Aren't you waiting for the Panasonic S1?

[anonim]

It seems that initial video specs are especially meant to help selling of GH5 and GH5s... and for those who are blessed to exactly know what  is it "Full frame look" :)

[hoodlum]

There is also a 15 minute recording limit for 4k60 and all other high-speed modes.

[DBounce]

Here's a good look at the footage from the S1:

At 7:28 he claims it can output 12 Bit 4k.

[liork]

4 hours ago, androidlad said:

 

12 bit only in Snowdonia...

[Andrew Reid]

Parallel-world test!

[wolf33d]

14 hours ago, Yurolov said:

- many people will prefer the ergonomics to sony and wont care about the extra bit of weight.

- you haven't tried to video af so am surprised you would know before literally everyone. 

-given the additional specs you failed to mention, I doubt many would say it is overpriced.

-they have said that you will have internal 10bit 4k with paid upgrade. Show me any other brand who gives you the same in a mirrorless. 

-lens choices are fine for video and you will be able to adapt sigma. 

I cant believe people are upset at this release - literally no other full frame or apsc hybrid gives you these kind of specs. 

Its gonna be fun having smooth full frame 10 bit footage that is usable unlike sony and nikons current implementation. Cant wait. 

You forget the age of A7SII is old gen, when the III is here this year it will offer much more. I have owned a GH5 and Andrew reports the AF on the S1 is worst which is ridiculous and unacceptable. 

I can guarantee those cameras won’t sell. It does not bring anything exciting to the table really and because they are outsiders they need to bring much more if they want people running away from Sony and canicon.

[Yurolov]

30 minutes ago, wolf33d said:

You forget the age of A7SII is old gen, when the III is here this year it will offer much more. I have owned a GH5 and Andrew reports the AF on the S1 is worst which is ridiculous and unacceptable. 

I can guarantee those cameras won’t sell. It does not bring anything exciting to the table really and because they are outsiders they need to bring much more if they want people running away from Sony and canicon.

Ok fine. I was just pointing out that none of what you said it at the time you said it was correct. 

The simple fact is that this is the only camera which is FF 10 bit internal and 8 bit 60p. If you are doing serious video work, you aren't using autofocus anyway. But the ibis handheld is a godsend. 

The only other option is to wait for the mythical As7iii. But I can't tell you for a certainty that Sony will be protecting their cinema line, as they have always. 

[thebrothersthre3]

I don't know I am sure they will sell. The GH5 sold a lot of units even though it had poor auto focus and was a video centered camera.

Looks like the Panasonic S1 really delivers body wise. I don't think full frame 60p or internal 10 bit 422 full frame are small things.

[DBounce]

2 hours ago, Yurolov said:

Ok fine. I was just pointing out that none of what you said it at the time you said it was correct. 

The simple fact is that this is the only camera which is FF 10 bit internal and 8 bit 60p. If you are doing serious video work, you aren't using autofocus anyway. But the ibis handheld is a godsend. 

The only other option is to wait for the mythical As7iii. But I can't tell you for a certainty that Sony will be protecting their cinema line, as they have always. 

The Nikon get internal raw with the release of the new firmware that supports CFExpress.

[Robert Collins]

Tony Northrup with a dose of cold water....

 

[sanveer]

From the fudgers of dynamic range tests ?:

https://***URL not allowed***/panasonic-lumix-s1-and-s1r-released-along-with-three-new-l-mount-lenses/

 

"In regards to our industry, the LUMIX S1 seems to be very well suited to the needs of professionals and indie filmmakers alike: Full HD 180fps (4:2:0 8-bit) and 4K50p/60p 4:2:2 10-bit video is possible and this is a first in the full-frame mirrorless game! This feature comes with a few downsides, though: 1) 4K50p/60p is only available via external recording through HDMI. 2)A –paid– software key later this year is needed to unlock this (and other) features. 3) 4K50p/60p is limited to 15min (even less if the environment is very hot – the camera will stop the recording in order to protect itself). 4) Due to the different sensors used, the LUMIX S1 will switch to a 1.5x crop in 4K50p/60p mode while the S1R keep its 1.09x crop for video consistent throughout all modes (but offers 4:2:0 8-bit only)."

"In regards to our industry, the LUMIX S1 seems to be very well suited to the needs of professionals and indie filmmakers alike: Full HD 180fps (4:2:0 8-bit) and 4K50p/60p 4:2:2 10-bit video is possible and this is a first in the full-frame mirrorless game! This feature comes with a few downsides, though: 1) 4K50p/60p is only available via external recording through HDMI. 2)A –paid– software key later this year is needed to unlock this (and other) features. 3) 4K50p/60p is limited to 15min (even less if the environment is very hot – the camera will stop the recording in order to protect itself). 4) Due to the different sensors used, the LUMIX S1 will switch to a 1.5x crop in 4K50p/60p mode while the S1R keep its 1.09x crop for video consistent throughout all modes (but offers 4:2:0 8-bit only)."

