hijodeibn Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 1 hour ago, deezid said: Oh well, most of the low light stuff looks like paint brush. I can do the same with my S1H, just apply insane amounts of Neat Video Temporal NR on it... Most people don't seem to care, so it's ok I guess? I am also not impressed by the new Sony, but at least it will last longer than Canon, IBIS is really bad, didn't like skin tone but I need to see more footage, too early to make a conclusion, it is a strange year, still can't find a camera to put my money, and the price, $4K, I was expecting less, it is really expensive for what you get, thanks God my purchase was delayed to next year, still time to be surprised for something else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trankilstef Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 Look this video at about 10:45... So yeah it overheats severely in sunlight, in outdoors and all. about 20/25mn and then shuts up. I may keep my S1H for now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zeng Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 21 minutes ago, deezid said: Pretty sure it uses a 12 bit adc mode for video, too. Dynamic range seems to be the same as the S1H. What about the claimed 16bit external output which apparently could be recorded as 12bit log raw (vs linear in the case of other cameras) to Ninja V? DR comparison tests are needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newfoundmass Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 2 minutes ago, Trankilstef said: Look this video at about 10:45... So yeah it overheats severely in sunlight, in outdoors and all. about 20/25mn and then shuts up. I may keep my S1H for now. Hugh is great. I think @Andrew Reid would appreciate him. He's such an incredibly thoughtful person, and very, very honest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deezid Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 2 minutes ago, Zeng said: What about the claimed 16bit external output which apparently could be recorded as 12bit log raw (vs linear in the case of other cameras) to Ninja V? DR comparison tests are needed. Gerald Undone measured 13 stops (SNR=0.5). But also measured the A73 and Pocket 4K with much higher numbers than usual. So my guess, he would measure the S1H higher as well 😉 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gt3rs Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 4 minutes ago, Trankilstef said: Look this video at about 10:45... So yeah it overheats severely in sunlight, in outdoors and all. about 20/25mn and then shuts up. I may keep my S1H for now. Seems like the cooling system puts the heat on the body so if there is a direct sun that warms it is not able to cool it down. This would explain why is not the temperature but the sun playing a role.... Trankilstef 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebrothersthre3 Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 Winner winner chicken dinner. It sounds like this camera has more traditional overheating problems, such as when in direct sun. The odd thing about the Canon is it seems to overheat at the exact same time regardless of direct sun or indoors. Sony needs to get rid of the low light NR though. Thats a killer. deezid and Trankilstef 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nezza Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 1 minute ago, thebrothersthre3 said: It sounds like this camera has more traditional overheating problems, such as when in direct sun. The odd thing about the Canon is it seems to overheat at the exact same time regardless of direct sun or indoors. Kai W's review suggested similar. But in real life situations how often are most people using locked off in hard direct sunlight for this cam? Not many I'd suggest. Gerald has tested 'in the hand' and found very few issues. This is the much more likely situation for this footprint. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Django Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 So the Canons have overheat issues and get bashed to death, memes and all.. but the new Sony, who in a clear comparison test shuts down completely under 23 minutes and before the R5 sitting next to it.. and it gets a free pass? Kinda sounds like double standards. Yurolov, phoberus, gt3rs and 3 others 1 3 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deezid Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 Here's a painting made by the A7sIII from Philip Bloom's video. 13 minutes ago, thebrothersthre3 said: Sony needs to get rid of the low light NR though. Thats a killer. I just stay with my S1H which after firmware 2.0 and Noise Reduction -1 looks just perfect. The NR smoothing and smearing looks like on the A73. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanveer Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 18 minutes ago, newfoundmass said: Hugh is great. I think @Andrew Reid would appreciate him. He's such an incredibly thoughtful person, and very, very honest. Canon had stated 30 mins in most cases at 23°C. Sony states 1 hour or until the battery drains at 25°. I am guessing neither is superb., but Sony's claims are conservative compared to the actual performance. I've had a camera shut down in direct sunlight once (though that was at 40-46°C). Everyone should keep mentioning the temperature, in the shade and in the sun, indoors or outdoors. Camera makers can't be forgiven for making cameras that only work in the air conditioner temperature ranges (16-25°C). That's a camera for little children, not a professional work horses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noone Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 20 minutes ago, thebrothersthre3 said: Winner winner chicken dinner. It sounds like this camera has more traditional overheating problems, such as when in direct sun. The odd thing about the Canon is it seems to overheat at the exact same time regardless of direct sun or indoors. Sony needs to get rid of the low light NR though. Thats a killer. That kind of makes sense. The Sony handles heat from within the camera far better but not so good with heat from an external source while the Canon is lousy at dealing with the internal heat but better at heat coming from outside?? The Canon must be very well insulated which would be a plus for anything but heat build up inside from using it. Of course it also probably means the Sony will cool down a lot quicker and be usable again earlier. Another thought, if I am right, that would mean the Tilta thing to cool down the R5 might be BETTER on the Sony. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gt3rs Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 11 minutes ago, Nezza said: Kai W's review suggested similar. But in real life situations how often are most people using locked off in hard direct sunlight for this cam? Not many I'd suggest. Gerald has tested 'in the hand' and found very few issues. This is the much more likely situation for this footprint. I shoot tons outdoor and under the sun.... surfing, horse show jump, trial bikes, parkour, mtb, car racing.... but I could hire a grid girl to hold an umbrella.... actually two... one additional with a fridge for the R5😂😅 Nezza 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanveer Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 6 minutes ago, Django said: So the Canons have overheat issues and get bashed to death, memes and all.. but the new Sony, who in a clear comparison test shuts down completely under 23 minutes and before the R5 sitting next to it.. and it gets a free pass? Kinda sounds like double standards. I would agree. Reviewers need to test all cameras with exact temperatures and time durations mentioned. Between the S1H, A7siii, R5 and R6. From 21 to 36°C, and in the shade and in direct sunlight. Though in direct sunlight the camera body absorbs a lot more light, due to urs colour. So that should be tye ultimate pressure test. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super8 Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 3 minutes ago, sanveer said: Canon had stated 30 mins in most cases at 23°C. Sony states 1 hour or until the battery drains at 25°. I am guessing neither is superb., but Sony's claims are conservative compared to the actual performance. I've had a camera shut down in direct sunlight once (though that was at 40-46°C). Everyone should keep mentioning the temperature, in the shade and in the sun, indoors or outdoors. Camera makers can't be forgiven for making cameras that only work in the air conditioner temperature ranges (16-25°C). That's a camera for little children, not a professional work horses. Sony is also kicking recording of to Atomos recorder to avoid overheating issues. Apples to Apples. What does the R5 do out to an Atomos recorder? 4 minutes ago, noone said: That kind of makes sense. The Sony handles heat from within the camera far better but not so good with heat from an external source while the Canon is lousy at dealing with the internal heat but better at heat coming from outside?? The Canon must be very well insulated which would be a plus for anything but heat build up inside from using it. Of course it also probably means the Sony will cool down a lot quicker and be usable again earlier. Not so sure about that. I think Canon is processing higher data rates internally compared to the A7S3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newfoundmass Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 The footage I've seen looks really good. The colors aren't too bad either. I really wish they'd fix the IBIS. I'd love to see someone test it in a really humid situation. While I don't film in direct sunlight a lot (only really weddings), I film in small venues that don't always have AC and get real hot and humid. Buildings can get into the 100Fs with hundreds of people, even in the evening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zerocool22 Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 27 minutes ago, thebrothersthre3 said: Winner winner chicken dinner. It sounds like this camera has more traditional overheating problems, such as when in direct sun. The odd thing about the Canon is it seems to overheat at the exact same time regardless of direct sun or indoors. Sony needs to get rid of the low light NR though. Thats a killer. Yeah would not be surprised if the camera doesnt actually overheat, but canon just programmed it this way to not mess around with their C line. If so magic lantern could perhaps chime in, allthough they havent done anything new in a couple of years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanveer Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 4 minutes ago, Super8 said: Sony is also kicking recording of to Atomos recorder to avoid overheating issues. Apples to Apples. What does the R5 do out to an Atomos recorder? Without external recorders and other ideas for dissipating heat. No lenses which aren't black either. White lenses will obviously absorb less heat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanveer Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 1 minute ago, newfoundmass said: The footage I've seen looks really good. The colors aren't too bad either. I really wish they'd fix the IBIS. That's primarily an issue with the mount size (circumpherence) to sensor size (diagonal). There isn't much wiggle room. That's a design flaw. They started with APS-C and then Full Frame happened in the design stage. Or they wanted to make it the chihuahua of APS-C/FF ILCs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noone Posted July 28, 2020 Share Posted July 28, 2020 2 minutes ago, Super8 said: Sony is also kicking recording of to Atomos recorder to avoid overheating issues. Apples to Apples. What does the R5 do out to an Atomos recorder? Not so sure about that. I think Canon is processing higher data rates internally compared to the A7S3. But that does not explain that the Canon overheats both outdoors in direct sun and indoors while the Sony may vary between direct sun and otherwise. For something to let heat out, it usually means it can get in as well so a camera that dissipates heat better is most likely going to let it IN as well. A heat sink can only take so much before it is no longer going to work unless it can get out of the camera. The Sony might be getting pretty close to overheating in some modes without actually doing it and adding a heat source like direct sun could be just enough to shut it down. That would also mean it will work again sooner though. No matter, I think the Sony is going to be just fine in general use and you may only need a hat for it and not a fridge. Besides, it is a camera for vampires and other low light low life (like me) and so not for the sun! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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