Blackmagic Micro Cinema Super Guide and Why It Still Matters

[kye]

I can verify I bought my BMMCC + rig from @mercer and would definitely recommend buying from him 🙂 

 

20 hours ago, PannySVHS said:

Oh no, why are you selling it? On the other hand it's so cool that you sold your other set to kye. @mercer Btw, I find the results from my Bmpcc even nicer than what I got out of my Micro with the rawlite oplf-ircut filter.

I'm contemplating getting an OLPF for my BMMCC but you have mentioned this before and it stuck in my mind as a reason to avoid it.  Did you try compensating with a bit of post-sharpening?  

19 hours ago, PannySVHS said:

What kind is the monitor hinge in the set which you sold to kye? Maybe i need to get one myself for my Ikan and enjoy the ergonomy a bit more.

It's a Smallrig one.  I can't see it on their website now, so I assume it's superseded, but it just tilts forwards/backwards and attaches with 1/4-20 bolts to the camera and monitor.  Shouldn't be too hard to find a reasonable one that fits what you want.

If I take the BMMCC with me on my next trip in April next year then I'm contemplating a new monitor that's a lot brighter.  I did a side-by-side with the BMMCC and GX85 on the beach a few weeks ago and literally couldn't see the Ikan at all, but the GX85 screen was totally usable.

[bjohn]

I read a couple of years ago that the newest version of the Rawlite OLPF for the OG BMPCC and BMMCC has much less impact on sharpness than the original one did. I bought mine (two, one for each BMMCC) in 2019 and 2020 so not sure if that's the latest version but the images are sharp enough for me, keeping in mind that for video I have a personal preference for less sharpness (though it's better to have sharpness and dial it back than to try to add sharpness that isn't in the image to begin with).

I have occasionally experienced moiré on my OG BMPCC (which doesn't have an OLPF) but the main reason I got the OLPF was to avoid having to use UV-cut filters on my lenses. One less thing to think about and carry with me.

[kye]

18 hours ago, bjohn said:

I read a couple of years ago that the newest version of the Rawlite OLPF for the OG BMPCC and BMMCC has much less impact on sharpness than the original one did. I bought mine (two, one for each BMMCC) in 2019 and 2020 so not sure if that's the latest version but the images are sharp enough for me, keeping in mind that for video I have a personal preference for less sharpness (though it's better to have sharpness and dial it back than to try to add sharpness that isn't in the image to begin with).

I have occasionally experienced moiré on my OG BMPCC (which doesn't have an OLPF) but the main reason I got the OLPF was to avoid having to use UV-cut filters on my lenses. One less thing to think about and carry with me.

Thanks, this is interesting info.  I haven't looked into them yet, except to see the price and have my eyes go really wide!

I didn't know they're also an IR/UV cut filter, which is useful although not much of a deal for me as mine is just joined at the hip with my vND filter.

Also interesting to note with minimal loss of resolution, this is perhaps the greatest weakness of the BMMCC I think - imagine the image if it was a 2.5K sensor.  @PannySVHS do you know what version you have?

I did get moire on my trip, but it was only on a handful of shots IIRC, so although a problem, a pretty minor one, and for the kind of stuff I'm shooting which is atmospheric shots and nothing in-particular, if I miss a shot it isn't critical.  

[bjohn]

2 hours ago, kye said:

I haven't looked into them yet, except to see the price and have my eyes go really wide!

There is a cheaper OLPF for these cameras available from Alt Cine, although I believe they make them in small batches which means there's a waiting list, and I haven't seen any reviews.

 

https://altcinecam.com/product/altcine-optical-low-pass-filter/

[kye]

14 hours ago, bjohn said:

There is a cheaper OLPF for these cameras available from Alt Cine, although I believe they make them in small batches which means there's a waiting list, and I haven't seen any reviews.

https://altcinecam.com/product/altcine-optical-low-pass-filter/

Yeah, cheaper, but not that much cheaper!

I guess my challenge with these is that they're both around a third of the price of the BM Micro Studio camera, which apart from coming with an OLPF installed, also provides:

• 4K sensor that is larger (MFT vs S16)
• Will have greater DR than the 1080p one on a 1080p timeline (because new one will be downsampled to 1080p from 4K)
• Dual ISO
• More bitrate options - from 3:1 to 12:1

Plus, it's a brand-new camera not one that's potentially almost a decade old.  The OG BMMCC seems pretty well made, but electronics don't have an infinite shelf life.

