Canon will be announcing a new Cinema EOS camera ahead of NAB in April

[IronFilm]

9 hours ago, barefoot_dp said:

I didn't say I'm seeing more of them - every shoot has a tripod there, even if it's just for resting the camera on. But in terms of what they're actually using on set, I'm seeing a lot more DP's/Directors that prefer to shoot the currently in-vogue handheld look, as opposed to the sticks & dolly style. And when they're shooting that style they use an Easyrig 100% of the time.

Might get a better ROI out of owning an Easyrig too than a tripod?
 

[independent]

 

On 2/29/2020 at 8:12 PM, barefoot_dp said:

When shooting drama or commercials, I'd say most guys are using an easyrig more than a tripod or dolly these days, given the handheld look is very in vogue (this is coming from a 1st AC perspective). I worked with a lot of DP's who only own 2 bits of gear - an easyrig, and a SmallHD monitor. Everything else is rented but those two are the constants that they use on every shoot.
 

And I think that's really odd. "Most guys are using an easy rig more than a tripod or dolly on dramas and commercials?" That runs entirely contrary to my experience in the past six years on sets and locations around NYC (Brooklyn, queens, Manhattan). This ranges from productions from Netflix, HBO, A24, NBC, etc. to smaller, independent shoots. And a TON of commercials. Dollys, cranes, jibs, sticks, dominate shoots. If there's handheld, most of the time it's on the op's shoulder w/ AC pulling focus, and if there's tracking, a dolly grip behind the op. 

I don't think I have EVER seen an easyrig on any of these sets. I've seen a handful on documentary (I think Vice) over the years, but that's about it. I don't even see them on the music video shoots; I see way more gimbals or just handheld. For news gathering/event shooting, I see shoulder mount, tripods, and monopods. That's just my limited experience of course, but you might want to ask any grip, DP, or operator about the easyrig phenomenon taking over the world. 

On that note, why would so many Australian DP's own those two things (and just those two), an easyrig and smallHD monitors? I can understand a freelance camera operator perhaps owning one as a wet hire, but why would so many DPs? The production wouldn't provide a monitor and camera support for them?

“We’ll bring the Alexa; you bring the easyrig.”

”P.S. don’t forget the SmallHD monitor.”

[FranciscoB]

It's common to see young dp's with their own easyrig and monitor, as an easy rig is something you use all day and in terms of hygiene, i've heard that argument multiple times. As a monitor, it's about a tool that you use on several jobs, where cameras and lenses change but the tool where you're looking it's always the same, so it helps with consistency on judging an image, etc.

[IronFilm]

An easyrig isn't on every shoot, but it isn't rare either. Of course you're far far far more likely to see a tripod on a shoot. But I'd say it is roughly ish as likely as seeing a gimbal on set, still pretty damn common place. 

As for why a DoP might own one, might be another health reason of what if a production doesn't want to hire one but you want it? As they can really save your bag. It might not in the short term be NEEDED for that shoot, but in the long run (over a career lasting decades) it would be smart to use the easyrig on the shoot. Recently a friend of mine had back surgery, first thing he got after getting out of hospital, purchased an easyrig!

And @FranciscoB is exactly right about the monitor, it is such a crucial job of the DoP to judge and tweak the image, why wouldn't you want something which can help you accurately and consistently judge what you're seeing?

[barefoot_dp]

4 hours ago, independent said:

I see way more gimbals or just handheld

I can't imagine anybody doing a full day shoot handheld with a fully rigged Alexa mini, let alone with it on a gimbal. Shoulder mounted is great for run-n-gun doc work and eng, and certain scripted scenes where you know every thing will be at eye level, but you lose a lot of flexibility with height.

4 hours ago, independent said:

On that note, why would so many Australian DP's own those two things (and just those two), an easyrig and smallHD monitors?

Because it's familiar and comfortable. The easyrig is adjusted for them already. The foam padding is broken in and perfectly fits their shoulders and hips. And they might feel it is more hygienic as well. A monitor can be pre-loaded with LUTS and set up exactly how they want their custom functions, so no matter what camera they are shooting with they can be sure they are getting a consistent image, and always have the same focus and exposure tools available.

Sure, production will rent those things if they ask for it, but they often prefer their own because it's already set up the way they like, every time.
 

[IronFilm]

Even Sound Mixers are using Easyrigs now 😉

 

[FranciscoB]

13 hours ago, barefoot_dp said:

I can't imagine anybody doing a full day shoot handheld with a fully rigged Alexa mini, let alone with it on a gimbal. Shoulder mounted is great for run-n-gun doc work and eng, and certain scripted scenes where you know every thing will be at eye level, but you lose a lot of flexibility with height.

