Canon 1DX III, FF 4k60p with 422 10bit internal

[Mokara]

11 hours ago, plucas said:

The 7-year old 1DC can shoot 4K with only a 1.3X crop. With a new sensor and dual DIGIC 9s, I'd back the 1DXiii to pull off full frame 4K at least in 24p.

That is with software compression using inefficient mjpeg codecs. This camera will be able to do it with hardware compression.

Digic 9 has the same encoder as the DV7, so in principle the 1DIII should be capable of what a C500II can do. It will likely be a bit more restricted in practice however since it will not have the cooling capability that the C500II has.

4 hours ago, Michi said:

From my understanding the crop on this cameras is determined by the sensors total resolution.. That's why there's a 1.8 crop on the 31mp EOS R and a 1.3 crop on the 20mp 1DX II. Isn't it? So if the rumors are true that the 1DX III will have a 28mp sensor and Videos are still recorded from a 4K "cut out" of that sensor, the crop will be bigger than on the 1DX II... But only if there still is no full sensor read out of course...  

No, it is largely determined by what the processor can handle. High resolution sensors can produce too much data, so to get everything within a bandwidth that the processor can handle they either has to resort to things like pixel binning/line skipping, or sample only from a portion of the total sensor (= cropping).

[thebrothersthre3]

22 minutes ago, Vision said:

I think its wrong to compare 1dxiii to S1h

Both different beasts 

For one S1H build for Cinema indi folks and 1Dxmiii for sports shooters wildlife action.

I got to agree with Django it does outpower S1H with autofocus but that's about it in my opinion it hasn't got 6k10bit nor exposure tools like scopes or articulating screen tele lamp or anamorphic mode IBIS?

@thebrothersthre3 how on earth is it compact?

Even Davealtizer from Kinotica mentioned in his video 5:35

Compared to a C200 its compact. How else are you going to shoot anything tricky in RAW with something that size. You have the BM pocket cameras or hacked Canon cameras, but you don't have auto focus with those options. 

[Vision]

29 minutes ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

Compared to a C200 its compact. How else are you going to shoot anything tricky in RAW with something that size. You have the BM pocket cameras or hacked Canon cameras, but you don't have auto focus with those options. 

Look at you jumping ships?now your comparing 1Dmiii to C200 ! U trolling eh? 

[Andrew Reid]

This is my take on it. A lot of hype out there.

I doubt that Canon have done a u-turn on their policy to cripple video on EOS cameras... and I don't see RAW coming to a future EOS R.

But who knows... time will tell!!

https://www.eoshd.com/2019/10/canon-join-full-frame-4k-raw-party-with-1d-x-mark-iii-joins-panasonic-s1h-sigma-fp-and-nikon-z6/

[Michael Steiner]

1 hour ago, Mokara said:

No, it is largely determined by what the processor can handle.

The size of the crop with this cameras is determined by the sensors resolution. 8mp crop from 20mp sensor is a smaller crop than 8mp crop from 30mp sensor. That‘s just mathematics...

[Adam Kuźniar]

8 minutes ago, Michi said:

The size of the crop with this cameras is determined by the sensors resolution. 8mp crop from 20mp sensor is a smaller crop than 8mp crop from 30mp sensor. That‘s just mathematics...

Your mathematics seem to be forgetting about pixel binning and other techniques of squishing pixels down to a correct resolution..

[Yurolov]

If you want pro photo and pro video in one body, this is it. No other camera gives you that, hence the price. As good as the s1h is, I don't want to be fiddling around with external recorders just to get raw. With the weather sealing etc, the places you can take this camera where you can't take others makes it all the more appealing and unique. The price is warranted. This thing is a BEAST. 

[thebrothersthre3]

1 hour ago, Vision said:

Look at you jumping ships?now your comparing 1Dmiii to C200 ! U trolling eh? 

Why not? If you want to shoot RAW with auto focus the Canon C200 is your only option. Soon the S1H will be able to do Prores RAW, though the auto focus can't compare to Canon and of course once you get a monitor on there its no longer compact. Again the Pocket cameras can do RAW and are fairly compact but you don't get auto focus. 

So yes for its capabilities the 1D MK3 will be very compact. 

[TheDingo]

Panasonic S1H : First Mirrorless Camera Approved for Netflix 4K Production

[Andrew Reid]

8 hours ago, DaveAltizer said:

Nothing new here. Just my overall thoughts on the thing. Pretty stoked. Really hope they get rid of MJPG and the crop

 

 

I think it will use the XF codec for 10bit because MJPEG doesn't support higher than 8bit?... They have had to go to HEIC for 10bit stills and dump JPEG for that, and same with video, they will have to dump MJPEG and go H.264 based or H.265.

I like the idea of a raw shooting "1D C" but still more interested in Sigma Fp and Pana S1H.

I don't need AF that badly, and when I do, got my Sonys and Fujis.

Hopefully Canon internally have had a good talk to themselves and decided "enough with the video crippling, let's get real" and this is turning point...

[Django]

3 hours ago, Rinad Amir said:

Oh shit here we go! Pal there about 50 lenses available as we speak for L mount

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/search?ci=17912&fct=fct_lens-mount_3442|leica-l-mount&N=4196380428

as for 1DX3 buries the S1H imho.. 

I own S1H and am not here to defend it but it BURIES your 1dxmiii ? the specs u listed for 2020 and price with no Cinema features like anamorphic or true Cinema 24p 

on other hand am really happy for canon shooters there finally getting 10bit internal in 2020 where is Panasonic shooters had it since 2017!

Have a good look at that list, like I said.. Panasonic have three native lenses out for L mount.

Sigma & Kipon are third party manufacturers, they make their lenses for every other mount out there..