[bjohn]

6 hours ago, kye said:

guess my challenge with these is that they're both around a third of the price of the BM Micro Studio camera

That's a good point of course, and I keep thinking about getting one of those cameras, especially since it looks like I could use all the same gear I use with my BMMCC. The only thing that put me off initially was the inability to play back what you've recorded, at least in-camera; that's important for me mainly when I'm shooting video in places with artificial lighting (especially stage lights) so I can check to be sure there's no flicker (that would require changing the shutter angle). I could record to a Video Assist and play back on that, which could be a simple solution although it means buying a new monitor (I have a Video Assist but it's an old one that's not compatible with this camera and the batteries run out after about 15-20 minutes).

[kye]

20 hours ago, bjohn said:

That's a good point of course, and I keep thinking about getting one of those cameras, especially since it looks like I could use all the same gear I use with my BMMCC. The only thing that put me off initially was the inability to play back what you've recorded, at least in-camera; that's important for me mainly when I'm shooting video in places with artificial lighting (especially stage lights) so I can check to be sure there's no flicker (that would require changing the shutter angle). I could record to a Video Assist and play back on that, which could be a simple solution although it means buying a new monitor (I have a Video Assist but it's an old one that's not compatible with this camera and the batteries run out after about 15-20 minutes).

The other major changes that I noted with the BMMSC4KG2 were:

• B-RAW only
• No internal recording - SSD or external recorder required (and appropriate rigging)
• There's some strange things about the monitor setup IIRC - something like the menu options only appear on the 1080p HDMI output and the 4K SDI output can only output 10-bit and not RAW so depending on how you use it you might need two monitors, or to swap between the inputs on the one monitor but only be able to see a clean feed
• If you want to control it via USB (like if you have the handle accessory) and also want to record to SSD then I think it works but you might need a USB hub, and if so not sure if it needs power

Compared to the BMMCC it's actually very different and has a bunch of strange quirks.  It really is a studio camera designed to work while streaming and being remote-controlled.  The fact it can record to a USB SSD and has the minimum number of buttons a camera could possibly have make it possible to use as a cinema camera, but it's sure a hell of a long way short of being nice to use as a cinema camera.

The way I think of it is that the BMMCC is fiddly and annoying in many ways, and in those ways this one is worse!

[BTM_Pix]

1 hour ago, kye said:

 

• If you want to control it via USB (like if you have the handle accessory) and also want to record to SSD then I think it works but you might need a USB hub, and if so not sure if it needs power

It works with any generic basic USB-C hub and the camera provides enough to power the attached devices.

[bjohn]

1 hour ago, kye said:

Compared to the BMMCC it's actually very different and has a bunch of strange quirks.

Yeah, I think the BMPCC 4K would be a more practical choice. Another problem is that even though the new Micro 4K collects gyro data, there's no way to enter lens information into the menu so the gyro doesn't actually work....at least for now, maybe that's something they could fix in firmware, but as a studio camera it's unlikely their target users would ever use gyro stabilization to begin with.

[kye]

8 minutes ago, bjohn said:

Yeah, I think the BMPCC 4K would be a more practical choice. Another problem is that even though the new Micro 4K collects gyro data, there's no way to enter lens information into the menu so the gyro doesn't actually work....at least for now, maybe that's something they could fix in firmware, but as a studio camera it's unlikely their target users would ever use gyro stabilization to begin with.

Yep, P4K over the M4K, the only problem is that it's 112% wider, 23% deeper, 46% taller, and 140% heavier...  and if you do a volume comparison, it's literally 3.8x larger.  

This doesn't count things like the battery jutting out the back of the M2K and the monitor you'll need for the M2K (but might also want for the P2K as the screen doesn't articulate), but still, you're going from one of the smallest cameras around to one of the largest!

The camera market for cinema cameras sure is strange at this lowest end of size and capabilities.

I did a big comparison trying to work out what alternatives there might be for the BMMCC and one thing that I worked out was that a RED Komodo setup was at least three times the weight of a BMMCC rig.

[PannySVHS]

@kye I didn't recognize a drop in resolution caused by the rawlite filter. I like the highlight rolloff better on the pocket. It could be something imaginary, but in certain situations the og pocket seems to look better. I don't know if it's due to the rawlite filter on the micro. I haven't tested the micro without it. I also got a second micro with the original filter but I haven't used it yet.

@mercer You are right, I was wrong:) Some Cmounts cover S35 from 35mm on. I think the Fujinon does. My Tevidon 35mm does. I love the Tevidon 10mm on S16. It's especially beautiful close to midrange.