Enjoying the Panasonic S1 again

[Lux Shots]

18 hours ago, MeanRevert said:

Great! Looking forward to it. Is this internal or are you using the Ninja?

I'll try and get some Ninja V footage, but this is a "photo shoot", so the opportunity for adding the Ninja may not present itself. 

[MeanRevert]

1 hour ago, Lux Shots said:

It matters a whole bunch. Maybe not the 4:2:0 color reduction, but the H265 encoding really rubs the shine off of the image.

Oh so you don’t want to use h265?

[Video Hummus]

Wish Panasonic could sort out their AF. If they had reliable AF they would have been close to “the perfect” camera for most of us with their existing feature set and formats (FF down to MFT) It’s a shame.

[thebrothersthre3]

I don’t see why H265 would make a difference over h264. You can use h264 8 bit on the Fuji which looks identical. 

[jgharding]

After getting an S1, then returning it for an S1H (i found the latter for a very good price) I have to agree.

For me the only downside is the AF. Maybe the fact the battery life isn't the best of all, but that's nitpicking really. I think it's an icredible image, the best IBIS I've used and yeah for manual lenses it slays. It takes uncompromised stills and has stunning video specs with beautiful colour.

It proves that the whole is more important than the spec sheet...

[Origami101]

However nice the cameras may be, I have no idea how Panasonic plans to make a success of this system. The most likely target market is high-end Nikon and Canon shooters, but they’re used to their respective brands, have a stable of lenses, and want autofocus that works. Micro 4/3 shooters moving up? Maybe a few, but there’s no interoperability between systems. They could just as easily move to R or Z mount, or even Fuji. That leaves video shooters, but are there enough to make this viable? 

[IronFilm]

9 hours ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

I don’t see why H265 would make a difference over h264. You can use h264 8 bit on the Fuji which looks identical. 

H265 is more taxing usually on the editing system

[thebrothersthre3]

5 minutes ago, IronFilm said:

H265 is more taxing usually on the editing system

Yeah but that doesn’t have anything to do with IQ

[MeanRevert]

On 5/20/2020 at 2:42 AM, deezid said:

You have to wait for the next update in a couple of days. It will improve the H265 10 bit 420 codec and V-Log quite significantly.

Where can I find details about this next S1 update?

[Lux Shots]

On 5/20/2020 at 9:28 AM, MeanRevert said:

Oh so you don’t want to use h265?

Not particularly. It looks fine at first until you see it side by side with 4k H264. It looks like you may have missed focus the image goes so soft.

Here is the link, again nothing special, but I did get 4K FF H.264 24p, 4K S35 H.265 60p and 5.9K FF H.265 24p, and ProRes variants for eveything but the 5.9K obviously. I'll be out and about getting some ProRes RAW stuff when the firmware drops on Monday. 😀

There should be 5 files, but one of the ProRes files is still uploading.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1FeBzE69sL0SsmGgi8TuuIGPFdYaZY-R7

[MeanRevert]

7 hours ago, Lux Shots said:

Not particularly. It looks fine at first until you see it side by side with 4k H264. It looks like you may have missed focus the image goes so soft.

Here is the link, again nothing special, but I did get 4K FF H.264 24p, 4K S35 H.265 60p and 5.9K FF H.265 24p, and ProRes variants for eveything but the 5.9K obviously. I'll be out and about getting some ProRes RAW stuff when the firmware drops on Monday. 😀

There should be 5 files, but one of the ProRes files is still uploading.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1FeBzE69sL0SsmGgi8TuuIGPFdYaZY-R7

Thanks so much!  I see a slight difference btw the 8-bit 60p and 10-bit 24p although I didn't see much difference between the H264 and H265.  This does help me making a decision so I'm starting to lean towards that S1 now.

I'd like to hear more about that firmware upgrade people are talking about now..

[TheBoogieKnight]

8 hours ago, Lux Shots said:

Not particularly. It looks fine at first until you see it side by side with 4k H264. It looks like you may have missed focus the image goes so soft.

