COVID19 Kibosh

[Thpriest]

17 hours ago, Kisaha said:

Me and my wife are self emoloyed too, that means there is no relief for us!

My wife stoped working for a week now, and I cancelled a few jobs I had booked, while I am expecting, or I will do anyway, the TV series I am working right now to be canceled together with my contract (written by the "producers" so they can do as they please with me. Modern capitalism has nothing to do with Adams and Webber anymore). All these will result at least 50-60% loss of our income for the 2020 (I mainly live from TV season, September to April-May).

Glad I didn't buy anything expensive recen..whoops, we bought a new car a month or so, ago! Well..

Here in Greece we were starting to build the economy again after the tragic decade that just passed, and now everything stops, while some of our neighbors are trying to push us to a full time war(!) with cultural and religion pretexts..

I just hope that we can fast forward to June/July and do small trips with my family while the outbreak is behind us and noone wants to do any fighting in the world.

2020 is such a weird year so far.

Same situation here in Madrid. Both my wife and I are freelancers and everything has just stopped, no work at all for the foreseeable future (I reckon late April/early May at the earliest). Trying to get a few clients who haven't paid recent jobs to cough up what they can. My wife is thinking she my have to lay off her employee. Grim.

It's a total lock down, a very weird situation. You get up in the morning, it's a lovely spring day and think, "A walk in the park would be nice"...and then you remember! We are lucky as we live on the top floor of our building with a 15m2 terrace with plants, bbq etc. I'd hate to imagine what it's be like cooped up in a little flat for 15 days.

Having a nine month old baby keeps us occupied mind!

Other activities we have to keep us occupied are set up the Ikea hydroponics system we have lying around and try to grow some lettuce, learn how to ferment vegetables and make bread on Youtube, a bit more gardening, try to watch a film, repeat...we are already on day 4 here (only went out for some food and medicines)...tick tock

[BTM_Pix]

On 3/12/2020 at 7:48 PM, eleison said:

Also, guess which country will come up with the vaccine first?  If history is to be our guide, it will be the USA... while the Europeans once again wait in line hand in hat saying "can we have some of that?" once the hard work has been done.

And yet here we are.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/mar/15/trump-offers-large-sums-for-exclusive-access-to-coronavirus-vaccine

 

[ntblowz]

LOTR TV production shutting down here until further notice.. so around 800 ppl now found they have lots of free time.

[fuzzynormal]

On 3/12/2020 at 2:33 PM, eleison said:

you guys don't want any of that sweet, sweet AMERICAN created vaccine for the virus?...basically the rest of the world has been sucking on the teet of the American people for so long

I'm going to leave this right here:

https://www.politico.eu/article/germany-confirms-that-donald-trump-tried-to-buy-firm-working-on-coronavirus-vaccine/amp/

And request OP to respond.  With any luck, the response will be in good faith.

Meanwhile, all we are left to do as citizens is slow the roll of infection.  Hopefully so hospitals do not have to triage patients due to a rush on their health care services.

Imagine being an elderly 80+ person that just had pneumonia, you then get hit with COVID and you find out you're going to need a ventilator to assist your lungs from failing under the strain. So, you go to the hospital but you're informed there are no ventilators available for you. Why? Because all the COVID suffering people that are 50+ and more likely to survive get priority. You, 80+ old man with weak lungs, you unfortunately have to die. 

Keep in mind too that the US healthcare system is ranked 27th globally, so it's not like we have the best resources across the socioeconomic spectrum. And since I'm getting back into politics, why wouldn't we hold accountable people with the power of America's purse to help, yet for weeks actively not helping? Openly mocking the situation or dismissing it because they don't want to accept any responsibility?

https://tinyurl.com/vdnjuoz
https://tinyurl.com/txex9zo
https://tinyurl.com/tll9d9o
https://tinyurl.com/t52s9lx

I don't understand this attitude of ideologists to earnestly ignore reality that cuts against their ideals. This era of truthiness doesn't work against the hard facts of nature. You can't bend optics to offset this sort of reality. If someone is making the situation worse, they simply need to be held accountable.

That's. Our. Job. As. Americans. It's literally our civic responsibility. Maybe it hurts someone's feelings because a guy they champion is being criticized? C'mon. What are we, a bunch of overly sensitive snowflakes now? Have we truly lost the ability to look at a problem directly and honestly in order to attempt to solve it?  I mean, things have been bad, but are they really beyond all hope?  Sad to say, I'm beginning to think so.

