Canon 1D X Mark III revisited

[Video Hummus]

38 minutes ago, TomTheDP said:

It's the best hybrid at its price point imo. A7S3 is awesome but it just won't cut it for stills for many or most. If Panasonic or Fuji's auto focus was up to par it would be a different story. Who would have thought Canon was offering the best specs at the lowest price point. 

If they allow clog2 or 3 in a firmware update it would really be great. 

This was the conclusion I came to when weighing A7SIII (rumored but pretty solid specs at the time) and the Canon R5/R6 and Panasonic.

Panasonic S5 AF still kinda crappy so it’s out immediately. Panasonic fix your shit.

A7SIII amazing specs but 12MP is just crap. I don’t care if it was fine in 2007. My baseline is 20MP.

So it came down to the R5 and R6 and I sprung for the R5 for the MP, the video crop mode, the internal RAW, the typical canon pro body build, and RF & EF ecosystem with canon adapters and focal reducers.

Sony then released the Sony A1 and its superior in many ways but $6500 bucks, so Im happy as a clam after using the R5.

The camera needs clog3 or even clog2 though, so I can’t wait for the new firmware update.

[docmoore]

On 3/5/2021 at 12:08 PM, Django said:

That said 1DX3 is definitely the last of the mohicans as far as I'm concerned and definitely deserves some kind of in-class award in that regard.

I purchased a 1DX III in June of 2020 ... replaced a Sony A9II which replaced a BM P6K ... because the camera had unbelievable codecs, build quality, and still used EF lenses that are not focus by wire ....

Sadly ... mine was unable to capture RAW without corrupt files ... after six months ... in the Covid lock-down ... I sent it to Canon USA CPS ... after 10 weeks (during that time I was attempting to record a weekly blog with a RX0II) ... they finally sent the files to the Canon Cinema Support group in NY ... ultimately replace the camera.

As a Canon CPS member ... 10 weeks without a camera was a major disappointment.

With the new camera in hand ... great RAW ... I looked at FF replacement potentials and decided not to invest my time with a company that denied ... then after a lot of disputation ultimately admitted they had provided a broken camera ... to their credit. But they transgressed the promise of a professional solution for their client. Talking with my dealers ... two ... Canon has a dismissive imperious front ... rather face a Texas rattler than expect a decent outcome from Canon USA.

They ultimately did the correct thing ... just too late and did not engender any sense of support ... which I had paid for.

So at the first opportunity I traded the lot for a Sony FX6 .... and will ultimately add an Alpha 1 ... the conversion has been very costly ... but worth that in the assurance that I do not have to deal with Canon USA going forward.

In short ... great camera ... one of my favorites ... from a company that needs a wake up call.

[plucas]

The 1DXiii uses the same sensor as the R6 - does it have the same yellow cast? I haven't heard others mention it but it does show up in some comparison tests online.

[Matthew19]

For all the love the 1dc got  in this, I’m surprised the c70 isn’t mentioned. It feels more like a 1DC upgrade given its been nearly 10 years than the incremental updates of the 1dx III. 

C70 is the only DSLR body style that feels like they want you to use it for video. Permanently strap that .71x adapter on there and you’ve got a full frame look with decent DPAF, useable digital IS, flip screen, unlimited recording, ridiculous dynamic range with clean shadows and better colors than the 1dx III. I like the 10bit HEVC modes for space savings. 

[docmoore]

C70 ... limited codecs ... no RAW internal or not ... adapter only recognizes three lenses ... yea great camera ...

[RawZion]

The 1dX3 looks awesome, I would love to try it.  In the past couple weeks I have had the chance to try the Canon R5 and R6, and they confirmed that I did the right thing in purchasing the Nikon Z6 (or literally any other camera).

On yesterday's shoot the R5 overheated.  Thankfully it was working again after only a ten minute break, but we were only running it at 4k/24, and this is the important bit:

WE'RE SHOOTING OUTSIDE IN CANADA IN WINTER!  It's NEGATIVE FUCKING 12 DEGREES AND THE FUCKING CAMERA IS HOT AS A TOASTER!  WHAT THE FUCKING FUCKITY FUCK?!  WHO THE HELL GREENLIT THIS PIECE OF SHIT?!

