All-around camera under $800

[Mike Chen]

Hey guys, newbie here, really enjoy the knowledge this site has to offer. 

 

I'm looking to buy my first all-around camera, with equal emphasis on photo and video(slightly more on video since I also have a budget for Rode mic and ND filters). My previous camera was a Lumix lx-5, which served me quite well for street photography, but now its speed, IQ, and lack of video features made it inadequate. 

 

My budget for the camera is $800CAD(pretty much on par with UD$ now). And I've considered a number of options after spending countless hours reading reviews and watching test footage. I'm at the stage where I realize the research should stop and a decision ought to be made. Any input or pointers from you guys would be appreciated. 

 

Things I need do to photography:

-Image quality, color accuracy, sharpness, dynamic range (I'll potentially be making some mid-size to large prints)

-High quality in both raw and jpeg

-Low light

-Decent speed (street and in-door photography is my main thing, not looking to shoot sports)

 

Features I need for videography

-24fps 1080p

-Dynamic range

-Details, low moire and rolling shutter

 

Other qualities:

-Some level of weather protection (I know I can't get full weather sealing at this price)

-Articulating screen would be nice for a more stealthy street presence, but not essential. 

 

These are the cameras within my budget: Panasonic G6, GH2(used), Nikon D5200, Nikon D7000(used), Canon 60D (new/used). 

 

One question: I plan to do this for the long term and I will move on to better systems in the future, as in higher-end Nikon/Canon/MFT/Blackmagic cameras. Should I be set on a lens system now and aim to upgrade camera bodies in the future, or should I just get whatever suits me? 

 

Any input, hands-one experience and comparisons would be greatly appreciated. And thanks for your patience to read through my rambling. 

[nigelbb]

The Panasonic G6 is a great little camera and must be the best value for money in the price range. The little 14-42mm PZ kit lens is fine too until you can afford some more exotic lenses.

[andy lee]

Panasonic G6 superb camera - Panasonic have really made a great camera here with lots of nice features that improve it over my hacked gh2 -

you can then keep all your micro 4/3 glass and in the future you can always upgrade to the Panasonic 4k camera they are talking about

on another thread on this forum

[jgharding]

I'd probably pick the Nikon D5200 or G6 out of those. If you're more stills focussed go Nikon I'd say. The video features are great on the G6

[Mike Chen]

Thanks for all your input, guys. Could you elaborate on what makes the G6/D5200 better than the other models, despite similar specs on paper?

 

And, does bit rate matters in terms of video quality? One reason that makes me consider the GH2(hacked) is that it's capable of very high bit rates. 

 

To Andy Lee: That's one of the reasons MFT system got me interested. My question is, when I do get a bigger budget, should I look at a bigger sensor size as the priority? Or is the system design much more important?

[Mike Chen]

Also, any lens to recommend if I were to go ahead with the MFT system?

[andy lee]

Thanks for all your input, guys. Could you elaborate on what makes the G6/D5200 better than the other models, despite similar specs on paper?

 

And, does bit rate matters in terms of video quality? One reason that makes me consider the GH2(hacked) is that it's capable of very high bit rates. 

 

To Andy Lee: That's one of the reasons MFT system got me interested. My question is, when I do get a bigger budget, should I look at a bigger sensor size as the priority? Or is the system design much more important?

I personally an sticking with Panasonic and their micro 4/3 system -

btw you should know Panasonic have done a superb job with the g6 making a picture quality better than my hacked gh2s

...... my gh2s are running driftwood 150mb/s 1 gig per minuite files

with the G6 pansonic have made a camera image better than the gh2

[Mike Chen]

Thanks Andy, so is it safe to say that G6's still image is (somewhat) comparable to the 5200 while providing superior video?

 

The user interface is quite well designed, according to the video reviews. 

 

What lens would you recommend for MFT?

[andy lee]

g6 takes much better stills than the gh2

 

as for lenses well there are 100s you can use on the G6 - what are you planning to shoot

 

good standard lenses are

Yashica 24mm f2.8 in C/Y mount ......a Distagon equivilant lens

Pentax 24mm f1.4 c-mount - no vignetting on g6 - vignettes on gh2 - bokeh magic !!

may favourite lens is Canon FD L series 24-35mm F3.5 ASPHERICAL - image is very cinematic and stunningly sharp

this is my main go to lens

Carl Zeiss Vario Sonnars are suberb

I like the 28-70mm

and the 24-85mm in contax n mount - with 2 aspheric elements this len is unreal so sharp ! we are talking PL mount cinema lens quality here

 

ps - n mount adapters are about £90 !! ouch !

[Mike Chen]

That's a very helpful list, thanks Andy. 

 

For video I'm planning to shoot a mixture of indoor and outdoors, documentary/short films would be my end product. I don't foresee myself shooting something in extreme distance, though on the other hand, macro might be needed at some point. 

 

By recommending the Canon FD, are you saying that MFT works well with adaptors, as in distortion/lost in IQ is minimal?

[dishe]

 

By recommending the Canon FD, are you saying that MFT works well with adaptors, as in distortion/lost in IQ is minimal?

 

Adapters won't introduce distortion or lost IQ, since they just sit and hold the lens at the correct distance from the sensor. 

 

The only time you effect image quality is by introducing something in between the lens and the sensor, which on other types of camera mounts is necessary in order to reach infinity focus with an FD lens (since the distance between the film and lens was designed to be shorter on an FD that most modern camera mounts, throwing it on an adapter means you are sitting farther away from the sensor than it was engineered to focus with). 

 

However since mFT is mirrorless, the sensor sits right up against the glass without a mirror or pentaprism in between. That means there is room to have a regular dumb ring adapter without any glass to correct focus distance, just like any other camera mount (such as Nikon to EOS, which is very common for example).

