In depth coverage - Panasonic announce 4K video capable Micro Four Thirds sensor

[ntblowz]

Unfortunately this is true, met some people who don't know gh2 and 3 exists, they are like "what ? Panasonic ? what ? "

When 70D was first shown, some friends thought this never existed in a camera before, taping on the back for focus, yeah baby, canon :)

 

So true, especially when I said the magic "5D" everyone's eye just pop up, almost every time, if I said Panasonic some people ask is that shoot on tape lol

[Paul Ning]

Whatever how high the resolution of the video captured, the basic problem that needs to solve is the storage capacity. 4K H.264 is almost the identical as FullHD ProRes 422 HQ for 1 mins. If the prices of high-speed memory card or SLC SSD are not going down, the high-res format will never be getting popular. 

[StrangerSong]

Whatever how high the resolution of the video captured, the basic problem that needs to solve is the storage capacity. 4K H.264 is almost the identical as FullHD ProRes 422 HQ for 1 mins. If the prices of high-speed memory card or SLC SSD are not going down, the high-res format will never be getting popular. 

 

If Panasonic came out with a camera that shot great 8/10-bit 1080p internally, but had the proper connections for expandability into better formats via something like a Ninja, then they'd succeed in giving the market what it wants.  That kind of quality is only necessary for people working on productions that are least are able to take enough time to deal with that kind of extra hassle.  There's no reason why the Blackmagic Pocket camera should be able to shoot RAW and all that jazz, and a camera that will cost 3x as much can't find a way of pulling it off.

 

That to me is the whole key with this potential camera: can I get the quality of a Blackmagic camera, but with the extra thousand buck going into the small usability features that are missing from it?  So far, asides from workflow issues, the Blackmagic cameras simply haven't had the same design team behind them to make the experience of using them good enough.  Panasonic has had years of experience solving those same little problems, and they can come up with effective designs three times as fast.  

 

If they can undercut the market with a great camera we all win.  All Panasonic has to do is pull off the standard HD quality we want, but also give us the option of making higher quality images, even if they're a pain in the ass to deal with, for those who need it.  Canon has done a brilliant job of creating super usable Cinema cameras, Blackmagic has done a brilliant job of creating super high quality for cheap.  Unfortunately many of us still feel there's a tiny bit still missing from either one. 

 

All that being said: this discussion could be moot, and all we're going to get is an AF200.  Which would be a fine usable camera, but if it costs as much as a C100, then not worth it.

[zephyrnoid]

NBC Sports is already shooting 4K, actually. They down-convert to 1080p, often using the extra resolution to 'zoom' during replays. The technology is there, but the issue is cable companies are not supporting it at the moment. It will take a while before broadcasting companies are willing to upgrade their workflow. You'd be surprised how many TV channels actually still only operate in standard definition because they don't want to shell out the money for HD. 

SPOT ON !

[Tone13]

The technology that NBC is using for the 4K crop-able replays is not on all cameras. It's one wide angle shot that the replay OP can crop into. Not all the cameras are 4K and the OB is not recording 4K or using a 4K vision desk.

[Andrew Reid]

Whatever how high the resolution of the video captured, the basic problem that needs to solve is the storage capacity. 4K H.264 is almost the identical as FullHD ProRes 422 HQ for 1 mins. If the prices of high-speed memory card or SLC SSD are not going down, the high-res format will never be getting popular. 

 

That basic problem will be solved by H.265.

[austinmcconnell]

The technology that NBC is using for the 4K crop-able replays is not on all cameras. It's one wide angle shot that the replay OP can crop into. Not all the cameras are 4K and the OB is not recording 4K or using a 4K vision desk.

Correct. They're still trying to find an effective workflow for on-the-ground cameras operated by the photogs on the sidelines. There currently isn't an effective 4K capable camera to use in those positions, and until there is, they won't switch to total 4K. The point being, NBC is aware the technology is coming, and they're adopting it as quickly as possible to increase the visual quality of their broadcasts. Most likely the final domino in finally having true 4K sports in America will be when the cable companies buckle and agree to broadcast it.

[Tone13]

You'll find that the networks are being offered this new 4K "pan scan" replay technology, initially to use for free by the equipment manufacturer. They are not going out looking for it. Either way, eventually 4k will be with us at home. Do we need it? Consumerism at its best?

[Franka Mech T. Lieu]

I am with the saying that cost is a big concern, but I think there is one more factor in play, namely what the wider audiance have in their home. 4K simply won't be much of anything if the typical viewer do not have a viable 4K display ( and also 4K receiver / streaming service ). The producer, be it PRO or amateur, hobbyist or just home movie, and the Broadcaster might have it all 4K, but in the end that result need to be displayed, and well 4K display is still quite some way from actually making it mainstream. And one of the thing am seeing is that some Mfr are jumping the generation and instead forging for 8K display. That's going to be some interesting time during the migration.

[Nikkor]

Any news on the gh4? I'm saving some cash for this one.

[fuzzynormal]

I'm still pretty ignorant about the Panasonic cameras, but I like the quality of video image and form factor for my potential remote documentary production.

 

The article mentions that the 4K sensor is already "with us" in the GM1 and GX7.  I can't tell if that's idle speculation or an educated guess.  It read to me as the later.  

 

If so, is it feasible that a future hack could unleash this nascent 4K capability in these sensors?  Does Panasonic have a decent user community that's exploring such hacking options?  

 

I'm aware that the GH1 could be tweaked.  Are hacks looking likely on these newer models as well?

[Lucian]

The GH2 has been extensively hacked too and produces great images. Gh3 hasn't been hacked as far as I know. Personal-view.com is the place for info on panasonic hacks, expect to be trolled to death if you ask a question though :P

 

with affordable cine/raw cameras coming out, I do wonder if the days of hacking DSLRs and video DSLR in general might be winding down.

[fuzzynormal]

I do wonder if the days of hacking DSLRs and video DSLR in general might be winding down.

 

Maybe, but I'd think if a $800 camera has a sensor capable of 4k video that can be hacked "on" that would be an incredible development.

[fuzzynormal]

expect to be trolled to death if you ask a question though :P

 

Why's that?  Is the Panasonic hacking community full of rude people?  Canon's MagicLantern groups have been rather cooperative from my experience.

[Andrew Reid]

Why's that?  Is the Panasonic hacking community full of rude people?  Canon's MagicLantern groups have been rather cooperative from my experience.

 

The Magic Lantern community has good leaders.

 

Personal View does not.

 

A community is a bit like a family.

 

Look at the behaviour of the parents and that will tell you about the behaviour of the kids.

[fuzzynormal]

the behaviour of the parents and that will tell you about the behaviour of the kids.

 

Ah, that's too bad.  Thanks for the info.

 

I'm picking up new video gear for a hiking documentary and just started to search around the web for more in-depth Panasonic info.  What's the general consensus of hacking progress for the Lumix cams?  Has it been hindered by that "family" issue?

 

While I believe the cams I'm buying this week will be the best option for my upcoming needs, it's tempting to consider that the gear could eventually be pushed to higher performance ...if viable hacks are a realistic option...