All this might seem out of place on a film making website, but I have a friend who is 80+ and vulnerable.  We've been chatting about making a movie as this unfolds and I'd follow him through the ordeal if/when he gets it.  I've never done guerrilla documentary work before and it seems daunting, but I feel like he and I need something productive to hold onto.   

[Jonesy Jones]

1 hour ago, fuzzynormal said:

I'm going to leave this right here:

https://www.politico.eu/article/germany-confirms-that-donald-trump-tried-to-buy-firm-working-on-coronavirus-vaccine/amp/

And request OP to respond.  With any luck, the response will be in good faith.

Meanwhile, all we are left to do as citizens is slow the roll of infection.  Hopefully so hospitals do not have to triage patients due to a rush on their health care services.

Imagine being an elderly 80+ person that just had pneumonia, you then get hit with COVID and you find out you're going to need a ventilator to assist your lungs from failing under the strain. So, you go to the hospital but you're informed there are no ventilators available for you. Why? Because all the COVID suffering people that are 50+ and more likely to survive get priority. You, 80+ old man with weak lungs, you unfortunately have to die. 

Keep in mind too that the US healthcare system is ranked 27th globally, so it's not like we have the best resources across the socioeconomic spectrum. And since I'm getting back into politics, why wouldn't we hold accountable people with the power of America's purse to help, yet for weeks actively not helping? Openly mocking the situation or dismissing it because they don't want to accept any responsibility?

https://tinyurl.com/vdnjuoz
https://tinyurl.com/txex9zo
https://tinyurl.com/tll9d9o
https://tinyurl.com/t52s9lx

I don't understand this attitude of ideologists to earnestly ignore reality that cuts against their ideals. This era of truthiness doesn't work against the hard facts of nature. You can't bend optics to offset this sort of reality. If someone is making the situation worse, they simply need to be held accountable.

That's. Our. Job. As. Americans. It's literally our civic responsibility. Maybe it hurts someone's feelings because a guy they champion is being criticized? C'mon. What are we, a bunch of overly sensitive snowflakes now? Have we truly lost the ability to look at a problem directly and honestly in order to attempt to solve it?  I mean, things have been bad, but are they really beyond all hope?  Sad to say, I'm beginning to think so.

All this might seem out of place on a film making website, but I have a friend who is 80+ and vulnerable.  We've been chatting about making a movie as this unfolds and I'd follow him through the ordeal if/when he gets it.  I've never done guerrilla documentary work before and it seems daunting, but I feel like he and I need something productive to hold onto.   

Just read the article. Really? This has your motors running? That article was too dumb and obvious for even me, and I always assumed you were smarter than me. 
 

Lame sauce. If this imitation journalism is the kind of garbage libs are still being suckered into believing then we are hopeless.

[eleison]

1 hour ago, fuzzynormal said:

Imagine being an elderly 80+ person that just had pneumonia, you then get hit with COVID and you find out you're going to need a ventilator to assist your lungs from failing under the strain. So, you go to the hospital but you're informed there are no ventilators available for you. Why? Because all the COVID suffering people that are 50+ and more likely to survive get priority. You, 80+ old man with weak lungs, you unfortunately have to die. 

 

Elderly aged 80+ with pneumonia are the largest percentage of people who die because of pneumonia. 50,000 people die on average per a year in the USA while around 1 million seek medical attention in hospitals.  In high likelihood, it will kill vastly more elderly people like your friend than Covid 19.  Are you complaining about pneumonia??????

The Swine flu outbreak of 2009 had killed 12,000 people in the USA under Obama's watch.  How many Americans are killed under Trumps during this Covid 19 outbreak?  People who are complaining about Trump, were they complaining about Obama?  Did you?  By all measurements related to previous administrations, Trump is doing an excellent job.  The USA has one of the lowest number of deaths when considering how porous our borders are.  

It's quite strange to me how we as a nation (USA) can shut down because of the Covid19, but not a peep when 12,000 Americans died under the swine flu.  The biggest thing I can see is that we have Trump as president, and there seems to be people who don't like him and will flame the fires of discontent.  You seem very discontented.  Are you?  Go buy some toilet paper because apparently Covid 19 makes people have diarrhea since it is in such low supply.

[fuzzynormal]

11 minutes ago, Jonesy Jones said:

Just read the article. Really? This has your motors running? That article was too dumb and obvious for even me, and I always assumed you were smarter than me.

It's just context as I was responding to a post about the world wanting a "sweet, sweet AMERICAN created vaccine" and that "the rest of the world has been sucking on the [American] teet."  So, you know, highlighting the contradiction.  There's also a promising vaccine coming out of Saskatchewan.  So eleison's jingoism I thought was a bit much.

