Canon removing 24p from new 4K mirrorless cameras - THE MEMES

[Brian Williams]

No! No, no, not 24! I said 30.

[Cliff Totten]

On 8/24/2019 at 12:41 AM, leslie said:

i suspect your right, however i dont think that makes my statements any less valid.

I was being sarcastic and irreverent! I DO believe Cannon has executives that are completely BLIND to what is happening in the industry today. They are leaning heavily on their logo's historic reputation right now. I dont think they truly know that their logo's gas is running out! Cannon is turning into a dinosaur right under their own noses!

I think that Cannon is doing exactly what BlackBerry did that caused their great fall.

Arrogant....absolutely arrogant in every way. They will look back at themselves 5 years from now and clearly see how their own attitude ruined them.

[Cinegain]

Not quite yet though. Sheeple still buy them. Even after asking me for my expert opinion, because ultimately they've always only known this iconic 'Canon' so for them it feels like a 'safe bet' and your typical electronics market dweep will also recommend it since he doesn't know any better either. It's gonna take a while before that's eradicated. They'll even pick a traditional DSLR because that's always been regarded 'the professional' thing, even when I tell 'em about the benefits of a mirrorless camera. It's a deeply rooted evil they're still picking the fruits from. But yeah, at some point the well has to dry out, but... it will rather be later than sooner I'm afraid.

[theJesusHorse]

On 8/22/2019 at 5:14 PM, Cliff Totten said:

Its not funny. A Canon rep told there is a legitimate reason for no 24p. He said something about the way the sensor is read out. He said that Canon wants it to operate at a perfect temperature. It runs too cold at 24p, but is at an optimum temp at 30p. It was done for the benefit of the camera.

That is the most nonsensical thing I have ever heard. 1) The camera doesn't have any trouble shooting 30fps video at 0°C/32°F but room temperature operation for 24fps video is too cold? 2) Heat = noise. You NEVER want more heat, that is why camera's have heatsinks, fans, etc. 

 

[Andrew Reid]

Cliff was joking.

Canon is also taking the piss!

[BTM_Pix]

I suppose it says something about the degree of mistrust of Canon's motives and excuses that even jokes like that have enough of a whiff of authenticity about them to be taken seriously  

[IronFilm]

On 8/26/2019 at 7:48 PM, Cinegain said:

Not quite yet though. Sheeple still buy them. Even after asking me for my expert opinion, because ultimately they've always only known this iconic 'Canon' so for them it feels like a 'safe bet' and your typical electronics market dweep will also recommend it since he doesn't know any better either. It's gonna take a while before that's eradicated. They'll even pick a traditional DSLR because that's always been regarded 'the professional' thing, even when I tell 'em about the benefits of a mirrorless camera. It's a deeply rooted evil they're still picking the fruits from. But yeah, at some point the well has to dry out, but... it will rather be later than sooner I'm afraid.

I've noticed the mood though has changed with both the typical forum goers (there was a time not too long ago when even many EOSHD posters were blind to many of Canon's shortcomings) and also the average non techie / gearhead is waking up to mirrorless being the future. 

Just look back and see how much better the mainstream average joe is in realizing the shift, back in the days of GH1/GH2 if you were a fan of them then you were often a lonely voice in favor of mirrorless in general. But now you'll see plenty of people who'll suggest a mirorless first (be it a GH5, a7S, X-T3, or whatever).

[Andrew Reid]

On 8/25/2019 at 4:47 PM, Mattias Burling said:

The EF 35mm sucks absolute balls compared to the RF 35mm which is one of the best affordable entry level lenses I've seen on any system. I so wish Sony, Fuji and the others try to make something similar, because right now they are getting their ass handed to them in that department.

Well the EF 35mm F2.0 IS is the one I'm talking about. Maybe you thought I meant the old creaky EF 35mm F2 non-IS from the 80's?

The EF 35mm F2.0 IS is one of my go-to Canon lenses no matter what camera. Adapts to so much.

Fuji isn't in the full frame market, so would be hard to come up with something similar but their 23mm F2.0 WR is a lovely look, and the 23mm F1.4 has amazing performance, both of them attached to far more capable filmmaking cameras than what's offered by Canon.

Sony have the very good 28mm F2.0 for cheap.

Their Zeiss 35mm F1.4 is another story... not cheap, but damn it's got a 3D pop going on, and superb build.

[Cinegain]

1 hour ago, IronFilm said:

I've noticed the mood though has changed with both the typical forum goers (there was a time not too long ago when even many EOSHD posters were blind to many of Canon's shortcomings) and also the average non techie / gearhead is waking up to mirrorless being the future. 

Just look back and see how much better the mainstream average joe is in realizing the shift, back in the days of GH1/GH2 if you were a fan of them then you were often a lonely voice in favor of mirrorless in general. But now you'll see plenty of people who'll suggest a mirorless first (be it a GH5, a7S, X-T3, or whatever).

