Jim Jannard steps down from RED

[nathlas]

15 hours ago, Emanuel said:

What a poison such internet can be... *sigh* Fortunately, there's real world out there.

Indeed.

They skip the fact that we are talking about technology and sales plus innovation to cine industry.

Like we are Judges to judge if someone is a good or bad boss on his employees and like we are medical citics to investigate if someone has serious health issues or he is just tired and focus on his personal life.

We are here for other reasons.

[Emanuel]

He's a legend made by himself. Without him, we'd never have the prices as low as we have today. I heard this from the mouth of a Sony VP in person. The story on his health needs which taken him away to his deserved retirement is not new BTW. Just made public now. He's a warrior, this fight has years. He didn't stop, he kept it going.

As well his inventive market introductions. Massively distributed. Ahead of his time. Unique master of his craft. An example but for every producer. He is one of the key factors of the digital revolution. We owe him our tools of nowadays.

 

We really should appreciate gratitude. It's disgusting otherwise.

[ntblowz]

I think I should really thank Harvey Wolfenstein and Kevin Spacey for their wonderful films, without them the cinema world is definitely less interesting.

 

Thanks to RED to keep us stuck with H.264! I am really thankful!

[Emanuel]

I'm sorry my fellow of boards, but such comparisons are truly unfair to say the least.

I've had my portion of personal contact with his people, work and company for a decade and a half now. Without mention to have had the privilege of private touch with the legend himself. Such antihero portrait is crappy lower resolution at best. Myth. Stinky sad one. Maybe if he would be a fool, he would equally bashed by usual detractors in a way or another.

It doesn't make justice to the individual who some other people have dealt with for real in the world over here.

 

On your compressed RAW remark, let's see:

They were the beginners to do it. Any doubt? Nothing else counts for the matter.

Would you do it in a different way? In the name of who or what?

They only protect their property.

[Emanuel]

*be bashed

[nathlas]

4 hours ago, Emanuel said:

He's a legend made by himself. Without him, we'd never have the prices as low as we have today. I heard this from the mouth of a Sony VP in person.

Υoung people doesn't seem to understand this.

They live in the era where they can buy 6k camera or 5k or 4k with 1000$.

They propably do not remember well around 2007 where Red  launched RedOne at a cost(15k$) of a Sony Cinealta's screw ? (Sony F23 and F35 cost was over 100k$) and deliver for first time RAW files when Empress Arri delivered D21 one year later (total disaster) and 3 years later first Alexa. Don't mention how many years later they introduced ArriRaw.

[tupp]

4 hours ago, nathlas said:

They propably do not remember well around 2007 where Red  launched RedOne at a cost(15k$) of a Sony Cinealta's screw ? (Sony F23 and F35 cost was over 100k$) and deliver for first time RAW files

RED was not the first to offer a cinema camera that shot 4K raw -- that distinction goes to Dalsa.  Dalsa introduced their 4K raw camera at the 2003 NAB.

 

At any rate, 4K raw and compressed raw were inevitable and obvious in the cinema world.  At the Dalsa 2003 launch, raw files and the megapixels war had already been around for years in the still photo world.  So, it doesn't take a genius to simply apply such notions to moving pictures.

 

In regards to RED's wavelet compression, it had already been established in JPEG2000.  So, it doesn't take a huge mental leap to merely apply the same compression method to another video format.

 

[newfoundmass]

9 hours ago, ntblowz said:

I think I should really thank Harvey Wolfenstein and Kevin Spacey for their wonderful films, without them the cinema world is definitely less interesting.

 

Thanks to RED to keep us stuck with H.264! I am really thankful!

I'm not arguing that he's a great person, but comparing him to people accused of sexual assault is pretty unfair.

[nathlas]

2 hours ago, tupp said:

RED was not the first to offer a cinema camera that shot 4K raw -- that distinction goes to Dalsa.  Dalsa introduced their 4K raw camera at the 2003 NAB.

Has anyone in here bought any Dalsa camera ?  ?

 In case you don't remember Dalsa's rental price was 3k$/day !!!  

How it compares with 15k$ to own RedOne ? 

Jannard's revolution made those camera affordable to all of us .

[tupp]

1 hour ago, nathlas said:

Has anyone in here bought any Dalsa camera ?  ?

Has anyone here bought a Panavision DXL?  ?

 

Whether or not someone on this site bought something has no reflection on the innovation nor quality of the item in question.

 

 

1 hour ago, nathlas said:

 In case you don't remember Dalsa's rental price was 3k$/day !!!  

I don't think that I ever actually knew what the rental prices were on any one of the different Dalsa 4K raw cameras.

 

Nevertheless, Dalsa was offering 4K raw long before it was even a glint in Jannard's eye.

 

Keep in mind that the first ones to break ground usually incur the most development cost and sink the most resources into a type of product.  So, initially, a new type of product is usually very expensive.  Often, someone with deep pockets sees the development, and swoops into a market to take advantage of it (and gets all the credit).

 

 

1 hour ago, nathlas said:

How it compares with 15k$ to own RedOne ?

How does that $15K, very late-to-market, buggy RED One compare to a $1,500 Pocket4K?

 

Do you see how that works?

 

 

1 hour ago, nathlas said:

Jannard's revolution made those camera affordable to all of us .

Jannard just rode a wave.  Raw video and higher resolutions were inevitable in cinema cameras, as was raw compression.  He didn't invent really anything.