FWIW, it's not just the article that got my motor running.  It's everything.  There's a special situation in my life that makes this pandemic a bit unnerving to me, but that's neither here nor there.  

[Jonesy Jones]

3 minutes ago, fuzzynormal said:

It's just context as I was responding to a post about the world wanting a "sweet, sweet AMERICAN created vaccine" and that "the rest of the world has been sucking on the [American] teet."  So, you know, highlighting the contradiction.  There's also a promising vaccine coming out of Saskatchewan.  So eleison's jingoism I thought was a bit much.

FWIW, it's not just the article that got my motor running.  It's everything.  There's a special situation in my life that makes this pandemic a bit unnerving to me, but that's neither here nor there.  

No. You were launching from that pathetic article. 

Can you imagine if one of us dumb redneck Republicans posted something so flimsy?

[fuzzynormal]

3 minutes ago, eleison said:

How many Americans are killed under Trumps during this Covid 19 outbreak?

I don't know.  Do you want to revisit this thread 12 months from now? 

The hard data suggests that fast comprehensive suppression action, such as that taken in Singapore, South Korea, Taiwan, and Hong Kong has helped mitigate the contagion.  Places like China and Italy have not fared as well.  Italy's numbers from two weeks ago directly track day-to-day numbers of the USA.  Italy is a top 5 health care system.  The USA is below 25th.

I'll say this:  I don't believe I can change anyone's mind typing on the internet, so no big deal there.  It's your right to hold your outlook about American life and politics. 

[fuzzynormal]

10 minutes ago, Jonesy Jones said:

No. You were launching from that pathetic article. 

Can you imagine if one of us dumb redneck Republicans posted something so flimsy?

Hey, I can withstand the slings and arrows.  You think I'm wrong, and you're saying so.  BTW, here's the original article if you want to run it through a translator: https://www.welt.de/wirtschaft/plus206563595/Trump-will-deutsche-Impfstoff-Firma-CureVac-Traumatische-Erfahrung.html

FWIW, Die Welt is sorta akin to the WSJ in Germany and Welt is the broadcast offshoot of the paper, which is why you might find this URL a little superficial.  I can't find any news sources right now that dispute the actual reporting of this story.  Perhaps you can?

[eleison]

17 minutes ago, fuzzynormal said:

I don't know.  Do you want to revisit this thread 12 months from now? 

The hard data suggests that fast comprehensive suppression action, such as that taken in Singapore, South Korea, Taiwan, and Hong Kong has helped mitigate the contagion.  Places like China and Italy have not fared as well.  Italy's numbers from two weeks ago directly track day-to-day numbers of the USA.  Italy is a top 5 health care system.  The USA is below 25th.

I'll say this:  I don't believe I can change anyone's mind typing on the internet, so no big deal there.  It's your right to hold your outlook about American life and politics. 

Yes, lets revisit this thread 12 months from now.  The total death is now around 60 -- mostly elderly. We have a ways to go until it's 12,000.  Considering most scientist seem to think it will wane just like any other flu, and china cases are already going down, I highly doubt it will get that far.  Also, my nephew is an healthcare professional and he says doctors and nurses are being extremely vigilant with respect to taking care of their elderly patients (most testing kits go to them first).   Lets see how the USA health care system does.  The USA health care which ranks below 25th.  I bet you the number of deaths in the USA will be lower than that of Italy - a "top 5 health care system".  If that happens, you should probably go back and ask yourself if your sources are biased.  

[IronFilm]

22 hours ago, John Matthews said:

I can't help noticing people talking about the financial impact from all of this. Yes, it sucks, but there are financial lessons to be learnt about how to run your business.

1) Credit for new gear shouldn't be the norm.

Indeed, I've never ever borrowed money to buy anything. 
 

22 hours ago, John Matthews said:

4) Diversify. Arguably not helpful in a pandemic, but good advice when business turns south.

Although Sound Mixing is by far and by far the bulk of my income currently, I've got a couple of other things I do on the side which I could survive on even if my sound work completely collapsed. (however... those are just as likely to be badly harmed by a recession as well! oh well)

  

6 hours ago, ntblowz said:

LOTR TV production shutting down here until further notice.. so around 800 ppl now found they have lots of free time.

Yup, the local labour market is going to be flooded with a lot more people looking for work!

Hopefully for them this shut down is only for a fortnight, as that is what they're claiming it is just for. Perhaps for overseas stars/crew who need to do the stand down quarantine for two weeks that just got announced by our PM? But I doubt that, production has been running along for a while now, I would have thought they'd already be here? 

