Panasonic S1 V-LOG -- New image quality king of the hill

[Vision]

11 hours ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

Until you get the vlog upgrade right?

Thats right VLog card unlocks all 10bit modes

[Patrick B.]

On 9/21/2019 at 9:36 AM, Vision said:

Thats right VLog card unlocks all 10bit modes

@thebrothersthre3 @Vision well you get 10-bit 1080p in v-log BUT only down to 30p. So no 24 or 25p. Seems so Canon-like to remove those and I hope S1H doesn’t have that limitation. 

[thebrothersthre3]

5 minutes ago, Patrick B. said:

@thebrothersthre3 @Vision well you get 10-bit 1080p in v-log BUT only down to 30p. So no 24 or 25p. Seems so Canon-like to remove those and I hope S1H doesn’t have that limitation. 

that's bizarre, I'd consider getting a ninja star or ninka 2 at that point

[Vision]

5 hours ago, Patrick B. said:

@thebrothersthre3 @Vision well you get 10-bit 1080p in v-log BUT only down to 30p. So no 24 or 25p. Seems so Canon-like to remove those and I hope S1H doesn’t have that limitation. 

 

5 hours ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

that's bizarre, I'd consider getting a ninja star or ninka 2 at that point

 

[Patrick B.]

9 hours ago, Vision said:

 

 

Ahh, so it DOES have 25p, but not 24p.  I guess the 25p doesn't show for me because I have it set to NTSC.  So that might an option to set it to PAL and get 25p.  But still very odd to exclude 24p in 1080p 10-bit.

[abehalpert]

1 hour ago, Patrick B. said:

Ahh, so it DOES have 25p, but not 24p.  I guess the 25p doesn't show for me because I have it set to NTSC.  So that might an option to set it to PAL and get 25p.  But still very odd to exclude 24p in 1080p 10-bit.

Yeah WTF

[Vision]

2 hours ago, Patrick B. said:

Ahh, so it DOES have 25p, but not 24p.  I guess the 25p doesn't show for me because I have it set to NTSC.  So that might an option to set it to PAL and get 25p.  But still very odd to exclude 24p in 1080p 10-bit.

Yah S1 is Hybrid shooter so you get photo video for Usa lads 23.98fps and for Us Eu we get 25p or fps what ever floats ur boat

Now lets get things straight IF u want true Cinema 24p u either get S1H or go to m43 (GH5/S)

[Geoff_L]

The thread is sleeping, so I thought about sharing updates after having used the S1 for a month (and the newly announced firmware updates are a good occasion for that !).

So I used the S1 during a 1 month arctic journey across northern Swedish mountains and Norway in last September/October. I only took the S1, for photo and video, and brought with me the 24-105 f4 kit lens and the Sigma 14-24 2.8 dg dn (the new one, designed for mirrorless) which I brought 3 weeks before I left home.

I wanted to film (not doing time lapse) the northern lights, but we were not very lucky with the intensity of lady aurora, despite one or two explosions in the sky, and the f2.8 aperture of the sigma was not enough. I will soon sell the Sigma and buy a 20 1.4 Sigma art, and maybe wait for the newly announced pana 16-35 f4... (or a used canon 16-35 f4).

I was a bit frustrated with longer reach need, because, when I bought the S1, I thought the ex.tele converter worked the same as on Sony (clear zoom if I remember) and on the GH5 and G9. So I did not bring any tele for this trip (despite still having at home a Canon 200 f2.8 L ii prime at that time), hoping to film with the 24-105 at 105mm in apsc mode + exteleconv. Some days before leaving home, I discovered that it does not work in 4k… So on 1 or 2 occasions, to film wildlife or distant landscape, I used 1080, and pixel/pixel mode. I checked the results at home on my computer, and the results are really really awful eheh ! APSC mode is, on the other hand, really good ; so, in the end, I had a little reach on some occasions.

I really love the range of the 24-105, and find it very useful. Fot this kind of trip, it is perfect ; maybe the newly announced (yeah, so much "newly announced" today !) Sigma art 24-70 f2.8 dg dn will be better, I'll keep a close eye on it. The Sigma 14-24 f28 dg dn is a wonderful lens for photos, sharp enough for me in the corner, light etc. But the inability to put a vari nd on it was useless for video. I bought it for nighttime auroras filming, but a 20 1.4 + a wide zoom that takes filters will serve me better.

I encountered minor bugs  : occasionally, when I pressed the review button to check my images, it said "no valid pictures on card". Had to turn off the camera and I could access again my images. I had 1 or 2 freezes (really less than my fujis that used to freeze very very often) too. Ah, and the camera is slooooooooow to operate. Drives me crazy when in a rush !

All in all, it worked very well, even during snow storms and -10°C temperatures, and was covered with ice and used under rain with no problems. The handling and controls are phenomenal, especially in shitty conditions.