Because it's familiar and comfortable. The easyrig is adjusted for them already. The foam padding is broken in and perfectly fits their shoulders and hips. And they might feel it is more hygienic as well. A monitor can be pre-loaded with LUTS and set up exactly how they want their custom functions, so no matter what camera they are shooting with they can be sure they are getting a consistent image, and always have the same focus and exposure tools available.

Sure, production will rent those things if they ask for it, but they often prefer their own because it's already set up the way they like, every time.
 

They will often rent their gear ( easyrig, monitors, filters, etc ) to the production for a better price. As those are tools that are used regularly. It's familiar to the dp who can get more money with the gear and it's cheaper for the production. win win.

[independent]

What shows or productions have you guys worked on that use easyrig so extensively? I'm curious because the idea that most DP's are using easyrigs over traditional camera support comes across as such strong horseshit, I can't believe we're still talking about it. 

I'm almost certain that some of you are mistaking DP's for camera operators, and among camera operators, a very small minority. And of all productions, I would imagine easyrigs to be mostly limited to documentary, live events, and reality shows. And among them, only a minority.
 

 

[FranciscoB]

I'm not saying that.  My experience is with commercials, where most dp's I worked with had their own easyrig, monitor and filters. Everything else they rent on case by case basis. No, they're not always with the easyrig. No even close. But some jobs, when handheld is the aesthetic, they use their own thing. That's it. And I said young dp's in my first post.

[IronFilm]

On 3/6/2020 at 8:15 AM, independent said:

What shows or productions have you guys worked on that use easyrig so extensively? I'm curious because the idea that most DP's are using easyrigs over traditional camera support comes across as such strong horseshit, I can't believe we're still talking about it. 

You're misreading this, nobody is saying an easyrig is being used more often than anything else. 

[independent]

On 2/28/2020 at 5:21 PM, barefoot_dp said:

They're usually the go-to default tool for DP's getting the handheld look. I don't think I've done a single shoot on Arri or Red where the DP didn't use an Easyrig. You might not be a fan of them, and that's ok, but that doesn't mean that they aren't one of the most widely used tools on film sets worldwide.

 

On 2/29/2020 at 8:12 PM, barefoot_dp said:

When shooting drama or commercials, I'd say most guys are using an easyrig more than a tripod or dolly these days, given the handheld look is very in vogue (this is coming from a 1st AC perspective).

All horseshit and misinformation. 

[independent]

On 2/28/2020 at 11:07 PM, IronFilm said:

I've seen easyrigs on sets of all sizes, from a small no budget short films to sets for netflix series 

Interesting. What "sets of Netflix series" have you have worked on that used easyrigs? 

[IronFilm]

A few links from locally in NZ / Australia:
 

Quote

 A notable mention includes Greg Fraser ACS ASC (Zero Dark Thirty, Lion,) shooting with an Easyrig on Rogue One: A Star Wars Story (2016). Check out that story in our last issue. All you have to do is look around, they are everywhere and for good reason. The purchase was inevitable.

https://acmag.com.au/2017/03/01/easyrig-vario-5/

https://www.nzcine.com/7324131

 

I wouldn't go quite so far as @barefoot_dp (although in some niches/circles, he's right I'd suppose) and say they're almost always used, or that they're more common than dolly/tripods, but they're definitely very very popular and commonly used. 

[independent]

So you pulled one instance of ONE cinematographer who used an easyrig for ONE scene or ONE shot as evidence that it's a dominant, standard, or prevalent method of professional handheld shooting?

On top of it all, the piece you quoted misspelled Greig Fraser's name. Why would it bother spelling the DP's name right when it's clearly shilling?

By the way, the same (and phenomenal) Greig Fraser has used gimbals, the Movi15, drones, and all the regular traditional camera support that any competent DP would - whatever he feels right for the job. Including:

 

 

Lastly, still waiting for your response of easyrig's prevalence on the Netflix shows that you've worked on. If you simply google "behind the scenes Netflix," brace yourself. You might see a shocking lack of easyrigs. 

 

 

[independent]

On the other hand...

Here's Roger Deakins from Skyfall.