Plus of course they say now it is "just for two weeks", but who knows what happens over the coming days, it might very well get worse and then they'll need to postpone production indefinitely. 

[fuzzynormal]

5 minutes ago, eleison said:

Yes, lets revisit this thread 12 months from now.  The total death is now around 60 -- mostly elderly. We have a ways to go until it's 12,000.

I hope you're right and I'm so so so wrong.  I don't like exponential numbers, however.  Perhaps a capitalist Deus Ex Machina will sweep us right outta everything.  Because of the  current culture of the US I don't think we'll escape mother nature on this one.  Again, I hope I'm completely incorrect about that.  Regardless, H1N1 is not the same thing as a new novel COVID.

Here's a excerpt from factcheck.org, where I've been spending alot of time recently:

"Contrary to Trump’s suggestion that the Obama administration did “nothing,” officials declared a public health emergency early in the H1N1 outbreak, secured funding from Congress and ultimately declared a national emergency, as we’ll explain below. 

On top of that, the CDC sequenced the new virus, created testing kits, and the Food and Drug Administration approved multiple vaccines, among other actions.

Rep. Michael Burgess, a Republican from Texas, praised the CDC at a House hearing in 2016 for quickly developing a vaccine for the swine flu in about six months — in time for the start of the school year in September 2009. “So that’s a 6-month time frame if I’m doing my math correctly that you were able to identify the genetic sequence of the virus, reverse engineer a vaccine, test it, assure its safety and efficacy, and get it to school teachers on the second week of school. That’s pretty impressive,” he said.  

Trump said in a tweet that the Obama administration’s response to the 2009 H1N1 pandemic “was a full scale disaster.” While he can have that opinion, there is little to support such a negative view."

Let's hope scientist can somehow hit that 6 month H1N1 window for COVID instead of the projected 18 months. 

I would like to ask, since your original post was about vaccines, what do you think about the report I put up of Trump trying to buy vaccine development from Germany?  Or the advanced development of a vaccine in Canada?

Finally, here's a ranking of the USA Health care from 10 years ago:  https://www.internationalinsurance.com/health/systems/   Our rating has gone up from 37th at least.

[Jonesy Jones]

29 minutes ago, fuzzynormal said:

I can't find any news sources right now that dispute the actual reporting of this story.  Perhaps you can?

Well... is this another way of saying there is only 1 source? In other words, to dispute... or confirm? 

The title. Think it’s an accident that it briefly makes it sound like Donald Trump is trying to personally profit from this?

Though the above is clarified in the first line, there are quotes around large sum of money. Are vaccines on this large a scale usually cheap? 

Exclusive, and for the US only. This could mean so many things and so easily be spun incorrectly. And the only competing view is given literally 1 word, “wrong”. Like could there be any more an unfair and unbalanced a discussion?

They are planning to have the vaccine by summer. This factoid alleviates the impression that Trump is trying to snatch the vaccine out of the world’s currently dying hands.

And then this whole ranking the US healthcare system thing. Have you heard Shapiro’s discussion on this? The ranking is ridiculously subjective to say the least.

 

I just don’t. I’m tired of. 

[fuzzynormal]

1 hour ago, Jonesy Jones said:

Well... is this another way of saying there is only 1 source? In other words, to dispute... or confirm? 

The title. Think it’s an accident that it briefly makes it sound like Donald Trump is trying to personally profit from this?

Though the above is clarified in the first line, there are quotes around large sum of money. Are vaccines on this large a scale usually cheap? 

Exclusive, and for the US only. This could mean so many things and so easily be spun incorrectly. And the only competing view is given literally 1 word, “wrong”. Like could there be any more an unfair and unbalanced a discussion?

They are planning to have the vaccine by summer. This factoid alleviates the impression that Trump is trying to snatch the vaccine out of the world’s currently dying hands.

Hey, like I said, let's let everyone hold their opinions.  You're completely in your right to be skeptical of news sources and see things through a prism of being anti-conservative. 

Similarly, I don't watch FNC without deep skepticism.  All that's not necessarily bad. 

But, let's also be fair.  If you're gonna call me out for a report originating from a newspaper like Die Welt, which is considered to be a conservative European source, let's at least leave Shapiro's name out of the conversation and source someone, anyone, with more integrity.

Here's a suggestion: https://blogs.wsj.com/numbers/the-trouble-with-ranking-national-health-care-systems-819/

I'm not gonna say that the WHO doesn't hold certain biases, but the WHO is scientifically reputable and allow their journals to be peer reviewed.

