Jim Jannard steps down from RED

[Emanuel]

I never found that 'subject to change' policy much appealing to tell you quite frankly. I also understand life is a constant move anyway. I believe he intended to to something and his plans have changed. Hope not for health reasons now become public.

This leads to some disappointments for sure. From my own experience I guess if the customer will address such concern to the company they will properly try to respond in the best fair way they can. It happened with me and others in the past. No complaints. On the contrary.

[Ed_David]

9 minutes ago, Emanuel said:

I never found that 'subject to change' policy much appealing to tell you quite frankly. I also understand life is a constant move anyway. I believe he intended to to something and his plans have changed. Hope not for health reasons now become public.

This leads to some disappointments for sure. From my own experience I guess if the customer will address such concern to the company they will properly try to respond in the best fair way they can. It happened with me and others in the past. No complaints. On the contrary.

If I spent $1300 on a phone that was promised as a revolutionary way to control the red, and then it didn't.

Then promised I would get a deal in return for the hydrogen 2.  Then told that the hydrogen 2 is over and that the president and backer of the hydrogen 2 is retiring, I would be very, very, very upset.

You maybe extraordinary in how you treat red.  You may also be confusing the company with a form of friendship and community that overrides any anger and loss if you lose thousands of dollars.

Personally, I think, and would argue most people would think - that cameras should just be products, not groups of friendship . That way they cannot do these type of business practices and get away with it.

Imagine people forming a community around a brand of a hammer.

But of course, I get it.

We are all very tribal.  You are personally (online) friends with the president of the company.  I would be defensive as well if I think that the company's president is my friend.

That is all okay.  I completely understand.  

I never got to that point with Sony or Canon or Convergent Design, even though I got to know a few key employees.  But I didn't talk up when they did some things I wasn't the biggest fan of either.  Like when I bought $6000 worth of slog licensing for my sony f3, then they made it free without giving a partial rebate at least.

[Emanuel]

I understand you're trying to decode RED camera company business on their practices and marketing strategies ; )

My contact with this company and the men behind is beyond our own 'online lives' if we can call it like that... LOL : )

I placed money of mine and my partners in their product to match dozens of commercial contacts between two sides of a business relationship as natural as any other going on with other parties. Real money, euros and dollars, not even cryptos!

: D

I had the chance to attend several meetings promoted by the brand. In one of them in Rome I even brought with me 5% of the people who attended the event. One of them is today one of the most promises of Italian cinema of nowadays. A former colleague who I met in my Master in Rome more than two decades ago. A friend I am used to be with, even in family inner circles. Not the case of RED team members, never happened, but I can surely confirm I've had the pleasure to personally meet and even talk about life in general with a few of them, that is, off topic not necessarily camera related.

As usually happens with people we meet in our course of life. In my case since Moscow where I lived to New Zealand where I've produced. Without mention several friends we have in common in real life.

[greenscreen]

They're very strong on their marketing, this produces antibodies. Here they are.

[Emanuel]

Very true. But they're also bringing new opportunities. Speaking of devil, this digital society we live nowadays has proportioned fresh connections to help our craft. Not only with open chances for business, artistic collaborations but also at a personal backyard. I've had the happiness to enjoy the arrival of new people to my life, sometimes at the distance of different time zones as happened with those coming across this RED project which developed new communities of users or from further online corners such as this one among other ones for sure : ) To be extended at a personal level whether when we have the joy to personally meet someone or as simple as a banal exchange birthday wishes. Well, one of my industry partners has two children, impossible to have occurred those particular two kids if not along the advent of so riddling and ambiguous Internet... LOL : -P

[Ed_David]

You seem like a very nice, innocent person, Emanuel! I mean that as a compliment.  

Here in America, things are very nasty.  People are nasty.  Brutish.

We are having a major class war.

 Many of us have a different view on billionares and job innovators. We distrust silicon valley.  We distrust pharmacuticals.  We distrust heads of energy companies and goverment leaders. We distrust the mainstream media.  We distrust until we are proven right.  

 

We trust whistleblowers.  We trust contrarians and outcasts and outsiders and artists and musicians and intellectuals and writers.  We distrust the "great" figures of our past history.

It's a crazy time to be alive.  That the majority is like me.  That we live in a topsy-turvy world.

I do wish sometimes I could be like you, where I have trust in deeper trust, unbonding love for billionaires and leaders.   But for me, that's over.  This is the era of #metoo and subversion and anger at the leadership class.

The world is dying.

The planet is dying.

Due to billionares not using their money to do the right thing.  People like the Koch brothers who use it to destroy the planet.

This time is now.  

BYE!

I need to stop responding to you.  I feel like I am talking to a wall.  I rather be playing Zelda: Breath of the Wild.

