Canon 9th July "Reimagine" event for EOS R5 and R6 unveiling

[Kisaha]

  On 7/8/2020 at 11:01 PM, Andrew Reid said:

The euro price is including VAT at 16% (it's been lowered due to the virus but is still high).

When you buy a camera in the US from B&H at $3899 what is the price including tax?

In the UK and Europe, £4500 looks a lot worse than £3899 and it will tank sales in this region more than Canon expects.

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In Greece the VAT is 24%, no difference.

I haven't tried buying from U.S for years now because the custom office is very strickt here, there is a huge delay of stuff not from EU (because they check most of them) and they charge accrodingly custom taxes + VAT, which can be even more than the retail price.

A friend send me a second hand lens from Canada a couple of years ago, and I had to pay 50euros to get the gift from my friend! or else they would have send it back..

It is a harsh new reality that "pro" equipment will cost a lot of money, maybe this is the price to pay for "doing business", but on the other hand, there will be solutions to this problem.. We have to see the cameras first though.

I mean..you have to see the cameras first!

[newfoundmass]

In Vermont the R5 would be 4132.94 with sales tax (6%). Most states have a sales tax of 4-7%, though a couple have no sales tax. 

[Trek of Joy]

If I buy from B&H in NY, I don't pay sales tax in FL or shipping unless I want it here in less than three days. So for me it'll be $3899 + overnight shipping! 🤣🤣

Wish there was a local shop I could buy from, but they're all gone.

Chris

[Video Hummus]

  On 7/9/2020 at 12:27 AM, Trek of Joy said:

If I buy from B&H in NY, I don't pay sales tax in FL or shipping unless I want it here in less than three days. So for me it'll be $3899 + overnight shipping! 🤣🤣

Wish there was a local shop I could buy from, but they're all gone.

Chris

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Yes, I enjoy the same luxury living in PA, but I also get free 2 day shipping since I’m closer. One of the reasons its hard not to order from B&H.

[ajay]

Everyone is lining up to buy the camera purely based on specs. There are so many intangibles yet to be learned:

• Rolling Shutter
• Dynamic Range
• Highlight Roll-off
• Detail in the shadows (Are the blacks crushed?)
• Flavor of CLOG
• How strong is the low pass filter (Maybe great for skin, but maybe not so good for when you need detail.)?
• ISO limitations before noise becomes a factor (Especially important when shooting at high frame rates like 120p)
• Record length limitations

I really hope this camera is as good as it looks on paper. I want one if the quality of the footage is there! But what happened to the Canon cripple hammer? Is it gone or does it still exist.

 

 

[ntblowz]

 

 More info on r5

The new battery can record 1hr 20min of 8K RAW Video

4K 30p is supersampled from 8.2K/7.7K (DCI/UHD) FF, that gonna be the sharpest 4K ever!

4k 60P is supersampled from 5.1K in DCI and 4.8k in UHD on APS-C Crop, guess in FF 4K60P it use pixel binning?

30min record limit.

support power feed over USB-C for continuous operation

 

 

R6: 4K60P  supersampled 5.1K in FF.  

improved 1DX III sensor, AF performance same as R5

Both record 4:2:2 10bit internally

 

So in 4K30P R5 will have way sharper image than R6, while in 4K60P FF mode R6 will have much better image quality.

[ajay]

  On 7/9/2020 at 2:57 AM, ntblowz said:

More info on r5

The new battery can record 1hr 20min of 8K RAW Video

4K up to 30fps is supersampled from 8.2K, that gonna be the sharpest 4K ever!

4k up to 60p is supersampled from 5.1K in DCI and 4.8k in UHD

30min record limit.

 

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Thanks for the info. The sampling from 8k might be sharp but it also depends on the low pass filter they use. Canon has a history of a heavy-handed low-pass filter. 30 min record limit sucks.

 

[Coiii]

I want that reviews now! It's too much to expect something equal or close to the C200 raw light right? 

[Daai]

Sounds like the R5 has a 8k shooting limit of 20mins to cool down the camera and about 35 mins limit when recording in 4K60p. The 35 mins in 4k60p is if the recording started again right after the intitial 29:59 mins recording. The camera also has function that will automatically lowers the video resolution and frame rate if the camera heats up above certain temperature. Not sure if there is an option to stop recording instead of lowering the resolution and frame rate automatically

 

  On 7/9/2020 at 3:17 AM, Coiii said:

I want that reviews now! It's too much to expect something equal or close to the C200 raw light right? 

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Seems like canon raw only. no cinema raw light 😕 i guess that's their way of not eat into cine department ?

[wolf33d]

  On 7/8/2020 at 11:01 PM, Andrew Reid said:

The euro price is including VAT at 16% (it's been lowered due to the virus but is still high).

When you buy a camera in the US from B&H at $3899 what is the final price including tax? Depends on your state?

In the UK and Europe, £4500 looks a lot worse than £3899 and it will tank sales in this region more than Canon expects.

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Some US states have 0% tax, it’s up to about 9%. However, if you buy online from a shop in a different state (for eg BH that is physically in New York and you live elsewhere) they sell it to you with no tax. So anywhere you live in the US it’s easy to get all your gear tax free. 
This is becoming less easy since a law now pushes stores to charge taxes even for states they are not physically presents. But many stores don’t do it. 

So tomorrow in the US, for 99% of people it’s gonna be $3899 final price with free shipping. 

I’ll personally buy both the R5 and R6, and return the one that works less for me. I’ll most likely pick the R5 though as 4K120p 10 bit 422 + DPAF + IBIS + 45mpx FF stills is a 5 year old dream come true.  