Here is the link, again nothing special, but I did get 4K FF H.264 24p, 4K S35 H.265 60p and 5.9K FF H.265 24p, and ProRes variants for eveything but the 5.9K obviously. I'll be out and about getting some ProRes RAW stuff when the firmware drops on Monday. 😀

There should be 5 files, but one of the ProRes files is still uploading.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1FeBzE69sL0SsmGgi8TuuIGPFdYaZY-R7

I've read in a few sources that the S1 adds sharpening (even if these options are turned right down) for the oversampled 4k footage and not for the 5.9k footage so that could go some way to explaining this?

[MurtlandPhoto]

On 5/20/2020 at 1:30 PM, Origami101 said:

However nice the cameras may be, I have no idea how Panasonic plans to make a success of this system. Micro 4/3 shooters moving up? Maybe a few, but there’s no interoperability between systems. They could just as easily move to R or Z mount, or even Fuji. That leaves video shooters, but are there enough to make this viable? 

This. When rumors first started swirling about the S-line, I thought for sure Panasonic would design the system to make adapting m43 lenses possible. It would make sense. Have a 24mp full frame camera that acts exactly like a 12mp GH5s when you put a m43 lens on it - 10bit 4K with a 2x crop. Perfect way to ease m43 users into the system. But nope.

[TheBoogieKnight]

8 minutes ago, MurtlandPhoto said:

This. When rumors first started swirling about the S-line, I thought for sure Panasonic would design the system to make adapting m43 lenses possible. It would make sense. Have a 24mp full frame camera that acts exactly like a 12mp GH5s when you put a m43 lens on it - 10bit 4K with a 2x crop. Perfect way to ease m43 users into the system. But nope.

Remember sensor area is squared so a M43 lens would only cover roughly 6mp on a 24mp sensor.

 

[MurtlandPhoto]

6 minutes ago, TheBoogieKnight said:

Remember sensor area is squared so a M43 lens would only cover roughly 6mp on a 24mp sensor.

 

Gotcha. Well then the S1R is 40+ MP so that's plenty for a center crop.

[TheBoogieKnight]

One thing I don't get (and I've seen it on a few videos recently) is how the S1/S1H render some reds as a vivid orange, but only certain shades (other reds don't get affected at all). It doesn't look like it's sensor related as a recent test with RAW showed the effect vanished! One's the Pocket 6k, the other the S1H.

[TheBoogieKnight]

There's the video comparing RAW recording.

 

[MeanRevert]

2 minutes ago, TheBoogieKnight said:

There's the video comparing RAW recording.

 

Pretty obvious that there's a big quality jump.  I think you have to use an external recorded though.

And what is the file size difference between the 2?

[Lux Shots]

12 hours ago, MeanRevert said:

Thanks so much!  I see a slight difference btw the 8-bit 60p and 10-bit 24p although I didn't see much difference between the H264 and H265.  This does help me making a decision so I'm starting to lean towards that S1 now.

I'd like to hear more about that firmware upgrade people are talking about now..

The internal 4K 60p of the S1H is in 10-bit, not 8-bit. This is a big deal with a harder grade.

8 hours ago, TheBoogieKnight said:

One thing I don't get (and I've seen it on a few videos recently) is how the S1/S1H render some reds as a vivid orange, but only certain shades (other reds don't get affected at all). It doesn't look like it's sensor related as a recent test with RAW showed the effect vanished! One's the Pocket 6k, the other the S1H.

I AM ALSO HAVING ISSUES WITH REDS FROM THE S1H!!!!
The damn thing almost looks like its super neon when doing stills with the slightest bump in saturation.

[deezid]

14 hours ago, TheBoogieKnight said:

One thing I don't get (and I've seen it on a few videos recently) is how the S1/S1H render some reds as a vivid orange, but only certain shades (other reds don't get affected at all). It doesn't look like it's sensor related as a recent test with RAW showed the effect vanished! One's the Pocket 6k, the other the S1H.

Did you use the official Lut? Usually it actually shifts towards the magenta side.

Only explanation I have is you didn't convert to Rec709 properly.

14 hours ago, TheBoogieKnight said:

One thing I don't get (and I've seen it on a few videos recently) is how the S1/S1H render some reds as a vivid orange, but only certain shades (other reds don't get affected at all). It doesn't look like it's sensor related as a recent test with RAW showed the effect vanished! One's the Pocket 6k, the other the S1H.

Did you use the official Lut? Usually it actually shifts towards the magenta side.

Only explanation I have is you didn't convert to Rec709 properly.