praised for? All I see is hate after cherry picking a couple specs and ignoring things it does have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Django Posted October 27, 2018 Share Posted October 27, 2018 Max should call these guys to clear up that mushy garbage 400% EOS R footage: TheRenaissanceMan, Emanuel, kaylee and 4 others 1 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kaylee Posted October 27, 2018 Share Posted October 27, 2018 ? Emanuel 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
no_connection Posted October 27, 2018 Share Posted October 27, 2018 You fight some compression artifacts but it sharpens up pretty nicely. Would probably add more selective sharpening to avid trees being too dominant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danyyyel Posted October 27, 2018 Share Posted October 27, 2018 One thing about sharpening though is on humans it is quite different from nature. You can apply much more to trees leaf etc than to a human face. Halos,edge sharpness are much more ugly on a face than on a branch or leaf. So it would be good to see these sharpening test on a human figure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emanuel Posted October 27, 2018 Share Posted October 27, 2018 12 hours ago, Inazuma said: Once again Andrew you're blinded by your inherent Canon bias. Andrew? Are you sure you're a reader of him? Humm... Andrew is an enthusiastic camera observer. The best quality of his work as reviewer IMO is to be as much brand agnostic as me ; ) Reason why I am here BTW : -) dafreaking 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nikkor Posted October 27, 2018 Share Posted October 27, 2018 1:1 video needs incamera sharpening if you want detail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inazuma Posted October 27, 2018 Share Posted October 27, 2018 3 hours ago, Emanuel said: Andrew? Are you sure you're a reader of him? Humm... Andrew is an enthusiastic camera observer. The best quality of his work as reviewer IMO is to be as much brand agnostic as me ; ) Reason why I am here BTW : -) He is brand agnostic, but like many others here there is still an inherent bias towards Canon because at the end of the day, they put out a nice image and nice bodies even if they fail in many technical areas. Like a few others here, I don't care for sharpness, so it really doesn't matter to me. BUT if people are on the subject of comparing sharpness - which is not a very subjective issue - then people should talk factually. If you actually look at the tif images at 100% (not even 400%), the sharpened EOS R image clearly has a lot of sharpening artefacts which the XT3 doesn't have. And it would only be more apparent if we saw the moving image. So no, the XT3 is not digitally sharpened (or not to a noticeable amount anyway). The Canon 4k image is softer than most others but its sharp enough. However, its a real shame that the image is only just sharp enough, despite the huge crop and low readout speed. Ultimately I think it's a shame to discredit Max Yuryev when he's put out footage, which, sharpened or not, you can clearly see the EOS R has less detail. It's not at all disputable. TheRenaissanceMan and andrgl 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted October 27, 2018 Author Administrators Share Posted October 27, 2018 20 minutes ago, Inazuma said: He is brand agnostic, but like many others here there is still an inherent bias towards Canon because at the end of the day, they put out a nice image and nice bodies even if they fail in many technical areas. I am biased to Canon LOL. I have heard it all now *mic drop* Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emanuel Posted October 27, 2018 Share Posted October 27, 2018 Yes indeed @Andrew Reid that's funny, because it is quite the opposite. Take a shot on this one here as for instance: "This company should go bankrupt." "This company is a joke." Does this make any sense? I don't even mention wolf33d's comment. I fully disagree with him on that one but he is entitled to have his opinion. You instead @Inazuma you mention that as a fact. It is not : ) I am not Canon's client more than I am Panasonic's or Blackmagic's for example. I just don't appreciate unfounded attacks though. One of the reasons I've always supported Andrew even before he had made his fame along his blog and forums, from that dvxuser period yet, comes from the fairness of his criticism. He has never flattered Canon or any other brand without a fair basis behind. He is much more critical than supportive BTW. No idea how long you are his reader and if you are a good reader of his articles. But I am proud to be one of his most frequent followers, so I guess I am entitled to let you know that's not accurate : -) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted October 27, 2018 Author Administrators Share Posted October 27, 2018 Cheers for the kind words. These are inanimate objects to make art and technology with, it's usually more useful to be critical than to be naive, satisfied and positive... a camera does not need our praise, it does not cry or get hurt. Camera users on the other hand... Emanuel 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gelaxstudio Posted October 28, 2018 Share Posted October 28, 2018 On 10/27/2018 at 2:21 PM, frontfocus said: even the sharpened Eos R file is missing some detail in comparison. The small branches on the right are easily distinguishable in the Fuji image, but neither in Canons unsharpened nor oversharpened image. But I agree with the generell idea, that sharpness nowadays is way overrated and there are many things that are more important. At the same time I don't get, why anyone should praise the Canon for things that it's not. This is the reason why canon gets away with a lot of awful decisions If a sharpened 1:1 pixel readout image can as detail as the super-sampling image，why any brand even bother to make super-sampling 4K？ Even line-skipping will be enough for all camera，including cinema camera That's ridiculous Sharpness ≠ detail is already been proved in max's video，Z7 is a in-camera sharpened image without any extra detail Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inazuma Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 You go out of your way to try to disprove/discredit another reviewer for their fair criticism and still deny you're biased? androidlad 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Django Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 Sony fanboys getting triggered.. Let it go mate.. Calling Andrew biased towards Canon is the joke of the year. I don't think anyone has been as hard on Canon than Andrew in the past half-decade.. hansel 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted October 29, 2018 Author Administrators Share Posted October 29, 2018 On 10/28/2018 at 6:58 AM, gelaxstudio said: Sharpness ≠ detail is already been proved in max's video，Z7 is a in-camera sharpened image without any extra detail Z7 is oversampling in APS-C mode. I guess they did bother. Still in the real world, that full frame 4K looks fine, just as it did on the D850, and the A7R III before the Z7 even existed. 2 hours ago, Inazuma said: You go out of your way to try to disprove/discredit another reviewer for their fair criticism and still deny you're biased? You must be some kind of Russian fake user or something. Yes I admit it. I am biased towards Canon! It's all true! The last 7 years calling them out have all been a PR stunt! They are paying me! How do you think I afford all these Sony, Panasonic and Fuji cameras? It's not fair criticism in Max's video and unlike you, I explain why using something called logic. It's as if you have never heard of a Sharpness setting in a Picture Style, or the Unsharp Mask in Premiere. This is basic digital filmmaker 101. You need to read a book. Why don't you go back to complaining about the GH5 and not being able to dial sharpness down enough. Go and do a test of your own, show some images. Go and adjust the picture style settings and try and re-produce Max's conclusion - yeah good luck with that - your results would be totally different. He's really only reviewed the picture style settings, and he doesn't even bothering to tell us what they are! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
no_connection Posted October 29, 2018 Share Posted October 29, 2018 Could you post some comparisons (in png not tif please) since you have a few of the contenders here? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gelaxstudio Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 Just stop making excuses for canon not to involve or even try harder what if the EOS-R II comes out tomorrow ,and still do 4K with a crop Canon just tell everyone that some pro users did some tests and proved the IQ as good as the supersampling one,forget the fXXking supersampling , you don't need it! Inazuma 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted October 30, 2018 Author Administrators Share Posted October 30, 2018 The GH5S and Pocket 4K don't do supersampling either. Crisply detailed enough for my liking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deadcode Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 2 hours ago, Andrew Reid said: The GH5S and Pocket 4K don't do supersampling either. Crisply detailed enough for my liking. Technically the pocket 4K sensor size is the same as the eos r in 4k mode. I would love to see sharpness comparison with the same lens from your hands. webrunner5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mokara Posted October 30, 2018 Share Posted October 30, 2018 22 hours ago, Andrew Reid said: Go and adjust the picture style settings and try and re-produce Max's conclusion - yeah good luck with that - your results would be totally different. He's really only reviewed the picture style settings, and he doesn't even bothering to tell us what they are! He was comparing the cameras directly against each other. It is not his first dance either, he knows about sharpness settings, so it is not as though he would have forgotten about them. You are being presumptuous about that. People may be OK with softer images, clearly a lot here are, so for them the EOS-R may be good enough. That does not change the observation he was making that the other systems had better detail. It may be that the Canon sharpness setting is so aggressive that turning it all the way down degrades detail, but if that is the case then it is something people need to be aware of, particularly if they are shooting 4K. From his review there is no question that the Canon as shown was significantly less detailed than the other systems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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