Leica?! Cmon.. nobody here is dropping $5K on those. 

S1H is a solid camera.No doubt. But crap contrast AF. No internal Raw. And those three lenses can't even begin to compete with +30 years of EF glass.

That said Andrew brings up valid points. 1DX3 is a DSLR brick. $6K. And we don't know about 4K crop or other caveats yet.

Lotta competitive options in the FF / S35 market. I don't see many people outside Canon fanatics & pro sport photogs dropping $6K on  it.

Personally, as a pro hybrid shooter that swears by EF glass, does flash photography and shoots in harsh conditions, this is a dream come true.

I'm done for the time being with MILCs for my pro needs. Not looking forward to the bulk/weight but compared to my FS7/C200 it isn't that bad at all really!

Big question is will Sony wake up from their coma? A9II looks like a joke compared to this announcement.. 

[Michael Steiner]

1 hour ago, Adam Kuźniar said:

Your mathematics seem to be forgetting about pixel binning and other techniques of squishing pixels down to a correct resolution..

Are we talking about the same cameras? eos r and eos 1dx2?
The math is easy:

for eos r: 36 / 6720 * 3840 = 20.6 -> 36 / 20.6 = 1.75

for eos 1dx: 36 / 5472 * 4096 = 27 -> 36 / 27 = 1.33 

 

[Andrew Reid]

S1H is a much better featured cinema tool than 1DX III, that's just the truth. Way more going on with it. Much better ergonomics. You cannot even look through the viewfinder of the 1D X Mark III in video mode.

Let's get real for a moment.

Ok it has Dual Pixel AF. It has internal raw. It has 10bit. Nice colour. LOG. I commend Canon for those. I love the pro stills side of it as well, and the build quality, and the ergonomics for photography too.

The lens situation I agree with... Things are stacked on Canon's side there. No contest. Panasonic's pricing is on the high side. Leica's is astronomical. Just to get a 50mm F1.4 is a big effort. This needs changing fast. Sigma L-mount glass is on the chunky side. It's DSLR glass, not a ground-up re-design taking advantage of mirrorless. That needs to change too.

But there are some nice options out there for cheaper...Sigma 40mm F2.8 L-Mount, just an extra $400 with the Sigma Fp.

There is the 1.5x crop APS-C Leica 23mm F2, turns your S1H in Super 35mm mode into a very capable run & gun tool, minimal size and weight, 4K/60p.

On the Fp, that lens makes a nice replacement for an X100F or similar, for street photos, AF is ok. Price can be around $600 used if you search around for a while.

Panasonic 24-105mm is a match for the Sony E-mount rival and about the same price.

So it's not all bad.

5 minutes ago, Michi said:

Are we talking about the same cameras? eos r eos 1dx2?
The math is easy:

for eos r: 36 / 6720 * 3840 = 20.6 -> 36 / 20.6 = 1.75

for eos 1dx: 36 / 5472 * 4096 = 27 -> 36 / 27 = 1.33 

 

Well done you passed the math class.

You can't just assume every new Canon camera takes a 1:1 crop of the sensor.

Who knows what the 1D X Mark III will do. Pixel binning, 1:1, oversampling, it could be anything. Could even be 5K readout from 6K sensor and a smaller than 1.3x crop, like the old X-T2. You just don't know.

[Michael Steiner]

10 minutes ago, Andrew Reid said:

Well done you passed the math class.

I'm very proud of myself. 

11 minutes ago, Andrew Reid said:

You can't just assume every new Canon camera takes a 1:1 crop of the sensor.

But it has to be a crop for raw recording right?  isn't 4k raw on a 24-28mp sensor only doable through sensor cropping?

[Video Hummus]

The big question is: if Canon is the only one of the big boys (Sony, Nikon, Panasonic, Fuji) to be able to do internal RAW will Canon be able to capitalize on it and not fuck it up?

An EOS R successor with internal Cinema RAW Light, DPAF, and a price under $3000 would make very big waves.

They would have two big exclusives: the much loved DPAF and a compressed raw codec in Cinema RAW Light. They just need to put it in a mirrorless camera. Will they?

Canon reversing the stupid 24p cripple and now offering internal RAW, albeit in a DSLR and at $6000, is a big turn around. Maybe they finally realized they needed to up their game.

[Mokara]

2 hours ago, Michi said:

The size of the crop with this cameras is determined by the sensors resolution. 8mp crop from 20mp sensor is a smaller crop than 8mp crop from 30mp sensor. That‘s just mathematics...

How do you account for oversampling then? 

An oversampled image will use more pixels, but it is the processors bandwidth capabilities that determine if that can be done or not. If you don't have the bandwidth you can't oversample, and if you can't oversample then you have to either lineskip/pixel bin or use a crop.

[Michael Steiner]

4 minutes ago, Mokara said:

How do you account for oversampling then? 

 

What oversampling? We are talking about the dam crop on the eos r and 1dx2. 
do you even read what i write or just stop after half a sentence?

[wolf33d]

14 hours ago, Andrew Reid said:

What makes it better than the S1H?

The Canon badge?

Or is it the $6000 price?

The AF. Much better than S1H. A deal breaker for me and for many on the S1H. 
But the 1DX size is a deal breaker for me (so is the price). 

So I am still waiting for that FF 4K60 10 bit no crop camera. Last hope in the near term is on Sony A7SIII. Let's see. 

[Ed_David]

According to newsshooter it does RAW lite internally. This camera, along with the c500 mark ii seems to mark a new era for Canon.  Alexa-like dynamic range and skintones.  Full frame.  Compact.  I have a lot of optimism for Canon.

[User]

DPAF ok. But what about an important practical aid like focus peeking?

Any info on audio?