 

[Emanuel]

LOL I wish Ed, believe me, I wish : ) Good one anyway : D Please don't let my dark side to pop up or we risk to wake up the tribe of a certain orange man ; ) and a few will jump here and begin to call me bad names as racist at a certain point I will need to start to apologize for the sake of my own reputation! haha ; -)

 

Jokes aside, no, unfortunately, we are not in majority, at least with power to change the planet. We actually need to be with our eyes wide open in this contemporary universe we all live in, I concur.

This is nothing new though. It's only to take a glance on History, the world has always been a complex riddle indeed. A wall BTW is just too flat, we already know is not the case of the (same) globe we all share ; -)

[Belle]

 

[cam1982]

Can't pass that. ?

 

[Mokara]

On 10/25/2019 at 4:43 AM, sanveer said:

Hopefully the RAW patent will be a lost suit, and RED will miraculously turn honest, and work towards a wider reach for its products. RED could never have succeeded with Hydrogen because it attempted to beat Apple and Samsung at a game they themselves are losing. Also to assume that last generation smartphone sensors and processors can equal or beat much larger cameras was ludicrous to begin with.

Smartphone Sensors and Computational Photography will improve substantially in 2020. Also I am guessing if RED loses the compressed RAW suit, the chances of smartphones moving from the present 10-bit 422 to compressed RAW is also pretty high. 

There was zero chance that they would have been able to beat Apple or Samsung, they are far from being dinosaur companies. It was hubris for RED to think otherwise. Cell phones are a lot more than just cameras, and the cameras on those cell phones are more than good enough for their market space.

[Emanuel]

Yeah, I think this shows how committed this man was to innovate no matter the consequences. The idea that why he is a billionaire, he has to be focus on earnings exclusively from a material aim viewpoint doesn't seem to my eyes in touch with reality at all. Without mention no money in the world would bring him happier at his stage of his life and age.

His need to care of his health was already known among his private circle, just not public yet. Who closer has been in personal touch with RED family ; ) already had information about. And not exactly from supposed 'online friendships' : D as free guesswork can try to yet fulfill the cup ; -)

The most funny is to see how some personal dislike to not mention hate can put people to enter in denial about something out of their control or knowledge. It is quite possible health issues had put him away of Hydrogen project. Other than to complain, why not Hydrogen 2 backers, if any, don't enter in contact with the company to try resolving their business matters? Jim's announcement has just a few days... In any case, I understand the disappointment of Hydrogen adopters. For some reason, I passed that one. I'd rather wait for any product when mature enough to prevent me from buyer's remorse. Unless you realize strictly under a business strategy you'll able to have a solid no brainer advantage in your hands as certain chances can be.

[greenscreen]

If you want to change the world, start off by making your bed. 

“Make Your Bed”
by Admiral William H. McRaven

[Ed_David]

deleted

[Emanuel]

Ed, I can understand you have your reasons to complain on their business practices and marketing. Nothing against. They are not perfect. Nobody is. The fact I can concur with one or another points of your criticism, this doesn't mean I am totally there. On the contrary, I think it's clear I actually see your description too dark to match reality to tell you quite frankly.

My participation on reduser is utterly public so you're entitled to evaluate by your own : -) Marketing or other issues in the way the brand runs their forum is absolutely responsibility of the administrators of the site. It's their choice. I don't think it is much different of some others. OK, RED sales are based in that community in a way other manufacturers were not able to build up. I guess it should be more as a Jarred's achievement than the reverse. I realize you don't agree but did you mind to already ask to some other contenders of their own? I did and believe me, Jarred would love to listen the feedback I've heard through these years. And Jim, a positive vote or recognition of the certitude of his bet if he needed to hear, I doubt.

Life is not B&W. And a lot of what I'm reading there in your post now it is completely new to me. I can't surely confirm or deny what I obviously don't know. My private communication with RED people or other users is 100% personal and responding on your inquiry, because there's nothing to hide, such contact is made from unilateral relations, there are no facebook groups where I had ever participated. I don't even use it. Seems a bit ridiculous to have to mention but once you ask, I don't mind to answer you as direct as you address your questions.

My business and friendly ties with people there, it is merely based on personal empathy of our own towards each other. As natural as any other particular communication we have with friends made along the life of all of us. Living close or abroad. I bet your case, as well : ) For your information, any camera discussion related, RED included, is even secondary in our talks.

Hope this helps to satisfy your curiosity at least as far as myself concerns about my RED connections : D

 

PS: LOL I see you've deleted your post. Too late, I'm sorry, once mine is posted now : ) Chill out man, it's agree to disagree here. No rocket science to see. Only your imagerie and talent matters to me. Debate should always be welcome to have something to learn no matter how much we can diverge : ) On something we can concur though @Ed_David, to ban discordant voices or yes men in any cult not even blessed by my church! : P Free spirit stands as our utmost stronghold.

[Ed_David]

happy hallowean!

[Emanuel]

1 hour ago, Ed_David said:

Emmanuel I appreciate your calmness in our conversation.