Anyways, we took breaks and finished the show, but I cannot really recommend this camera, as it is an undependable tool.  I can't imagine how hard it must be to use in California.

[scotchtape]

Obviously you're not using it right, you need to void the warranty, remove the back, and install the copper heat you have to make yourself, after purchasing a $4,000 USD camera 😄

/S

But seriously, you might have a bum unit? I'm assuming you're running the latest firmware.

[omega1978]

2 hours ago, docmoore said:

C70 ... limited codecs ... no RAW internal or not ... adapter only recognizes three lenses ... yea great camera ...

You can use more lens, tamron 24-70 g2, canon EF 35 1.4, 16-35 2.8 III tested myself.

i think can use any EF lens...

great image, bit heavy and bulky..

 

[Django]

11 hours ago, docmoore said:

I purchased a 1DX III in June of 2020 ... replaced a Sony A9II which replaced a BM P6K ... because the camera had unbelievable codecs, build quality, and still used EF lenses that are not focus by wire ....

Sadly ... mine was unable to capture RAW without corrupt files ... after six months ... in the Covid lock-down ... I sent it to Canon USA CPS ... after 10 weeks (during that time I was attempting to record a weekly blog with a RX0II) ... they finally sent the files to the Canon Cinema Support group in NY ... ultimately replace the camera.

As a Canon CPS member ... 10 weeks without a camera was a major disappointment.

With the new camera in hand ... great RAW ... I looked at FF replacement potentials and decided not to invest my time with a company that denied ... then after a lot of disputation ultimately admitted they had provided a broken camera ... to their credit. But they transgressed the promise of a professional solution for their client. Talking with my dealers ... two ... Canon has a dismissive imperious front ... rather face a Texas rattler than expect a decent outcome from Canon USA.

They ultimately did the correct thing ... just too late and did not engender any sense of support ... which I had paid for.

So at the first opportunity I traded the lot for a Sony FX6 .... and will ultimately add an Alpha 1 ... the conversion has been very costly ... but worth that in the assurance that I do not have to deal with Canon USA going forward.

In short ... great camera ... one of my favorites ... from a company that needs a wake up call.

I've never dealt with Canon USA as I'm EU based but have always heard their CPS service was good. You mention this happened during Covid lock-down, perhaps that is the culprit? Good luck with Sony CPS service, I heard they have the slowest turnover for repairs. That said FX6 + A1 sounds like a fire combo.

7 hours ago, RawZion said:

The 1dX3 looks awesome, I would love to try it.  In the past couple weeks I have had the chance to try the Canon R5 and R6, and they confirmed that I did the right thing in purchasing the Nikon Z6 (or literally any other camera).

On yesterday's shoot the R5 overheated.  Thankfully it was working again after only a ten minute break, but we were only running it at 4k/24, and this is the important bit:

WE'RE SHOOTING OUTSIDE IN CANADA IN WINTER!  It's NEGATIVE FUCKING 12 DEGREES AND THE FUCKING CAMERA IS HOT AS A TOASTER!  WHAT THE FUCKING FUCKITY FUCK?!  WHO THE HELL GREENLIT THIS PIECE OF SHIT?!

Anyways, we took breaks and finished the show, but I cannot really recommend this camera, as it is an undependable tool.  I can't imagine how hard it must be to use in California.

The overheating timers have been proven to be artificial, especially on the initial firmware. Doesn't really matter if you're in Cali or Antartica. There is an easy hack to work around this though and basically start shooting immediately after it overheats. You could also fallback to 4K non HQ mode which never overheats. Not ideal perhaps but its the price to pay for such features as 8K downsampled 4K in 10-bit 4:2:2 with DPAF. FYI, the Z6 can't even do internal log in 8-bit.