That's just because of market dominance. The supply of mirrorless outweighs the traditional substantially these days, so it's only natural for people to get more into the mirrorless realm. DSLRs eventually will be a dying breed... and 'eventually' seems to be coming rather soon, isn't it. Seems like Sony has been done with them. Nikon might squeeze out another D5-like camera for the rugged pros at NASA or what not. Canon... might have the last one on their hands with the 90D. Pentax... well, they're quirky enough to continue in their niche corner or throw in the towel altogether already. There's no real new DSLR to suggest/get excited over.

Now, my sister in law, she bought a Canon a while ago and more recently upgraded from that APS-C one to the 6D Mark II to do portrait/wedding photography. She has zero clue, skills (don't believe she even edits the photos) and imho zero vision (lighting, composition, timing), but somehow she's landing gigs because she has a professional looking Canon. My baby sister texted me today... she went to a Mediamarkt, a local generic electronics store (the European equivalent of Bestbuy perhaps?) and they recommended her to get the EOS M100 with two kit STM zooms and she's tempted by it. Like... I tell them to look past Canon, but they're brainwashed or something (she already asked 'Is Canon ultimately the best? Or doesn't it really matter?' and said 'ooh, and I think I would like one of those DSLR ones'). I mean... maybe Canon indeed is a nice point-n-shoot equivalent in the world of interchangeable lens cameras. But if quality and features are of any concern and you're willing to understand how a camera works and how to get the best out of it, then I'd have a closer look at Sony, Panasonic, Fujifilm, Olympus and Nikon which to me are obviously the greater value cameras here where better quality can be extracted from. Like... Canon has never even done a camera with sensor stabilization... then all the other lack of features and purposeful crippling going on. Basically it's the same old 550D/T2i shit without the stupid mirror and OVF. It's just disrespectful towards the consumer, because that is not at all what mirrorless is about. Mirrorless is so much more than just dropping the mirror... just not to Canon. So that alone is reason enough for me to give them the finger. But I also always say 'they wouldn't make a camera if they'd think they couldn't find anyone to buy it offa 'em'. So... well played I guess. But you'd think by now people would already know better, but they still don't. That makes me think that if they haven't by now... it will still take a long ass time for them to get WOKE.

[mercer]

The M50 may be Canon’s best selling camera... so there’s no reason to cannibalize their entry level mirrorless camera with their highest consumer DSLR.

SIGH...

I honestly don’t know the reason. Apparently, this stupid licensing fee theory is gaining traction but I think it’s much simpler... Canon will not put 24p into a camera that is cheaper, with a smaller crop, than the eos-r... simple as that. They invested too much into the R camera and lenses to lose sales.

They are taking a huge bet on brand loyalty.

The funny thing is... this whole fiasco has made me question my EF lens collection. I was well on my way to building a nice little set of EF lenses including zooms, primes... with a couple L lenses into the mix but if I can’t have a small Canon DSLR or mirrorless to use them with... why bother... I can just put the money towards some Samyangs instead.

I love the 35mm f/2 IS, but I also love the 28mm 1.8 but paid next to nothing for it... so which one will I keep...

Btw, I wouldn’t be surprised if they released a FW update to remove 24p from the M50... lol. 

[IronFilm]

13 minutes ago, Cinegain said:

Now, my sister in law, she bought a Canon a while ago and more recently upgraded from that APS-C one to the 6D Mark II to do portrait/wedding photography. She has zero clue, skills (don't believe she even edits the photos) and imho zero vision (lighting, composition, timing), but somehow she's landing gigs because she has a professional looking Canon. My baby sister texted me today... she went to a Mediamarkt, a local generic electronics store (the European equivalent of Bestbuy perhaps?) and they recommended her to get the EOS M100 with two kit STM zooms and she's tempted by it. Like... I tell them to look past Canon, but they're brainwashed or something (she already asked 'Is Canon ultimately the best? Or doesn't it really matter?' and said 'ooh, and I think I would like one of those DSLR ones')

That is really sad ?

They've got on tap a fantastic source of info which is @Cinegain , just going to waste!

 

2 minutes ago, mercer said:

The funny thing is... this whole fiasco has made me question my EF lens collection.

 

I just (less than five minutes ago) purchased my first PL mount lens. 

Please slap me over the head and call me silly.

Arguably even more stupid for me to do than buy a EF mount lens. 
(maaaybe... it is a close call)

[mercer]

3 minutes ago, IronFilm said:

Arguably even more stupid for me to do than buy a EF mount lens. 
(maaaybe... it is a close call)

Haha, at least you’ll look hardcore on set with the PL lens.

Dollar for dollar, though, Canon EF lenses are still the best lenses around for new lenses, but there’s no reason buying them if there isn’t a worthwhile, native camera option to mount them to.

[Cinegain]

15 minutes ago, IronFilm said:

That is really sad ?

They've got on tap a fantastic source of info which is @Cinegain , just going to waste!

Right? They're treating me like I'm Tom Cruise and trying to sell them Scientology. Yet... it's more the opposite in that I try to make them not fall into that trap in the first place! ?

