Administrators Andrew Reid Posted August 10, 2020 Author Administrators Share Posted August 10, 2020 I think as Gerald showed it is just dropping to a pixel binned non-HQ output in HDMI mode. That isn't heat limited. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
independent Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 @ 10:46, side-by-side shots show the difference between external 4K HQ and 4K non-HQ modes. Noticeable difference in detail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mechanicalEYE Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 20 minutes ago, Andrew Reid said: I think as Gerald showed it is just dropping to a pixel binned non-HQ output in HDMI mode. That isn't heat limited. Must have missed that. A few other guys said it was a noticeable difference between HQ mode over non HQ modes through HDMI, happy with the result. I believe Gerald had the CFexpress card in camera when he tested the external recording. He confirmed this on twitter after he saw the nolife guys video. That could be the difference. With the Cfexpress cards being active at all times in camera, I would think that this has something to do with the differences seen in results from Geralds test to others. In his latest R5 and R6 video he talks about the cameras inability to record simultaneously to card and externally, so it seems he never tried recording externally without card in camera. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghostwind Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 19 minutes ago, Andrew Reid said: I think as Gerald showed it is just dropping to a pixel binned non-HQ output in HDMI mode. That isn't heat limited. I'm confused 🙂 Which video - I just looked and couldn't find him talking abbot that. Then the video after your reply, says it's indeed HQ out to Ninja (or no-HQ if you choose). So the only limitation seems to be it's HQ only up to 30fps? But yeah, my point is if it can do this externally, then a firmware should fix it internally too. Unless the fact that there are no cards is cooling the camera so much, something that's hard to believe, no? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted August 10, 2020 Author Administrators Share Posted August 10, 2020 4 minutes ago, mechanicalEYE said: Must have missed that. A few other guys said it was a noticeable difference between HQ mode over non HQ modes through HDMI, happy with the result. I believe Gerald had the CFexpress card in camera when he tested the external recording. He confirmed this on twitter after he saw the nolife guys video. That could be the difference. With the Cfexpress cards being active at all times in camera, I would think that this has something to do with the differences seen in results from Geralds test to others. In his latest R5 and R6 video he talks about the cameras inability to record simultaneously to card and externally, so it seems he never tried recording externally without card in camera. CFexpress doesn't seem to make a difference. Yes they get hot, yes they can even throttle read/write speeds... but my camera crapped out on me with an SD card inserted only, in Wifi menu. So go figure! Maybe Canon forgot to stop the Cripple Hammer Clock in the menus? 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mechanicalEYE Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 5 minutes ago, Andrew Reid said: CFexpress doesn't seem to make a difference. Yes they get hot, yes they can even throttle read/write speeds... but my camera crapped out on me with an SD card inserted only, in Wifi menu. So go figure! Maybe Canon forgot to stop the Cripple Hammer Clock in the menus? 🙂 My apologies if I'm not speaking clearly... I'm only speaking to recording externally without cards in camera. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted August 10, 2020 Author Administrators Share Posted August 10, 2020 I see, so it disabled 4K HQ when you pull the card? And it never outputs anything better than pixel binned 4K via HDMI? Need to do some testing here. Looking at all these YouTube thumbnails looks like I need to practice my UNHAPPY FROWNY FACE for the next article. Emanuel 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mechanicalEYE Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 5 minutes ago, Andrew Reid said: I see, so it disabled 4K HQ when you pull the card? And it never outputs anything better than pixel binned 4K via HDMI? Need to do some testing here. No when you pull the card and record externally it seems to allow HQ recording for sure, but it also allows longer record times in HQ modes without overheating. I'd be really interested in hearing the outcome of your test on this. 5 minutes ago, Andrew Reid said: Looking at all these YouTube thumbnails looks like I need to practice my UNHAPPY FROWNY FACE for the next article. Hilarious! ghostwind 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghostwind Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 11 minutes ago, mechanicalEYE said: No when you pull the card and record externally it seems to allow HQ recording for sure, but it also allows longer record times in HQ modes without overheating. Yes, this is the key point (at least up to 30fps, not sure if you can record HQ external 60/120fps unlimited. So the only question I have is, as I've said above - is this intentional crippling by Canon for internal recording, or is the heat buildup happening just from the cards being in there and/or written to? If not, then a firmware should in theory fix this limit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gt3rs Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 10 minutes ago, ghostwind said: Yes, this is the key point (at least up to 30fps, not