[SteveV4D]

5 minutes ago, Django said:

 

The overheating timers have been proven to be artificial, especially on the initial firmware. Doesn't really matter if you're in Cali or Antartica. There is an easy hack to work around this though and basically start shooting immediately after it overheats. You could also fallback to 4K non HQ mode which never overheats. Not ideal perhaps but its the price to pay for such features as 8K downsampled 4K in 10-bit 4:2:2 with DPAF. FYI, the Z6 can't even do internal log in 8-bit.

What's the advanatage for 8K downsampled 4K given the inconvenience of overheating.  Workarounds or switching to line skipped mode seems superfluous if there are better options out there for video only.  

If I was shooting primary stills and some video, the R5 might register as a worthy hybrid, with the inconvenience of video mitigated by my needing it less.  However if you're only shooting video, what's the attraction of the R5, other than 8K RAW?  

I'm not a big fan of Sony, far from it, having hated the few Sony cameras I've owned; but they are delivering in areas that Canon are not.  I can understand why many have looked to Sony over Canon for shooting video.

[ade towell]

27 minutes ago, Django said:

the Z6 can't even do internal log in 8-bit.

Ha neither can the Canon R5 or R6 - wish it did as 10 bit h265 is horrible to edit on my computer. (I understand the new Apple m1 can but I'm on pc). Sometimes I don't need the highest quality or want to transcode - it would be nice if the R5/6 did an 8 bit h264 c-log like the Fuji Xt-3/4 does 

[Django]

37 minutes ago, SteveV4D said:

What's the advanatage for 8K downsampled 4K given the inconvenience of overheating.  Workarounds or switching to line skipped mode seems superfluous if there are better options out there for video only.  

If I was shooting primary stills and some video, the R5 might register as a worthy hybrid, with the inconvenience of video mitigated by my needing it less.  However if you're only shooting video, what's the attraction of the R5, other than 8K RAW?  

I'm not a big fan of Sony, far from it, having hated the few Sony cameras I've owned; but they are delivering in areas that Canon are not.  I can understand why many have looked to Sony over Canon for shooting video.

The A7S3 overheats too, just not as bad and it can't do 8K or RAW. Its 4K isn't oversampled either so in some ways the older cheaper A73 has a more detailed IQ. Also 12MP for stills is a major downside (vs the 45MP on R5). If you're not a hybrid shooter and only video matters than you might as well skip the R5 & A7S3 and go straight for FX3/FX6 or C70 imo.

30 minutes ago, ade towell said:

Ha neither can the Canon R5 or R6 - wish it did as 10 bit h265 is horrible to edit on my computer. (I understand the new Apple m1 can but I'm on pc). Sometimes I don't need the highest quality or want to transcode - it would be nice if the R5/6 did an 8 bit h264 c-log like the Fuji Xt-3/4 does 

Right, my point was that the Nikon Z6/Z7 can't do any type of internal log which is kind of a joke. Personally, I can't go back to 8-bit 4:2:0 log after having 10-bit 4:2:2 log, difference is major when it comes to grading.

[ade towell]

5 minutes ago, Django said:

Right, my point was that the Nikon Z6/Z7 can't do any type of internal log which is kind of a joke. Personally, I can't go back to 8-bit 4:2:0 log after having 10-bit 4:2:2 log, difference is major when it comes to grading.

Yes I realise that, was just laughing at the irony that for my needs the easier to edit 8 bit would be quite handy occasionally. Am looking at the R6 to be able to use all the nice Canon lenses at my work, but feel I would still ending up using my own Fuji and its easy to edit h264 for quick turnaround stuff that doesn't need much grading  

[ade towell]

Does the R6 or R5 have the wide dynamic range profile that the c100 has which was quite handy for quick turnaround stuff? Can't seem to find any mention of it, would be a way of getting around the h265 issue I have

[Django]

Nah.. "wide DR" is Cine line only unfortunately. love that profile.

[ade towell]

Shame it seems silly to exclude that it worked well in 8 bit

[gt3rs]

13 hours ago, docmoore said:

As a Canon CPS member ... 10 weeks without a camera was a major disappointment.

 

Ohhh wow I would not have accepted at all. Here I’m platinum CPS (here is based on your equipment and is free) I had one issue many years ago with a 1D III and they gave me a loan replacement in 1 day and I had an issue with a lens 5 months ago and the turnaround was 2 days.
 