Oh well. She agreed that she'll wait until I show her some better options in a store. I also offered to loan out a camera, but she's adamant on buying one from new somewhere. Consumerism.

[mercer]

Idk, for what she’s doing... a Canon DSLR is probably her best option.

[IronFilm]

12 hours ago, mercer said:

Haha, at least you’ll look hardcore on set with the PL lens.

 

Nah, I'll look stupid only having a single prime PL lens instead of a whole set!

 

12 hours ago, mercer said:

Dollar for dollar, though, Canon EF lenses are still the best lenses around for new lenses, but there’s no reason buying them if there isn’t a worthwhile, native camera option to mount them to.

Nah, dollar for dollar then Nikon F mount manual lenses are a better buy ?
 

12 hours ago, Cinegain said:

 

Oh well. She agreed that she'll wait until I show her some better options in a store.

Small wins. 
 

12 hours ago, Cinegain said:

I also offered to loan out a camera, but she's adamant on buying one from new somewhere. Consumerism.

Literally looking a gift horse in the mouth

11 hours ago, mercer said:

Idk, for what she’s doing... a Canon DSLR is probably her best option.

Nah, get her a secondhand Nikon D5200 for cheap as chips. 

 

[Emanuel]

13 hours ago, mercer said:

The M50 may be Canon’s best selling camera... so there’s no reason to cannibalize their entry level mirrorless camera with their highest consumer DSLR.

SIGH...

I honestly don’t know the reason. Apparently, this stupid licensing fee theory is gaining traction but I think it’s much simpler... Canon will not put 24p into a camera that is cheaper, with a smaller crop, than the eos-r... simple as that. They invested too much into the R camera and lenses to lose sales.

They are taking a huge bet on brand loyalty.

The funny thing is... this whole fiasco has made me question my EF lens collection. I was well on my way to building a nice little set of EF lenses including zooms, primes... with a couple L lenses into the mix but if I can’t have a small Canon DSLR or mirrorless to use them with... why bother... I can just put the money towards some Samyangs instead.

I love the 35mm f/2 IS, but I also love the 28mm 1.8 but paid next to nothing for it... so which one will I keep...

Btw, I wouldn’t be surprised if they released a FW update to remove 24p from the M50... lol. 

Well, rejoice, you have the Blackmagic Cinema Camera 6K... Ever heard? ; -)

[Cliff Totten]

Non of our complaints matter to Canon one tiny bit. They have a strong history in the camera industry. Their fans are incredibly loyal and pretty much dont care how Canon cripples their cameras. Canon fans dont care about BSI or stacked image sensors. They dont care how their sensors are read out or if they are video cropped or not. Canon fans are just as happy with MJPEG as they are with H.264. Why is all this true? Because a Canon rep told them not to worry about this stuff.

Canon will make money no matter what cameras they release...because they understand how Cannon fans think. 

Canon can doesnt worry about keeping up with Sony, or Panasonic, or Ricoh, or Kodak or Poleroid technology.....because Canon fans dont buy Canon cameras for technology reasons. They buy Canon to be part of a historic "club"....to associate themselves with a good name.

And this is all Cannon needs from them.

[Mako Sports]

2 hours ago, Cliff Totten said:

Non of our complaints matter to Canon one tiny bit. They have a strong history in the camera industry. Their fans are incredibly loyal and pretty much dont care how Canon cripples their cameras. Canon fans dont care about BSI or stacked image sensors. They dont care how their sensors are read out or if they are video cropped or not. Canon fans are just as happy with MJPEG as they are with H.264. Why is all this true? Because a Canon rep told them not to worry about this stuff.

Canon will make money no matter what cameras they release...because they understand how Cannon fans think. 

Canon can doesnt worry about keeping up with Sony, or Panasonic, or Ricoh, or Kodak or Poleroid technology.....because Canon fans dont buy Canon cameras for technology reasons. They buy Canon to be part of a historic "club"....to associate themselves with a good name.

And this is all Cannon needs from them.

Yup, if you noticed when the specs were first dropped on here, just about all of the Canon shooters on here said they don't even shoot 24fps. 

Canon only makes cameras for Canon shooters. 

[mercer]

On 8/30/2019 at 12:38 AM, Emanuel said:

Well, rejoice, you have the Blackmagic Cinema Camera 6K... Ever heard? ; -)

I can only speak for myself, but I wouldn’t pay $2500 for a Blackmagic camera. But I may rent the 6K sometime when the demand drops. 

[kye]

On 8/29/2019 at 10:51 PM, IronFilm said:

I just (less than five minutes ago) purchased my first PL mount lens. 

 

On 8/30/2019 at 11:33 AM, IronFilm said:

Nah, I'll look stupid only having a single prime PL lens instead of a whole set!

You know how an avalanche starts with one little rock tumbling down an embankment?  Well, embrace it and go all in!

Become the first EOSHD member to own an ARRI and a full set of PL cine primes!!

Then you can look at people rigging up their P6Ks with V-mount batteries, rods and rails, matt boxes and just say.......