I am not here to "agree to disagree" - I'm here now to try to understand you.  To understand a passionate reduser and your worldview and how, after all that has happened, you continue to think Jannard is a great entrapaneur.

Now I have more of a picture, plus I recalled a PM conversation we had about a certain successful dslr blogger who was accused of domestic violence by his ex-wife and ex-girlfriend and remember you jumping to his side, claiming that the women are most likely lying.  That helps complete my picture of you!

So that helps with that as well.

Good day my friend!

May you enjoy your relationships with the red team!

And remember, don't say anything bad about them or they could refuse to fix your cameras!

 

No, I could NEVER infer that from women, I love them!

What I told you was the fact we didn't know both sides of the story.

All story has two sides as we all know : ) At times, we tend to forget because of our passionate views ; )

I profoundly condemn domestic violence or any kind of unjustified violence. Let alone with helpless ones!

The point is at times the accuser is the offender. Two to three decades of legal perspective helped me to conclude that. I've just checked our friendly exchange of private messages between us and that was what I wrote to you.

Here is an excerpt of my text then: "Another note... don't believe in everything a supposed victim of domestic violence says about the aggressor. Because at times, she/he can be the first aggressor instead. Only to proclaim to be the victim in the end."

Take a 2nd glance there: "she/he" (and 'she' came first in that context, because the accuser was a 'she', only because of that).

You can't obviously know my life as me yours but for your information, I've already spent time and money to help people as someone working for me offering legal services totally pro bono. From my own. In 100%, not even my business related. Which means I give it because of what?

Injustice. I am very sensitive with that. I tend to jump when I immediately see anyone who can require that from my side.

My worldview is very particular of my own, of course. There are things I agree with you, some others don't. Something you'll never hear from me it will be to intentionally disrespect someone else because he thinks different of me. I am not perfect, nobody is. I try to guide my life and ethics for principles, though.

 

RED related, I have partners and close friends who are active redusers, I've already been too. Not so lately because of my recent investment options route. For some reason I am here. Without mention I have a friendly relation with the company and people there for years since the early beginning. And yes, I am loyal to my friends : ) As I could tell you before, I've had the chance to personally meet them and I've even collaborated with them in the past to organize their presence in one of the towns where I operate (Rome, Italy).

 

I understand you have a negative opinion. I don't mind. It's not even my business. I think you're obviously entitled to be a critic of your choices. Nothing against that. I just beg your pardon to not infer abusive considerations about me or whoever else. As same as I do with everyone, even myself if I got my mistake when happens. We all commit errors for sure. Judgement is also a very sensitive matter. Nobody is infallible, that includes the Pope too! : -D

 

 

PS -- LOL You retracted your post again! You're a danger! haha : ) I had to quote you this time to not play the part of a fool! : D Happy halloween to you too! (E : -)

[Ed_David]

9 hours ago, Emanuel said:

 

 

....

This is now my last post on eoshd.  I seem to not be able to handle social media.  I really gave it a good try.  But I can't.  Just not a good way to talk to someone.  Everything is heightened.  Apology to you Emanuel!

Bye all.

[Emanuel]

6 hours ago, Ed_David said:

....

 

Didn't read it, just arrived now. Already responded you to your private message there. I think it's welcome not to heat up our arguments. The world would be a boring place if we all choose the yellow anyway : D At a personal level, only understanding and respect can bring some add-on to any discussion wherever it is, whatever the topic is : -)

On RED, I am sad when I see such battle field connected with. As peace lover but not a fool, I always try to give my input to bring any common angle in-between where all of us can develop ourselves, me included. I don't believe in Adonis.

 

6 hours ago, Ed_David said:

This is now my last post on eoshd.  I seem to not be able to handle social media.  I really gave it a good try.  But I can't.  Just not a good way to talk to someone.  Everything is heightened.  Apology to you Emanuel!

Bye all.

I've just written you on private once again. No need to feel like that, c'mon, you have your point of view on the world around you. Brings debate. In a way or another we listen the other side. Food for thought. There are no perfect people. We all learn to each other. You have your style and temper. So what? I'm still reading you and paying attention to your posts. Hope to keep going to feel your presence, no matter what. I love to include, never exclusion makes my day. Reason why bans and alike are not my cup of tea : ) I'm even used to call you when politics emerge as necessary, you the customary rebel of eoshd or when some work of art of yours deserves to be repeatedly appreciated, not long ago in these same pages.

Also because some of your approach, political... artistically wise (possible to dissociate?), it is nothing we should ignore.

Becoming (I mean, becoming anything) is a painful concept. For all : -)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Becoming_(philosophy)

[majoraxis]

I miss Ed David already...

[thebrothersthre3]

Gah social media is messy. I have a strong dislike for RED's business practices. That said Emanuel is probably one of the least aggressive people on here.