Screw buying new cameras, after salivating over cine lens tests I'm spending real money on lenses

[heart0less]

Just FYI.
( :
 

[kye]

@heart0less that's very interesting because out of all the mega-dollar cine lens tests I've seen so far I don't recall there being a single Panavision lens amongst them.  Of course, maybe one or two escaped my attention, but not enough to make me remember them.

In the above:

• Panavision = 29
• ARRI = 12
• Cooke = 7
• Angenieux = 4
• the rest only got 1...  

Maybe we should buy Panavision lenses and it will make us automatically famous....  on second thoughts, I can't find a singe cine Panavision lens for sale.  I guess it's beyond those things where the price says "if you have to ask it's too much" and all the way to "if you don't know where to ask then it's too much"!!!

[leslie]

10 minutes ago, kye said:

@heart0less that's very interesting because out of all the mega-dollar cine lens tests I've seen so far I don't recall there being a single Panavision lens amongst them.  Of course, maybe one or two escaped my attention, but not enough to make me remember them.

In the above:

• Panavision = 29
• ARRI = 12
• Cooke = 7
• Angenieux = 4
• the rest only got 1...  

Maybe we should buy Panavision lenses and it will make us automatically famous....  on second thoughts, I can't find a singe cine Panavision lens for sale.  I guess it's beyond those things where the price says "if you have to ask it's too much" and all the way to "if you don't know where to ask then it's too much"!!!

i was disappointed to see that the pentax m42 series never made the list  ?

[heart0less]

39 minutes ago, leslie said:

i was disappointed to see that the pentax m42 series never made the list  ?

Or Helios 44.

(( :

45 minutes ago, kye said:

on second thoughts, I can't find a singe cine Panavision lens for sale.

I think I read somewhere that you can't own them - they are only meant for rental.
/ :

[noone]

3 hours ago, kye said:

@heart0less that's very interesting because out of all the mega-dollar cine lens tests I've seen so far I don't recall there being a single Panavision lens amongst them.  Of course, maybe one or two escaped my attention, but not enough to make me remember them.

In the above:

• Panavision = 29
• ARRI = 12
• Cooke = 7
• Angenieux = 4
• the rest only got 1...  

Maybe we should buy Panavision lenses and it will make us automatically famous....  on second thoughts, I can't find a singe cine Panavision lens for sale.  I guess it's beyond those things where the price says "if you have to ask it's too much" and all the way to "if you don't know where to ask then it's too much"!!!

 

https://www.premiumbeat.com/blog/just-how-expensive-are-real-cinema-lenses/

 

Quote from the above link...

 

"Panavision does not sell any standalone lenses. If a studio wants to purchase the lenses, they are usually restricted to purchasing them with a camera like the Panavision Genesis. For this bundle, one would be looking at shelling out $500,000-$750,000 to purchase or $4000.00/day to rent."

[heart0less]

[mercer]

On 12/14/2019 at 9:26 PM, noone said:

Field curvature can make a big difference I think and some subjects it would be a pain with and others maybe just what you want.       There was an article i saw recently (might have been Lens Rentals?) where I saw it mentioned some lenses transition from out of to in focus very sharply (which would more likely be better more expensive lenses) and that might account more for "3D pop" so a lens that does that AND has field curvature flattering to a subject might be gold (and cost its weight in it).

I agree. When I hear the phrase, field curvature, I instantly think of the Zeiss 28mm f/2 "Hollywood" lens. By measurement standards, the lens is actually poorly rated but it has that "magical" quality that can be attributed to field curvature and probably some micro contrast to deliver that 3D Pop.

This is why I'm such a big fan of Zeiss lenses. The Rollei Zeiss, Contax Zeiss and the ZF Classics offer an affordable entryway into, almost, cinema quality glass with the character that's synonymous with a perfectly, imperfect image.

On 12/14/2019 at 9:26 PM, noone said:

Still trying to find more mentions and uses for the Minolta 24mm VFC lens that actually varies its field curvature....they go for ridiculous amounts on Enay 

I don't know that lens, but it sounds pretty damn cool. I'm a huge fan of Minolta lenses. One of the biggest drawbacks of going EF mount was losing the ability to use my Minolta lenses. I sold a lot of them but even bought one that was EF modified and plan on making Minolta to EF mods a side hobby now that I have settled on my humble lens collection. I have a 55mm 1.7 in mint condition that cost me 15 bucks. It doesn't seem too difficult to mod. And I need to figure out why the 35mm 1.8 (one of my favorite lenses of all time) I bought won't focus past 3-4 feet. It feels like there may be something inside the lens blocking the helicoid. I just need to find the right screwdriver to open it up with. So far, no micro screwdriver I tried is the right size.

[mercer]

9 hours ago, kye said:

@heart0less that's very interesting because out of all the mega-dollar cine lens tests I've seen so far I don't recall there being a single Panavision lens amongst them.  Of course, maybe one or two escaped my attention, but not enough to make me remember them.

In the above:

• Panavision = 29
• ARRI = 12
• Cooke = 7
• Angenieux = 4
• the rest only got 1...  

Maybe we should buy Panavision lenses and it will make us automatically famous....  on second thoughts, I can't find a singe cine Panavision lens for sale.  I guess it's beyond those things where the price says "if you have to ask it's too much" and all the way to "if you don't know where to ask then it's too much"!!!

I remember reading somewhere that a lot of Panavision lenses are rebranded and tweaked but I don't remember where I read it or what they rebrand.