sure if you can record HQ external 60/120fps unlimited. So the only question I have is, as I've said above - is this intentional crippling by Canon for internal recording, or is the heat buildup happening just from the cards being in there and/or written to? If not, then a firmware should in theory fix this limit. There is only HQ up to 30, 60 is lineskipped/binned, 120 is internal only the same for 8k at the moment. From the test that I saw external "unlimited" without card is HQ but another test would not be bad.. mechanicalEYE and ghostwind 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trek of Joy Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 The results people are getting are all over the map. Another cards in/out, screen on/off test, here's the summary: 1.Internal Recording to the SD Card, Overheated at 28:58 2. Internal Recording to the CFexpress, Overheated at 27:33, Then I switched over to external recording with my Atomos Shogun, again, capturing 24P 422LT 4k. 3. External Recording, SD Card, Screen on, Overheated 15:02 4. External Recording, No Cards, Screen off, Bateries died 2h49 5. External Recording, SD Card Inside, Screen off, Overheated at 1h53 6. External Recording, CFEXPRESS Card Inside, Screen off, Overheated After 2 Hours 7. External Recording, No Cards, Screen on, Overheated 41:56 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSMW Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 A calculator app will be available soon in order to work out the infinite number of possible scenarios in which you can’t use the camera. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted August 10, 2020 Author Administrators Share Posted August 10, 2020 29 minutes ago, Trek of Joy said: 4. External Recording, No Cards, Screen off, Bateries died 2h49 I'd like to know what's going on there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gt3rs Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 46 minutes ago, Trek of Joy said: The results people are getting are all over the map. Another cards in/out, screen on/off test, here's the summary: 1.Internal Recording to the SD Card, Overheated at 28:58 2. Internal Recording to the CFexpress, Overheated at 27:33, Then I switched over to external recording with my Atomos Shogun, again, capturing 24P 422LT 4k. 3. External Recording, SD Card, Screen on, Overheated 15:02 4. External Recording, No Cards, Screen off, Bateries died 2h49 5. External Recording, SD Card Inside, Screen off, Overheated at 1h53 6. External Recording, CFEXPRESS Card Inside, Screen off, Overheated After 2 Hours 7. External Recording, No Cards, Screen on, Overheated 41:56 Seems the screen on has more impact than the card..... @Andrew Reid would be a test to do internal recording but screen off using an external monitor..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avenger 2.0 Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 28 minutes ago, gt3rs said: Seems the screen on has more impact than the card..... Also EVF or only the LCD screen? Maybe the EVF heats the body. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trek of Joy Posted August 10, 2020 Share Posted August 10, 2020 We're going to need to carry a laminated spreadsheet of all the possible recording options and the overheating protocols while working with the R5. I really want to like this camera, I really do. SMH. Chris P2020 and Video Hummus 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted August 10, 2020 Author Administrators Share Posted August 10, 2020 Until there is a hack, or an official fix, it's game over really. This is a 4K pixel binning camera with nice ergonomics and good 10 bit codec. Think of it as the A7R IV but better codec and colour. A lot to like about that, but at the moment I can't really bring myself to talk about it, because the ethics of the overheating debacle are just so downright offensive it makes me never want to buy another Canon product ever again, let alone give one a good review while overlooking the highest quality 8K/4K modes. If Canon apologise and promise a fix, then I will happily use the EOS R5 in pixel binned mode until the better modes are working properly. But if they don't recall it or apologise, there will be fucking hell to pay from their customers and quite rightly so! 5 hours ago, gt3rs said: Seems the screen on has more impact than the card..... @Andrew Reid would be a test to do internal recording but screen off using an external monitor..... It isn't the screen or EVF creating the problematic heat, it's the processing required to show the image on it... or so Canon has us believing... I think it's all very fishy and the more I dive into it, the weirder it gets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Emanuel Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 https://www.eoshd.com/news/chinese-user-modifies-canon-eos-r5-to-improve-heat-management-but-finds-artificial-firmware-time-limit/#more-23880 Great article, man, I told you : ) these guys do anything for more money, they crippled the whole thing, what a perfect shame... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted August 11, 2020 Author Administrators Share Posted August 11, 2020 This is making Canon money?! That's news to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
androidlad Posted August 11, 2020 Share Posted August 11, 2020 Off topic but relevant here, R5 rolling shutter official test results have been published: https://www.slashcam.de/artikel/Kurztest/Die-Rolling-Shutter-Werte-der-Canon-EOS-R5.html 8K30/4K HQ: 16ms (indicating a 8K 60fps readout) 4K normal 24-60fps: 10ms 4K 120fps: 8ms Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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