My 1Dx III is exactly 1 year old this week and it had served me well but since October I have also a R5 and I pick the R5 much more often that the 1Dx III.

 

The only advantage of the 1Dx III over the R5 in my experience are:

-Much faster AF acquisition for photos from full defocusing but only when using the mirror. So for some sports that the athlete comes out from hidden place like alpine ski is still an advantage. Tracking I find it better in live view and it seems the same with the R5.

-50-60fps especially RAW but this is also my biggest complain why not AF ?!?

-Much better construction I carry my 1Dx III with the 200-400 attached only from the grip with one hand a lot…. I don’t trust doing the same with the R5 + adapter…

-Battery life but at the end the weight is more so not sure is really a big advantage

 

Advantage of the R5:

-45 mpix vs 20 mpix is huge the crop-ability is just so much better.

-8K RAW > 5.5 RAW again I can frame even more loose and crop in after. Also I’m pulling a lot of stills and the res is just better.

-IBIS!

-Swivel screen is very handy on gimbal and low angle shoots. With the 1Dx III I had to use quite a bit an external monitor on the Ronin S and is just a pita…. Cable management, battery, weight, etc….

-4k 120 fps is just night and day compared to 1080 120 fps of the 1Dx III (this is just terrible in my opinion)

-RF-EF ND adapter

-Lightweight

-Zebra!!!

 

So far my R5 has never overheated or even warned but I do a lot of small takes. Last week I did capture 1.8 TB of 8K RAW in 3h but here is cold at the moment.

 

My R5 for video is basically setup in two custom modes: 8K RAW and 4K 120fps CLog….. I rarely use any other video mode. My biggest complain for the R5 so far is the micro hdmi and 4k 120 is conformed to 25 or 30p with no audio, I wish you could do the same as the A3SIII to record at 120 with audio so you can slow it down or not in post. Of course you can conform it back to 120fps but you don’t have the audio….  

4k 120 fps screen grab:

 

I edit 8k RAW without transcoding or proxy or optimize media in Resolve on a gaming notebook normally on a 4k DCI timeline with no issues, I switch to 8K timeline to render out stills that I want. Same notebook struggles with the h265 as discussed multiple times, for the 4k 120 parts I generate optimize media as is too painful without.

Bottom-line for most of my work R5 is the A camera and 1Dx III is the B (or remote cam).


8K RAW frame grab cropped a bit, heavily processed for the blue sky... 

[donnie yen]

36 minutes ago, Django said:

The A7S3 overheats too, just not as bad and it can't do 8K or RAW. Its 4K isn't oversampled either so in some ways the older cheaper A73 has a more detailed IQ. Also 12MP for stills is a major downside (vs the 45MP on R5). If you're not a hybrid shooter and only video matters than you might as well skip the R5 & A7S3 and go straight for FX3/FX6 or C70 imo.

Right, my point was that the Nikon Z6/Z7 can't do any type of internal log which is kind of a joke. Personally, I can't go back to 8-bit 4:2:0 log after having 10-bit 4:2:2 log, difference is major when it comes to grading.

Did you tried the a7s3 ? I’m working with it since last September, I can shoot unlimited 4k 120fps without overheating. It’s ridiculous to say that this camera overheat. I have the a73 too and the IQ is so much better , not even comparable. Please try to actually work with it before saying this kind of wrong information.

[Django]

@gt3rs Loving those screen grabs, I hadn't even thought of the 8K RAW benefits for that purpose. For any type of fast action just scrub to that perfect frame, extract it, reframe, retouch.. etc. Just brilliant. That and the 4K120p kinda makes me regret not splurging the extra cash for an R5. Still couldn't really justify it at this particular point in time with work so slow here post-COVID. Also mad envious, ski resorts are shut down here in France. Where is that by the way? Sick hors piste action..

[ade towell]

Has anyone used the vari nd adapter from Canon, am hearing reports that colour changes quite dramatically depending on the amount of nd you are using - it sounded like a great idea but that would be pretty disappointing for a £400 adapter