Shooting a moving train from his shoulder, TRACKING shot:

 

 

Emmanuel Lubezki on Birdman:

Interstellar (Imax):

Dunkirk:

Arrival (Bradford Young):

Witcher:

Handmaid's Tale:

 

Veep:

Marriage Story:

[IronFilm]

8 hours ago, independent said:

evidence that it's a dominant, standard, or prevalent method of professional handheld shooting?

As I've repeatedly said, am not at all making the claim it is the dominant tool of choice by DoPs, just that it is a commonly used one that isn't unusual to see. Just like all these other tools:
 

8 hours ago, independent said:

By the way, the same (and phenomenal) Greig Fraser has used gimbals, the Movi15, drones, and all the regular traditional camera support that any competent DP would - whatever he feels right for the job.

And on that we can agree. 

At this point I'm not even sure what even is exactly the point you're trying to make? Unless the point is that they're not used at all? (which is clearly wrong) Or is the point just to argue?

[BrooklynDan]

I work (and have worked) in multiple rental houses that have rented to all types of productions. Easyrigs get rented a lot, but mostly to commercials and branded content. They work great for getting that spontaneous, free-floating handheld look, shot-from-the-hip style that's prevalent now in ads, both on TV and stuff that get's aired on Youtube. It's also great for documentary work, since it allows to hold the camera for much longer periods of time. 20, 30, 40 minute handheld takes become much easier with an Easyrig.

For actual dramatic, narrative material, easyrigs are used much less. Dramatic cinematography relies on the ability to control your frame and land precisely on marks. This is really hard to do with an Easyrig because it tends to swing the camera when you turn. Also, extended handheld tracking shots are impossible because when you walk with an Easyrig, the motion from your hips gets transmitted through the arm and is visible in the footage. There is a use for the Easyrig for helping with low-angle handheld shots with really heavy rigs (such as Alexa 65, or Venice with certain anamorphic lenses), but the standard in handheld cinematography is a well-balanced camera on the shoulder and a pair of strong hands either holding grips, or the mattebox.

[BTM_Pix]

25 minutes ago, Elagabalus said:

None of the posts on page 4 have had ANYTHING to do with the new Canon Cinema EOS camera. 

On the upside, I've learnt a lot more about Easyrigs

I don't think there's been much more information anywhere about the Canon camera other than source of the initial post to be honest. 

It was touted as a pre-NAB announcement which made it sound like a spoiler for other manufacturer's launches at the show but world events have rather taken over in the meantime so I think its debatable whether there will actually be an NAB show at all so who knows when/if it will be announced.

The irony of course would be if Easyrig are making a special edition for this camera though !

[independent]

9 hours ago, IronFilm said:

At this point I'm not even sure what even is exactly the point you're trying to make? Unless the point is that they're not used at all? (which is clearly wrong) Or is the point just to argue?

The point is calling out horseshit and misinformation. Who said they weren't used at all? I specifically stated that they made sense (in my opinion) in some cases (height differences, documentary, live events, and reality). I also specifically stated that claims that "most guys are using an easyrig more than a tripod or dolly" for dramas and commercials ran absolutely counter to my observation and experience.

As for you, personally, I find your own arguments weak. You said you saw easyrigs on Netflix sets all the time. Instead, your only evidence was an easyrig promotional video and one online review that was clearly shilling.

I have zero problem with anybody using it - do whatever you want, I don't care. But please don't spread misinformation about the industry. 

[independent]

2 hours ago, Elagabalus said:

None of the posts on page 4 have had ANYTHING to do with the new Canon Cinema EOS camera. 

Actually, indirectly it does. I stated that Canon could help position a new camera between the C200 and C500 II (let's say the new C300III) not only with merely codecs, which would be disappointing, but incorporating new features such as in-body stabilization (preferably the sensor type and not electronic). 

I then proceeded to dump on the easyrig (really, tongue-in-cheek), because for a lightweight camera like the C200 or C300 with non-cinema lenses, the in-body stabilization will be a game-changer by allowing many more usable handheld shots without camera support. It doesn't replace the tools in the toolshed, but it will let you get away with much more. Less dependence on sticks, dollys, gimbals - or easyrigs. 

As an analogy, Canon's development of tracking autofocus has been so good that it's actually not only useable, it's better than a focus puller in many situations. So a true 5-axis stabilization feature will be revolutionary in terms of faster setup, more useable shots, greater shooting envelope, etc. And I don't think it's a feature that's talked about enough. I'd say that for many interested in the Canon C200-C300 range, being able to shoot lighter and faster would have a greater impact on your productivity and viability as a professional than things like Full Frame, internal ND filters, etc. that get talked about so much.