Why Gerald Undone is wrong about the Sigma Fp-L

[ND64]

"First camera company to drop the mechanical shutter."

Thats not true. Unless you mean the only "full frame" camera without mechanical shutter. And even with that clarification, its not an innovation. Without very high speed read out, removing the mechanical shutter is just prioritizing the convenience of the producer over convenience of the customer. 

 

[Alan Halfhill]

the one fatal flaw with the FP series viewfinder is that it does not pass through the HDMI. Use it while a director has a monitor. NO. While client has a monitor. NO. When sending a wireless signal to video village. No.

[Andrew Reid]

3 hours ago, Video Hummus said:

To be fair Gerald’s audience isn’t who the fp camera is for and he knows it.

I was recently looking at the fp-L + tiny sigma 24mm f3.5 as a small b-cam and backup high-megapixel photo camera (electronic shutter not an issue for my use case).

I agree the 61MP sensor in such a small body is pretty cool and the ability to strip it down by taking off a modular grip and EVF is attractive. Lots of options.

I would still like to see a bit more ecosystem pop up before I drop some money. 

Why not review the one that was for his audience instead then?

Maybe next he will do a review of a Hasselblad film camera and complain it can't shoot video.

[Andrew Reid]

1 hour ago, Alan Halfhill said:

the one fatal flaw with the FP series viewfinder is that it does not pass through the HDMI. Use it while a director has a monitor. NO. While client has a monitor. NO. When sending a wireless signal to video village. No.

Picking right tool for the job instead YES

[kye]

15 hours ago, Anaconda_ said:

Video.

I hope you're wrong about mechanical shutters. I love the feel and sound of a shutter. Taking stills on the FP doesn't feel any more special than using my phone.... Sure the results are very different, but actually using the camera is more than half the fun.

They can always implement a haptic feedback engine that can emulate it, assuming there is enough demand.  Not sure if you've used a MacBook Pro touchpad or an iPhone home button, but they're pressure sensitive and don't click, however the illusion that they do click is (at least to me) completely flawless.  I didn't realise it they weren't physical buttons until I tried it when the devices were powered off and literally I got a small shock because I genuinely thought it was physically clicking.  Even now if I happen to press when the device is off I am still surprised.

14 hours ago, secretgoldfish said:

Great article Andrew, the camera scene has just become Youtube pimping trash by folks just kissing arse with shameless ads where the desire for hits now fulfills what creativity should and once did (if they were actually creative).

...who are fuelled by the continuous appetite for more resolution.

That's the thing about capitalism, it's a feedback loop from the consumer to the manufacturers, and then back again through marketing.  If we all just stopped voting for huge-resolution cameras with our wallets, they'd eventually stop selling them.  Do most people do that?  No.

[D4cl00]

Most people don’t know what product they need.
They have a problem or goal and the product needs to solve that. Their perception of what the right product is, is often what’s the gold standard (and most of the time a conservative concept that hasn’t essentially changed), until a disruptor changes everything - and revolutionizes the entire industry with something completely new.  

It’s like everyone wanted a Nokia, until Apple showed up and Nokia was a goner.

The problem with Sigma is that they may have created some original, daring concepts here, but it’s not revolutionary at all. It’s just some new ideas within the same old paradigm, the same form factor. 
Not worth going for. People then just see it as a risk and stay with what they’re used to. 
 

The entire traditional camera industry bores the crap out of me. Nothing happens. Just iterations in a shrinking market.

[Andrew Reid]

I find it strange. Sigma created a new concept, first full frame mirrorless camera with internal 4K RAW recording.

Gerald didn't even review it.

And now this, with the follow-up model that is a sensor swap for landscape photographers.

Bit odd I think.

[RawZion]

The Sigma FP, and FP-L are extremely tempting and interesting cameras.  However, as Gerald pointed out in what I felt was a very polite, Canadian review the FP-L comes to $3,000 USD with the EVF, and that's putting it up against some heavy competition. 

The only really amazing advantage I see it having (besides size), is its internal raw Cinema-DNG to SD Card.  I was putting together a new demo reel of my work recently, and the stuff I did in Magic Lantern on the Canon 5d2 and 5d3 was stunningly clear, sharp and beautiful compared to everything else I've shot on any mirrorless system (including the Sony FS700).  Yet to get those shots I needed to deal with the gigantic file sizes and 1 minute shot length limits that came from hacking those cameras.  So getting a professionally designed Cinema-DNG system in the SigmaFP at larger resolutions like 4k and without those time limitations seems wonderful.

The question is, is that amazing IQ enough of a pull to spend a lot of money on a new system?  For me the answer is no, but if I had more disposable cash it would definitely be a gem to have.

[EduPortas]

Loyal reader since 2012 (or 2011? I forget).

Never thought I'd see the day when the author of this blog would stoop down to some youtuber that is clearly a technician.

Dude has no idea of what constitutes art and does not care. He's in it for the views and the afillo links.

Guess it's 2021.

 

[Video Hummus]

1 minute ago, EduPortas said:

Never thought I'd see the day when the author of this blog would stoop down to some youtuber that is clearly a technician.

Dude has no idea of what constitutes art and does not care. He's in it for the views and the afillo links.

Guess it's 2021.

 

I don't see the big deal. It's free content where he pretty thoroughly tells you about a camera. Use your brain to decide if its right for your artistry. Rent the gear and try it out.