 

I also saw that chart on Dpreview.com.

https://m.dpreview.com/reviews/panasonic-s1-s1r-review-in-progress/2

The S1 is the only new Mirrorless Full Frame  Camera (among Canon, Nikon, Sony and Panasonic), that doesn't have a BSI sensor Edit: the Canom also doesn't have BSI). I wonder how it affects the prformance of the camera in low light and other aspects.

 

The S1 also seems much larger than the Sony and Nikon in dimensions. 

 

[webrunner5]

Maybe the S1 Might have a BSI one???

From DPR.

T"he S1R's sensor in particular has been designed to maximize the signal-to-noise ratio by using aspherical microlenses, a 'waveguide' to direct light into the pixel and deep photodiodes to more efficiently capture light. This sets it apart from the BSI approach (that puts the photosensitive area nearer the chip surface) used in the high-res cameras from Sony and Nikon."

[Robert Collins]

2 hours ago, webrunner5 said:

Maybe the S1 Might have a BSI one???

From DPR.

T"he S1R's sensor in particular has been designed to maximize the signal-to-noise ratio by using aspherical microlenses, a 'waveguide' to direct light into the pixel and deep photodiodes to more efficiently capture light. This sets it apart from the BSI approach (that puts the photosensitive area nearer the chip surface) used in the high-res cameras from Sony and Nikon."

From what I recall the microlens approach was something that Leica used on their sensors in order for many of their legacy lenses (especially wide angle) to work effectively on digital sensors. (From what I recall many Leica lenses didnt work well when adapted to the Sony A7 series.) My guess is that has been carried on to the L mount.

This article sort of explains (but this is all well above my knowledge base.)

http://gmpphoto.blogspot.com/2016/01/the-future-of-sensor-technology-at-leica.html

I am not sure the lack of BSI makes a huge difference with FFsensors (BSI makes a bigger difference with smaller sensors.)

As I recall the Sony A7 moving to BSI added about 1/4 of a stop to lowlight.

[sanveer]

5 hours ago, webrunner5 said:

Maybe the S1 Might have a BSI one???

From DPR.

T"he S1R's sensor in particular has been designed to maximize the signal-to-noise ratio by using aspherical microlenses, a 'waveguide' to direct light into the pixel and deep photodiodes to more efficiently capture light. This sets it apart from the BSI approach (that puts the photosensitive area nearer the chip surface) used in the high-res cameras from Sony and Nikon."

It does Not have a BSI sensor. It's based solely on the new micro lens architecture of Sony. BSI+Microlens might actually add more than one stop and also some other benefits.   

[Ki Rin]

 

This was pretty funny

[Jacek]

13 hours ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

I don't think full frame 60p or internal 10 bit 422 full frame are small things.

It is not fullframe 60p.

It is 1.5 crop 60p, like Fuji xt3.

[androidlad]

25 minutes ago, Jacek said:

It is not fullframe 60p.

It is 1.5 crop 60p, like Fuji xt3.

X-T3 crops 1.18x in 4K 60p on top of the sensor 1.5x. Compared to FF it's a 1.8x crop.

[Andrew Reid]

13 hours ago, webrunner5 said:

Maybe the S1 Might have a BSI one???

From DPR.

T"he S1R's sensor in particular has been designed to maximize the signal-to-noise ratio by using aspherical microlenses, a 'waveguide' to direct light into the pixel and deep photodiodes to more efficiently capture light. This sets it apart from the BSI approach (that puts the photosensitive area nearer the chip surface) used in the high-res cameras from Sony and Nikon."

Sensor design:

[Emanuel]

These guys did the right thing to invite you there. Hope BMD have learned the lesson with them : -)

[webrunner5]

Well the definition of refraction.

"What does a higher index of refraction mean?

When light enters a material with higher refractive index, the angle of refraction will be smaller than the angle of incidence and the light will be refracted towards the normal of the surface. The higher the refractive index, the closer to the normal direction the light will travel."

So that is as I see it what the Micro Lenses are doing. Like has been said that is an old tech. That is interesting to go back that way. But is that slide implying that both the S1 and the S1R are using the same tech? Parallel Processing, hmm that could mean a lot of different things? Now if it is on Sensor that would be really interesting.