 

Meanwhile, Andy, I want to see some shots of your C-mount you keep raving about!

[andy lee]

dishe

 

here is a review of the Pentax 25mm with lots of test photos for you to see

the reviewer is using an Olympus E-P1 , he a stills photographer but all his comments are valid and correct for video too

 

On a G6 it does not vigntte on a GH2 it does slightly vignette on the corners

 

http://www.efixmedia.de/photography/2010/03/04/cosmicarpentax-251-4-c-mount-tv-lens-review/

 

also check out the Wesley 24mm f1.4 - another super lens

 

[andy lee]

the G6 has let me revisit alot of great c mount lenses that I only used for outdoor night shooting on the GH2

(at night they are fast and you cannot see the vignetting as much on the gh2 !! as its dark ! a simple trick to disguise it.)

 

but with the G6 having a x2 crop these lenses now dont vignette so Im now using them alot more

They all have great character and look very filmic

I like the Wollensak 25mm (1 inch) f1.9 cine raptar made for Bell and Howell 16mm cameras

I picked this one up in Los Angles while working over there (attached to a free 16mm Bell and Howell camera)

 

its a very well made, 1960s (brass body chrome plated) and the glass has a super quality to it

great Bokeh and superb for shooting faces.

get one if you can

 

there is one on the bay here

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Wollensak-1-inch-1-9-cine-raptar-c-mount-lens-micro-4-3-/261267777932?pt=Camera_Lenses&hash=item3cd4c5e98c

[Ben Prater]

You need to chose your glass and stick with that. If you go Canon, you are going to start building a EF lens set. If you go G6, you're going to build a MFT set. It's almost like getting married!

 

My suggestion: Go with Canon 60d or T2i/3i/4i/5i or 7d. Get whatever you can find cheap, they are all the same visually. Still photos on all these Canon cameras are superb. In fact, to really save money, see if your uncle has a Canon camera you can borrow for a few months.

 

Instead, spend your $800 on getting some good glass. I'd suggest the Sigma 18-50 f1.8 EF. That's gives you a great range on any of the 1.6x crop Canon cameras. 

 

Eventually, when you save up some money, you can upgrade to something like the BMCC or BMPCC or GH3 and get a EF-MFT speedbooster and you'll continue to use the Sigma 18-50.

 

If I were doing it again, that's how I'd play it right now.

[Mike Chen]

Hey guys, great advice. Truly appreciated. 

 

And Ben, I don't think I made myself clear with regarding to body and lens. I actually thought of that, so here's a more detailed breakdown of my potential filmmaking set budget:

-Rode mic                 ~150

-Filters                      <$50

-Camera body           <$800

-Lenses                     <$800    

 

 

I really should have titled this thread "what's the best set up for all together under $1600" instead of just asking for the camera body. And yes, my biggest concern, other than the image/video quality, is which lens system I ought to start building. 

 

What are the benefits of EF vs MFT (and potentially N mount) lens systems, especially a few years down the road?

[Ben Prater]

If you are looking for bang-for-the-buck when it comes to an imaging system that does stills, look at the GH3. It's slightly higher than your budget (around $1000, check around). But the IQ for video beats the non-RAW Canon 5D3. The GH3 puts out some really, really good video. As a runner-up, I really dig the new Canon 70d's focusing system. If you are new to video, the 70d will help much in getting critical focus for your shots.

 

Bonus with the GH3: You get a headphone jack, no other camera in this price range offers this. It means that you can record directly/monitor audio directly without an external recorder. Another bonus on the GH3: 60p overcrank. Slow-mo yumminess.

 

MFT vs EF mount. Both mount types are popular and will be around for the next decade. In EF, you'll find more options, including older glass that you can buy off Craigs or Ebay. Lenses are usually larger and heavier. In MFT, you get a more compact lens for the smaller sensor size. Less variety, but because of the sensor position, you can often mount C-mount lenses (and others!) on a MFT-system with few issues.

 

I tend to enjoy shooting documentary-style, run-n-gun -- so lighter systems like MFT appeal to me (GH3 or BMPCC). However, EF usually means a bigger sensor, so if you love bokeh (and I do!), you may want to go 60d or 70d, which has a large APS-C sized sensor.

 

You can't go wrong with a GH3. I currently recommend it to others more than any camera. 

[Andrew Reid]

D5200 - better than G6 in low light. Better stills. Larger sensor.

 

G6 - Better all round video features, 1080/60p useful for slow-mo, has electronic viewfinder you can use for video, more fine details in video than the D5200 manages

 

Do you need AF? I recommend manual focus for video but if you need AF, G6 will do it best for video.

 

Regardless of the body choice, Nikon AI lenses on eBay are a great choice as they work on almost anything...Canon, Panasonic, Nikon, you name it! The 50mm F1.4 is a good buy and not expensive. The E-series Nikon lenses are extremely sharp for the money. 100mm F2.8 especially.

[darrellcraig]

Saw on 43rumors.com that GH3 body is $799 at Unique Photo today. 

[Damphousse]

Saw on 43rumors.com that GH3 body is $799 at Unique Photo today. 

 

Nice find.  I was going to tell you that it's too good to be true but I checked it out.  The price is up to $850 when you click view in cart.  It intially shows $799 but changes.  I've never ordered from Unique Photo.  It doesn't pop up on my usual price search engines.  But it seems like a legit outfit.  The website is robust.  Tons of information about the store on there.  Doesn't look like the usual NYC/NJ scam site.

[nigelbb]

Here in the UK the GH3 is almost double the price of the G6 (£869 vs £449 body only).