All of this is a tangent from COVID.  I do fear contagion and the direction it's heading.  And, man, I really hope I'm on the wrong side of history here.

[leslie]

i think in one aspect you guys in the northern hemisphere are lucky as you guys are moving into spring. Down here we are heading into autumn / winter. Winter and the the corona virus + your normal cold / flue could be a rather bad mix. Sixty minutes were saying we have about 2000 emergency beds last night, easy to see those beds getting overwhelmed unless they slow the spread of it, which is what this whole lock down thing is about. Now i have nothing against the aussie hospital system, in fact i'd say we have it pretty good all things considered.  However if things do go pear shaped it easy to see hospitals running out of ventilators, medicines , beds pretty easily. Since every country is probably at the same level, supplies are most likely going to get a bit thin to share around. Personally i wouldn't be surprised if this turned out to be a bit of a storm in a tea cup. Maybe a few thousand more people die than a typical year. Sad i know but people are always dying. What scares me is we get a bit blase about it all and something really nasty smashes us in a couple of years time.

I already have compromised lungs from a bug called sarcoidosis so if i catch corona virus, it will probably be, all over red rover 🙄  I plan on starting to wear a mask if i have to go into town just to be on the safe side. I used to have a giggle about all the asian backpackers wearing masks even before this outbreak, er... i'm not giggling anymore.

[fuzzynormal]

34 minutes ago, leslie said:

I already have compromised lungs from a bug called sarcoidosis so if i catch corona virus, it will probably be, all over red rover

Unfortunately If you can't access a ventilator to keep you alive during a contagion, you very well might die.  And, you're right, there's only so many ventilators on hand.  I don't know if people realize this and why the WHO have been extremely aggressive regarding their advice. 

And I shudder to even mention the problem of viral load for health care workers, of which I have numerous family members.

Throw in the mix a POTUS spending weeks yet again claiming he knows better than anyone else -- that it's all nothing to worry about, burning time off the clock to be usefully proactive.

Now imagine criticizing the POTUS for this behavior, knowing that the delay can cost lives, and having people defend his attitude for... reasons.  I gotta say, American citizens can like the guy because he's brash, upsetting the norm, or generating librul tears, but excusing his behavior regarding COVID should simply be a bridge too far.

[IronFilm]

35 minutes ago, leslie said:

i think in one aspect you guys in the northern hemisphere are lucky as you guys are moving into spring. Down here we are heading into autumn / winter. Winter and the the corona virus + your normal cold / flue could be a rather bad mix. Sixty minutes were saying we have about 2000 emergency beds last night, easy to see those beds getting overwhelmed unless they slow the spread of it, which is what this whole lock down thing is about.

A teeny part of me wonders "what if we should have got this disaster over and done with double quickly while we enjoyed the peak of summer time, rather than delaying the worst of it until we reach the middle of our winter?? Hmmm"

I mean, I think the current approach NZ is doing is right?? But I do hope we don't look back with hindsight and realize we got the timing completely wrong!

[majoraxis]

21 minutes ago, leslie said:

I plan on starting to wear a mask

I wear mask when in public and at work.  I know it’s not supposed to stop me from catching the Coronavirus,  but it stops me from touching my face, so in a way it helps me not catch it.

I tell people when I can tell they are wondering about the mask and wondering if I am sick, that as far as I know I’m not sick and  that I think if everyone wore a mask for a month it would help stop the spread if you do all the other things like washing and sanitizing your hand and don’t touch your mouth noise or eyes.

I bet at some point The majority of people will be wearing masks, unless you are already a Coronavirus survivor or they offer in mass some type of vaccination.

 

[fuzzynormal]

26 minutes ago, IronFilm said:

A teeny part of me wonders "what if we should have got this disaster over and done with double quickly while we enjoyed the peak of summer time, rather than delaying the worst of it until we reach the middle of our winter?? Hmmm"

I mean, I think the current approach NZ is doing is right?? But I do hope we don't look back with hindsight and realize we got the timing completely wrong!

Every country really does have to try and flatten the curve of contagion. 

If there's a sprint to getting infected then people will absolutely be dying that could have been saved with otherwise available medical equipment.  When it gets bad doctors literally have to let people die to treat other people that have a better shot at living. 

From USA Today:  "If the nation sees a major spike in COVID-19 cases, there could be almost six seriously ill patients for every existing hospital bed, according to the analysis, which is based on data from the the American Hospital Association, U.S. Census, the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and the World Health Organization.  

The estimate is conservative."

So, yeah, I just... *sigh*