[cam1982]

Sure not, the guy didn't create Oakley either. Just hype. A perfect hoax. Maybe we too and didn't notice yet.

[tupp]

30 minutes ago, cam1982 said:

Sure not, the guy didn't create Oakley either.

Well, he certainly didn't invent tacky sunglasses and ugly shirts.

 

 

31 minutes ago, cam1982 said:

Just hype.

Promo-wear has built-in hype, just because it is part of the fashion industry.  On the other hand, the sunglasses and shirts probably didn't get as much hype as the RED One, which was vaporware for about 3 years.

 

 

32 minutes ago, cam1982 said:

A perfect hoax.

The RED founder and "hoax" mentioned in the same post?  Oh, the irony...

 

 

34 minutes ago, cam1982 said:

Maybe we too and didn't notice yet.

Some guy made a video about RED's special drives.  I think he noticed something.

[greenscreen]

Some guy came to earth and terrestrials decided to replace their God. The old Olympus has changed, is not worthy anymore. Yet never existed. Bad memory you ungrateful bunch of the same class of humans have.

[Ed_David]

I love Jim's quote so much!

[Video Hummus]

Well, I’m just hoping RED will release some compelling sub $5000 cameras.

[Danyyyel]

23 hours ago, Emanuel said:

He's a legend made by himself. Without him, we'd never have the prices as low as we have today. I heard this from the mouth of a Sony VP in person. The story on his health needs which taken him away to his deserved retirement is not new BTW. Just made public now. He's a warrior, this fight has years. He didn't stop, he kept it going.

As well his inventive market introductions. Massively distributed. Ahead of his time. Unique master of his craft. An example but for every producer. He is one of the key factors of the digital revolution. We owe him our tools of nowadays.

 

We really should appreciate gratitude. It's disgusting otherwise.

It depends on which camera market buyer you where. If you where in the Cine line of 30-100k camera, yes Red was a game changer. But for me anyone lower it was the Large Sensor Dslr market that was a game changer for anyone below that. If we have all the Canon, Sony, Pana large sensor camera in the 5 to 15K it is because of the accident that was the Canon 5d video.

[nathlas]

27 minutes ago, Danyyyel said:

It depends on which camera market buyer you where. If you where in the Cine line of 30-100k camera, yes Red was a game changer. But for me anyone lower it was the Large Sensor Dslr market that was a game changer for anyone below that. If we have all the Canon, Sony, Pana large sensor camera in the 5 to 15K it is because of the accident that was the Canon 5d video.

Correction if you permit.

 

There was not any Cine line of 30k-100k camera at that time.

All serious digital cameras were priced above 100k.

[Emanuel]

2 hours ago, Danyyyel said:

It depends on which camera market buyer you where. If you where in the Cine line of 30-100k camera, yes Red was a game changer. But for me anyone lower it was the Large Sensor Dslr market that was a game changer for anyone below that. If we have all the Canon, Sony, Pana large sensor camera in the 5 to 15K it is because of the accident that was the Canon 5d video.

Yes, you're also right. Even though, let's not forget RED helped to 5DII came out as well as nathlas accurately left expressed, the most closer serious contender by then was EUR 103,000 (Cinealta F900) I well recall if not else because I was in the middle of a cooperative project only to afford one unit.

I myself jumped out the RED wagon as far as investment concerns when 5DII just arrived. My purchase is from early 2009 and I even produced a feature shot on this camera model among several other projects shot on VDSLR as called then, this one ending where we aimed for once shot directly to the big screen:

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?121856-Kickstarter-campaign

 

Still here are three threads by my initiative on reduser before I had joined Andrew when he created our community. The last one on a film-out report. The 2nd one counts among others with the participation of Graeme Nattress himself (the man behind RED's compressed RAW):

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?20506-More-Canon-5D-Mark-II-footage

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?22403-New-Canon-5D-Mark-II-samples

http://www.reduser.net/forum/showthread.php?29404-5D-Mark-II

[Waynes]

On 10/25/2019 at 8:51 PM, Andrew Reid said:

While in Berlin earlier this month, I bought a Hydrogen, to see what it's like.

Graeme Nattress and his engineering team at RED are good guys, what they achieved is and always will remain special.

The Hydrogen has nice colour science by Nattress in 4K video and stills mode.

It's got an interesting design, stands out around normal smartphones. I'll keep hold of it and maybe cover it on the blog some day.

The 3D effect was not for me. Interesting technology, but some years off having the impact I expected from it.

You're awfully positive on Red all of a sudden Andrew.  What happened?  I hated what was done to you.

To Red.

On 10/26/2019 at 8:31 PM, Emanuel said:

He's a legend made by himself. Without him, we'd never have the prices as low as we have today. I heard this from the mouth of a Sony VP in person.

Aheadof his time. Unique master of his craft. An example but for every producer. He is one of the key factors of the digital revolution. We owe him our tools of nowadays.

 

We really should appreciate gratitude. It's disgusting otherwise.

You could say the same about me, maybe more accurately.

[Kisaha]

The guy didn't create anything. He obviously is/was a good businessman, did a great investment on motion picture cameras and succeeded for some years, now that they are free falling, he is the one taking the only parachute on that airplane (Red). 

Whatever made Red great (mostly overpretending patents, good lawyers and massively overpriced hardware) are almost done.

Anyway, whatever. He is not my friend, he is not my enemy. He certainly had a great time in this planet and a lot more resources to enjoy his retirement than most of us (or all of us together!) will ever have.

Godspeed!