[mercer]

6 hours ago, noone said:

 

https://www.premiumbeat.com/blog/just-how-expensive-are-real-cinema-lenses/

 

Quote from the above link...

 

"Panavision does not sell any standalone lenses. If a studio wants to purchase the lenses, they are usually restricted to purchasing them with a camera like the Panavision Genesis. For this bundle, one would be looking at shelling out $500,000-$750,000 to purchase or $4000.00/day to rent."

I wonder what the prices are to rent just their lenses? If a lot of DPs were using the Genesis, then the popularity of the Panavision primes would make a lot of sense because of the bundle.

With that said, Panavision lenses are amazing and I believe they source and tweak their lenses for individual needs.

[Julien416]

The genesis is basically a f35 with a panavision logo on it. Nobody uses it anymore. 

The rent quotes aren't that high, at least where I live. I've worked a lot with them and they indeed are the best of the bunch.

Older pana anamorphics are supposedly rebranded minolta / nikon or cookes glasses with from god know where anamorphic glasses (I've read that shiga provided some of them) 

[mercer]

19 minutes ago, Julien416 said:

Older pana anamorphics are supposedly rebranded minolta / nikon or cookes glasses with from god know where anamorphic glasses (I've read that shiga provided some of them) 

Interesting. I wonder what their process is/was for choosing which glass to use to build their lenses.

I must admit, I am just getting interested in proper cinema lenses, not that I can afford any of them, but reading about them has been fun.

[noone]

2 hours ago, mercer said:

 

I don't know that lens, but it sounds pretty damn cool. I'm a huge fan of Minolta lenses. 

https://www.rokkorfiles.com/24mm VFC.htm

[IronFilm]

21 hours ago, kye said:

Maybe we should buy Panavision lenses and it will make us automatically famous....  on second thoughts, I can't find a singe cine Panavision lens for sale.  I guess it's beyond those things where the price says "if you have to ask it's too much" and all the way to "if you don't know where to ask then it's too much"!!!

They're not for sale. They're rental only. 

Which is also perhaps a reason why they're so often on these top lists, because productions don't ever own cameras, they rent them. 

And what is one of those major rental houses? Panavision! 

Makes sense they'd rent the lenses from the same places as the camera bodies. 

 

[kye]

Thanks to @noone for posting that link to lensrentals - that article completely changed the way I think about DoF and lenses.  I hadn't previously made the link that field curvature is actually a map of DoF, so that's hugely useful.  It also has a number of very significant consequences, and may help to join together DoF, field curvature, the FF look, how an image transitions between in-focus areas and out-of-focus areas, and 3D pop.

I'm contemplating and will return with my thoughts once I've re-adjusted my head and worked out what this means.

[IronFilm]

6 hours ago, kye said:

Thanks to @noone for posting that link to lensrentals - that article completely changed the way I think about DoF and lenses.  I hadn't previously made the link that field curvature is actually a map of DoF, so that's hugely useful.  It also has a number of very significant consequences, and may help to join together DoF, field curvature, the FF look, how an image transitions between in-focus areas and out-of-focus areas, and 3D pop.

Thanks for highlighting that link from @noone , I'll need to remember to check out that article when I've got time. 

https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2019/11/practical-use-of-field-curvature-graphs-the-50mm-primes/

[Mako Sports]

Olympus 50mm F1.8 Zuiko is becoming my favorite lens. Just wanted to film some practice shots at work to color grade later, but the sharpness still amazes me. I held off buying this lens for like a year, regret it. 

The shot of the second helmet is just a split grade so that's why half of the shot is ungraded. Used muh A7iii

[EthanAlexander]

Today I learned: Buying the "sharpest" lenses available according to, for instance, DXO Mark scores, doesn't necessarily mean I'll see any of that detail because there are different frequencies of sharpness.

"All of the fields I’ve shown you have been at 30 lp/mm frequency, which is a good ‘overall’ picture. It’s important to remember, though, that depth of field, as well as sharpness, varies with frequency. (For those who aren’t up on this, lower frequency is more about larger objects and lower resolution sensors. Higher frequencies are about small detail and higher resolution sensors. If you want a contrasty object on a 24 megapixel sensor, 20 lp/mm is good. If you want to look at leaves or blades of grass on a 50 megapixel sensor, you probably are interested in 60 lp/mm.)" 

(From the same lens rental link @noone posted https://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2019/11/practical-use-of-field-curvature-graphs-the-50mm-primes/)

[seku]

heck, if lenses were more affordable. i would go that route immediably... i fell in love with the xelmus lenses.

Being a hobbyist, i will stick with scopes a while longer tho 

[zerocool22]

48 minutes ago, seku said:

heck, if lenses were more affordable. i would go that route immediably... i fell in love with the xelmus lenses.

Being a hobbyist, i will stick with scopes a while longer tho 

Yeah exactly, 2020 is going to be my rental year. On cooler projects, Im gonna skip my fee and just rent nicer lenses. Which is going to be better for my portfolio anyhow.  

[heart0less]

 

Once more it's quite evident that the beloved classics and cine lenses have some slight green tint to them.
Do you remember Potato Jet's video? Same story.

It almost look like Leicas have some Pro-Mist built in, too.
They resolve much detail, but in a subtle way..

But, in the end, Sigma 18-35 is one single lens, which can stay on your camera all day. It's also much more easier to get one in a great condition and is significantly cheaper than a set of Leicas.