Andrews beef was he compared it to Sony A7R series and judged it by that and not just let it stand on its own. Perhaps Gerald should stop giving buying advise and just stick to telling you facts about operating modes and handling and use cases based on the time he had with it. The ALEXA Mini is a terrible camera when you try to shoehorn it into a consumer A7 series criteria checkbox list (no grip, no EVF, hard to hand hold) It's just a different tool.

[newfoundmass]

I get some of the criticism but I don't think Gerald was unfair in his review. Sigma's doing some cool things but they're not for everyone.This is a peculiar release, I don't know a ton of people who would be in the market for this camera. Most people that need 61MP aren't going to buy a Sigma fp-L. Some will, and they'll love it, but it's not the ideal solution for most folks. That's not to say it shouldn't exist or that it doesn't do some impressive things, but it's a very niche market it's aiming for. 

Andrew comes from a different angle than Gerald. I think by sending Gerald a review unit Sigma wants to get as many different viewpoints as possible. I think that's to their credit. Varying opinions are a good thing and I want to see cameras in the hands of different people with different use cases. Just my opinion, though! 

[newfoundmass]

2 hours ago, EduPortas said:

Dude has no idea of what constitutes art and does not care. He's in it for the views and the afillo links.

Also I think this is a really unfair characterization of Gerald. Long form camera reviews, especially ones where he is critical of the camera he's reviewing, is not the best way to get views and affiliate sales. If his intentions were to maximize his views and affiliate link sales he is doing a terrible job. 

[Eugene]

Shots fired and well aimed at that! 

[cameraeye]

Then to balance out Gerald's review- someone should do a video review with no expectations or pre-existing requirements and view it through it's own lens, see what its strengths are organically and perhaps in terms of an inspirational tool. I for one am tired of specs and templates of peoples ideal camera.

 

I think we need more diverse and artistic tools in the landscape.

[MrSMW]

37 minutes ago, cameraeye said:

Then to balance out Gerald's review- someone should do a video review with no expectations or pre-existing requirements

The only issue with that is that camera companies only tend to hand out demo models to established 'influencers'. At least early on.

But otherwise, I agree and it would be more 'fair' if these tools reached the hands of shall we say, more real world users rather than kit reviewers.

The latter does happen, but only later down the line and usually after the user has purchased for themselves but by then, a preconceived idea of the tool is already established whether it's 100% accurate or not from those early 'reviews'.

Which is why I personally take all these kinds of things with a pinch of salt and make my own mind up. I've never bought a camera or piece of kit based on anyone's opinion but my own. 

[EduPortas]

11 hours ago, Video Hummus said:

I don't see the big deal. It's free content where he pretty thoroughly tells you about a camera. Use your brain to decide if its right for your artistry. Rent the gear and try it out.

I don't care about the technical specs of X gear or absolute technical quality of the image. Dude is clearly a gearhead. He shares no narratives (a review is analytical, not narrative work). So no, his review says nothing to me.

But this type of "content" is what goes today by high-quality: talk about specs with the intention is to sell sell sell. Show some graphs. Record a quick v-log. Make you push that buy button. It's not a hobby, it's their job as influencers.

That's why this blog is still relevant, even if the author takes six or twelve months to review X new camera 😅. At least I know he's not writing for the ad revenue and hot Amazon-BH-Adorama link. 

[KnightsFan]

I'm not sure the statements "he's in it for the affiliate links" and to "sell sell sell" holds true when your main complaint is that he's giving a negative review to a deserving product.

Just to be absolutely clear, how many of you have tried both the A7r4 and the fp L, and find the fp L to be a better camera, and why? I'm genuinely curious, because as I mentioned before, from my point of view the fp L isn't as strong but the vast majority here seem to know something I don't.

[Thomas Hill]

The Snap Chick, Tech360 and Three Men and an Elephant all had early first look videos where they use the fp-L and approach it more on its own merits. But Gerald and DPreview seem to get most of the attention.

[EduPortas]

2 hours ago, KnightsFan said:

I'm not sure the statements "he's in it for the affiliate links" and to "sell sell sell" holds true when your main complaint is that he's giving a negative review to a deserving product.

I don't care if he gives a negative or positive review of a Sigma product. That's beside the point.

The underlying credibility of these influencers is the main problem. We all know companies are greasing their hands with free gear they later sell to make a quick buck, ad revenue, free trips, etc. They are part of any marketing budget now.

That's were they are coming from. Brands and the YT algorithm love them because it make a sweet connection with money spent advertising their new products on Google. They can track exactly when and whom created a surge in gear sold via a particular link.

So no. They have no credibility in my book, bro. 

[MrSMW]

25 minutes ago, Thomas Hill said:

The Snap Chick, Tech360 and Three Men and an Elephant all had early first look videos where they use the fp-L and approach it more on its own merits.

And playing devils advocate, all 3 personally own cameras from the L Mount Alliance with Leigh and Hugh owning Leica SL2's and Tech360 (I forget his name) has or had an original FP.

I think I have that right, but all 3 anyway are fans of the system. I think Hugh also has an S5...

Gerald is very much a Sony man these days, but nothing wrong with that or his channel, - I watch it quite a bit, respect the guy and don't feel I am ever being sold anything or channelled anywhere and don't begrudge him making a living.

It's all just opinions ultimately.

Now (for me) S1R or FP-L as a pure photography tool, hmmm...