So far, I only reviewed my footage on my computer since I came back home, and I barely touched the camera again (little time) but I managed to play with some clips. The Vlog shots are gorgeous... really ! I tried to play with them with filmconvert nitrate and varicam profile (I need to try the """newly announced""" ? S1 profiles), and with the varicam luts supplied by panasonic, and I love everything about it : colors, look... I think i prefer the result I obtain by applying Resolve's color space transform to the vlog clip, and then tweaking it to taste. I am still learning and, thus, is a horrible color corrector, but with minor stuff applied, I obtain a really pleasing result.  I also filmed a lot with Cine-d and HLG. The former seems to be very good, and the latter... I still did not figure out how to treat it in Resolve eheh. I wish I had more time to learn the camera prior to departure, because I played with the flat profile last week-end, and I really like it too. One thing I instantly noticed is the iso capabilities : amazing !

I sadly found some missed focus shots while reviewing my clips. More than I wanted... I mainly used MF, but with a lot of "AF first then switch to MF", and maybe the struggling AF in low contrast scene + not always easy to check the focus peaking in bad weather conditions + my poor fillmmaking skills are to blame.

On the still side, not a lot of things to say : wonderful high iso performance, very flexible files... everything you want from a modern 24mp sensor. A great machine for my use : landscape, documentary, astro photo...

Sorry for the very unprofessional review ahah, hope some of you will find something useful. I attach just for the fun an image I took inside the tent, after a short night (I still have to post process my photos). Don't pay attention to the "clean" appearance of the camera... I was always wiping it, as it was often covered with snow and rain ? 

I will sell my Sigma 14-24 2.8 and, in the future, I will slowly build  a kit with a wide angle prime, lenses like the samyang 135 f2, takumar 50 1.4, and maybe the coming panasonic S lenses...
But for now, I will add the smallrig cage for the S1 + a cheap 5.5" monitor, and I think about buying a Panasonic G9 + pana leica 200 f2.8 + tc (unbelievable sales + cashback right now) . It will allow me to "deport" the long reach video and photo use to this setup.

@omega1978 sorry, I promised you to take sample images with the sigma 14-24, but I did not find time to do it before leaving. Did you put your hands on it ??

[Trek of Joy]

Nice hands on experiences @Geoff_L and that aurora shot looks great! The new FW looks like one major complaint has been solved - manual exposure in HFR modes. Interested to see if anything else is significantly improved. I want to test one and see if it can replace my a73 - which has been a photo/video workhorse. 

Chris

[thebrothersthre3]

1 hour ago, Trek of Joy said:

Nice hands on experiences @Geoff_L and that aurora shot looks great! The new FW looks like one major complaint has been solved - manual exposure in HFR modes. Interested to see if anything else is significantly improved. I want to test one and see if it can replace my a73 - which has been a photo/video workhorse. 

Chris

Ghosting from NR was taken care of as well as the blue/yellow clipping issue. 

Should really be an outstanding camera now. 

[Video Hummus]

Thanks for sharing your hands on experience @Geoff_L. Sounds like an amazing trip. The Panasonic G9 + PL 200 f2.8 + TC is an amazing combo for Tele use and even better now that the G9 has been given an amazing buff.

[Trek of Joy]

54 minutes ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

Ghosting from NR was taken care of as well as the blue/yellow clipping issue. 

Should really be an outstanding camera now. 

I forgot to mention those as well, the Driftwood and other tests look great.

[1Ale82]

22 hours ago, Geoff_L said:

All in all, it worked very well, even during snow storms and -10°C temperatures, and was covered with ice and used under rain with no problems. The handling and controls are phenomenal, especially in shitty conditions.

Sorry for the very unprofessional review ahah, hope some of you will find something useful. I attach just for the fun an image I took inside the tent, after a short night (I still have to post process my photos). Don't pay attention to the "clean" appearance of the camera... I was always wiping it, as it was often covered with snow and rain ? 
 

Thanks for your field report. I am organizing an Arctic expediton myself in Greenland for next March, so I really appreciate field reports. At the moment the S1H is the first on my list, the S1 the second one.

Considering ergonomics, did you use the camera with your gloves on? What about the batteries in the cold?

[omega1978]

@Geoff_L no problem.i have received the Sigma mc-21 today and have try the Tamron 24-70 G2 that i have on my Sony FS5. The AF is acceptable for foto.So maybe i try the Tamron 15-30 and i can switch the lenses in both system..

[Geoff_L]

On 11/6/2019 at 10:41 PM, Trek of Joy said:

Nice hands on experiences @Geoff_L and that aurora shot looks great! The new FW looks like one major complaint has been solved - manual exposure in HFR modes. Interested to see if anything else is significantly improved. I want to test one and see if it can replace my a73 - which has been a photo/video workhorse. 