Only if the R5 is not good in video (moire, aliasing, RS,... due to the 45mpx) I would consider the R6.

In the meantime Sony will announce the A7 whatever. Well, let’s see I am not gonna speak too early and the quad bayer should be impressive combining the benefits of both the R5 and R6 in one camera. But if their ergonomic is not changed or/and if no 4K120p then screw them.  

[Coiii]

  On 7/9/2020 at 3:36 AM, Daai said:

Sounds like the R5 has a 8k shooting limit of 20mins to cool down the camera and about 35 mins limit when recording in 4K60p. The 35 mins in 4k60p is if the recording started again right after the intitial 29:59 mins recording. The camera also has function that will automatically lowers the video resolution and frame rate if the camera heats up above certain temperature. Not sure if there is an option to stop recording instead of lowering the resolution and frame rate automatically

 

Seems like canon raw only. no cinema raw light 😕 i guess that's their way of not eat into cine department ?

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I'm not sure if cinema raw light has any special property for "cinema" content. I always thought that it was called "Cinema Raw Light" just because it's a "compressed light weight" raw for the cinema cameras... And since Canon it's less compressed should be better right?

It's just speculation because I don't have more info about any special capability of cinema raw light.

[Daai]

  On 7/9/2020 at 3:54 AM, Coiii said:

I'm not sure if cinema raw light has any special property for "cinema" content. I always thought that it was called "Cinema Raw Light" just because it's a "compressed light weight" raw for the cinema cameras... And since Canon it's less compressed should be better right?

It's just speculation because I don't have more info about any special capability of cinema raw light.

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cinemea light raw should compress file by 1/3 or 1/5. according to what i understand. there is some compression, but not as good as raw light. this seems like more in the "big size way" raw

[newfoundmass]

The Canon Cripple Hammer lives! 

[Yurolov]

  On 7/9/2020 at 4:33 AM, newfoundmass said:

The Canon Cripple Hammer lives! 

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Based on what? 

[Avenger 2.0]

  On 7/9/2020 at 12:48 AM, ajay said:

Everyone is lining up to buy the camera purely based on specs.

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Certainly some people are (youtubers, etc), but most people will buy the camera based on their needs. Not sure many professionals need at this moment a new camera. Most will need jobs, because over here all weddings, events, etc are postponed until 2021. But let be honest, 2021 will most likely still not be normal and many jobs may get cancelled all together or postponed even further. 

[Andrew Reid]

  On 7/9/2020 at 2:57 AM, ntblowz said:

More info on r5

The new battery can record 1hr 20min of 8K RAW Video

4K 30p is supersampled from 8.2K/7.7K (DCI/UHD) FF, that gonna be the sharpest 4K ever!

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Boom goes any hope of decent rolling shutter performance in 4K/24p.

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4k 60P is supersampled from 5.1K in DCI and 4.8k in UHD on APS-C Crop, guess in FF 4K60P it use pixel binning?

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4K 60p will likely have some moire issues. Or maybe a crop.

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30min record limit.

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Oh dear.

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R6: 4K60P  supersampled 5.1K in FF. 

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That's more like it. Less rolling shutter, no binning.

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improved 1DX III sensor, AF performance same as R5

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Good.

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Both record 4:2:2 10bit internally

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Sounds like R6 is one to have.

Shame it doesn't have 4K/120p though.

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So in 4K30P R5 will have way sharper image than R6

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It's still bayer 4K on both cameras. Downsampling from 8K compared to from 5.1K, with both ending up at 4K - you'll be hard pressed to see a difference in detail. The rolling shutter will kill the 4K on the EOS R5 - that is something you WILL notice!

[Trek of Joy]

  On 7/9/2020 at 12:48 AM, ajay said:

Everyone is lining up to buy the camera purely based on specs. There are so many intangibles yet to be learned:

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Its not shipping for a few weeks, there will be an avalanche of "reviews" dropping today and in the next few weeks that will make it pretty easy to sort through everything and find any dealbreaker warts. It won't be hard to download footage and photos to judge IQ yourself.

Chris

  On 7/9/2020 at 3:42 AM, wolf33d said:

 

I’ll personally buy both the R5 and R6, and return the one that works less for me. I’ll most likely pick the R5 though as 4K120p 10 bit 422 + DPAF + IBIS + 45mpx FF stills is a 5 year old dream come true.  

Only if the R5 is not good in video (moire, aliasing, RS,... due to the 45mpx) I would consider the R6.

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Same.

[zerocool22]

  On 7/9/2020 at 11:01 AM, Trek of Joy said:

Its not shipping for a few weeks, there will be an avalanche of "reviews" dropping today and in the next few weeks that will make it pretty easy to sort through everything and find any dealbreaker warts. It won't be hard to download footage and photos to judge IQ yourself.

Chris

Same.

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I never returned any product I bought, isnt it a weird way of thinking. Buying something, testing it and if you dont like it return it? What happens to the product, does it get sent back to canon to be inspected and branded refurbished or do they just sent it to somebody new. Strange that this is legal, its like those people buying an expensive dress, go out and return the dress. Sorry for the off topic rant.  

[newfoundmass]

  On 7/9/2020 at 5:05 AM, Yurolov said:

Based on what? 

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30 minute record limit. 

[zerocool22]

  On 7/9/2020 at 11:47 AM, newfoundmass said:

30 minute record limit. 

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I guess it might be a problem for those who shoot events with long speeches/workshops and so on. But I think that very few people need 30min clips. I have never shot a 30min clip in my life (unless maybe an accidental one).