Chris

Thank you Chris ! I thought about the A73 and the new 200-600 (crazy lens !), but I couldn't resist the construction, video options, amazing ibis etc. I will find a small and not too expensive companion to my S1, only dedicated to long reach and wildlife, even if it wont challenge the Sony AF.
 

22 hours ago, Video Hummus said:

Thanks for sharing your hands on experience @Geoff_L. Sounds like an amazing trip. The Panasonic G9 + PL 200 f2.8 + TC is an amazing combo for Tele use and even better now that the G9 has been given an amazing buff.

Yes, I came across some wonderful images with the combo ! But the most impressive stuff I have seen is from a guy using GH5 and GH5s + adapted tamron 150-600 g2 and canon 500 f4 : https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZA1bwRJaqneQAc7jT27kDg/videos
The last one with the bear, and the one with the great grey owl are wonderful !

3 hours ago, 1Ale82 said:

Thanks for your field report. I am organizing an Arctic expediton myself in Greenland for next March, so I really appreciate field reports. At the moment the S1H is the first on my list, the S1 the second one.

Considering ergonomics, did you use the camera with your gloves on? What about the batteries in the cold?

Oh very nice, you are lucky, I would like to explore Greenland too ! Yes, I used the camera with two layers gloves : next to skin thin wool gloves and thicker mittens that opens to free your fingers. I also wore an outer shell with gore-tex mittens, but I always removed them to use the camera. What I often did during high winds and cold is open one mitten to free my fingers, while just opening the end of my thumb on the other hand. If I took photos, the right fingers were free, to press the shutter and play with the joystick, and the left thumb open (or not if very windy) to help zooming with the lens ; for video, it was the opposite : free left fingers to help zooming and focusing, and just the right thumb to lay on the area dedicated to hold the camera (not sure if i am very clear...). In both cases, it worked well. At night, during aurora sessions, I mostly wore all my layers thus, once focused and framed, I just had to quickly free one hand if needed. I believe this is the positive side of having such a big camera with great ergonomics.

Concerning the batteries, I brought 5 of them + 4 powerbanks  (yes, the panasonic batteries are 3500mah if I remember, so very power hungry !) that we shared with my wife (who used a panasonic LX100 for video and a nikon d7200 for photos) : 1 ravpower 26800 mah Power Delivery usb C, and 3 "small" ravpower 16000 mah. As I brought the panasonic battery charger (USB C), I could charge directly in camera +  simultaneously via the charger. The charger check the humidity rate and air temperature, so I struggled sometimes to charge batteries inside the tent (it refused to charge : the leds blink to let you know) ; in that case, I hide the charger + powerbank inside the down sleeping bag !
Battery life was better than what I expected, but , as usual, they drained quickly during the cold days, especially as I relied mostly on IBIS and avoided the tripod during the day walks ! The ravpower 26800 suffered a lot from the cold, despite keeping it warm inside the sleeping bag. To give you and idea, we where 15 days in the mountains the first half of the trip, mostly off trails, in "remote" valleys, so no possibility to charge anything. Having 5 batteries worked quite well, and allowed me to avoid charging them a lot.

3 hours ago, omega1978 said:

@Geoff_L no problem.i have received the Sigma mc-21 today and have try the Tamron 24-70 G2 that i have on my Sony FS5. The AF is acceptable for foto.So maybe i try the Tamron 15-30 and i can switch the lenses in both system..

Good to hear ! The 15-30 route sounds good, so that you will be able to share it with your FS5 or anything else. This is one of the reason I will sell my sigma 14-24 : too much specialized and not sharable with what I want to buy...  

[TheBoogieKnight]

Any impressions on the new firmware yet? Read somewhere that they've changed the noise reduction. Any improvements to AF?

[omega1978]

5.Improved AF performance
• It is possible to set [AF+MF] in AFC mode.

Is nice, you press AF ON in CAF and you can focus manual with the magnification loop

• It is possible to set continuous AF on the live view screen in Creative Video mode or in other video recording mode when the video recording area is displayed.

This one i don`t understand ?!

 

[Video Hummus]

2 hours ago, omega1978 said:

It is possible to set continuous AF on the live view screen in Creative Video mode or in other video recording mode when the video recording area is displayed.

This one i don`t understand ?!

Right now the camera only starts continuously focusing when you press record in AFC mode. This option allows you to have it do it in live view mode as well before you even press record. 

[omega1978]

3 hours ago, Video Hummus said:

Right now the camera only starts continuously focusing when you press record in AFC mode. This option allows you to have it do it in live view mode as well before you even press record. 

Thanks, and where in the menu i can set it ?

[ac6000cw]

12 hours ago, omega1978 said:

Thanks, and where in the menu i can set it ?

See page F-30 in the updated S1 user guide (English version here - https://eww.pavc.panasonic.co.jp/dscoi/DC-S1/E_/DC-S1_DVQP1872ZC_full_web_eng.pdf )