C200 Mark II - Is is coming

[EphraimP]

Late last December, rumors started popping up about a new C200 from Canon with the sensor from the C300 Mark III and the C70. It was supposed to have a smaller body than the C300 without the modular form factor shared with the C500. So, a smaller uni-body cine cam with the latest dual gain sensor, raw capability and... a 10 bit codec. Sounds more like an FX6 than a C70, albeit in S35 and not full frame. 

I am definitely interested in a camera like that so I held off on pulling the trigger on a C70. April's fixin' to be in the rearview mirror any second now, and I've got projects to shoot, lots of them. The trigger finger's gettin' itchy. Anyone heard of new rumors about the camera or a release date? Maybe the success of the C70 has made Canon re-think the timing and wait until the buying frenzy for that hybrid/DSLR shaped beast dies down? I hope the C200 Mark II doesn't become Canon's phantom camera to match the long-lusted after A7SIII. I don't want to wait half a decade to see if it's all I hope it could be or just a Meh offering from the big bad wolf of camera companies.

[EphraimP]

Well, that's embarrassing. I AM the king of typos. That post title should be C200 Mark II - Is it coming.

 

Derp.

[herein2020]

Strictly speculating here, but I think you will have a long wait.  Camera sales are slower than ever, there is a global parts shortage, and Canon is pumping out cameras like there is no tomorrow. At a minimum they will definitely wait until the C70 hype has died down. There are also rumors that a C50 is coming as well, and an R1 and an R3. They just released the C70, C500 II, and C300 III. I really think you are looking at at least a year out. I don't even see how the C200 fits into the current lineup.

Knowing Canon, they may have decided if you want full size XLR ports that you need to get the C300.. The C70 is even the same price as the C200, so I'm not even sure how they would fit it in price wise between the C70 and C300 III. The last thing Canon wants is for someone to get a C200 II when they might have gotten a  C300 III instead.

[kye]

If history has taught us anything, it's that Canon will take forever to release the camera we want, and when they do it will be a huge disappointment.

If you have work to do and can do it with the equipment you already have, then use that.  If you need a new camera to do it, then buy a used good condition copy of the cheapest camera model that can get the job done, and if the stars align and Canon releases a camera that doesn't overheat, combine LOG with 8-bit, or have the DR of the iPhone 4, then you should be able to sell what you have for close to what you paid for it and buy the Canon unicorn.

[Mmmbeats]

Well that typo got me excited.. for a second!

[EphraimP]

7 hours ago, Mmmbeats said:

Well that typo got me excited.. for a second!

Sorry.

13 hours ago, kye said:

If you have work to do and can do it with the equipment you already have, then use that.  If you need a new camera to do it, then buy a used good condition copy of the cheapest camera model that can get the job done, and if the stars align and Canon releases a camera that doesn't overheat, combine LOG with 8-bit, or have the DR of the iPhone 4, then you should be able to sell what you have for close to what you paid for it and buy the Canon unicorn.

Nah, what I'll probably do is buy the C70 on a 0%, 1 year payoff plan (thank you B&H!) and write the camera off against the taxes for my LLC. Nothing wrong with leveraging other people's capital to grow the business. If I decide to sell it in a year or two, doesn't look like used prices are dropping fast. 

[BenEricson]

2 hours ago, EphraimP said:

Sorry.

Nah, what I'll probably do is buy the C70 on a 0%, 1 year payoff plan (thank you B&H!) and write the camera off against the taxes for my LLC. Nothing wrong with leveraging other people's capital to grow the business. If I decide to sell it in a year or two, doesn't look like used prices are dropping fast. 

Canon Dealer's will all do 0% APR / 2 Year.

I own the C70. Used it on a job the other day. The camera is solid. I think the price is fair for the image quality you get. If I wasn't trying to use it on a gimbal and shot a ton of handheld, I might consider a used C300 Mkii package for peanuts or a C300 Mkiii.

[EphraimP]

59 minutes ago, BenEricson said:

Canon Dealer's will all do 0% APR / 2 Year.

I own the C70. Used it on a job the other day. The camera is solid. I think the price is fair for the image quality you get. If I wasn't trying to use it on a gimbal and shot a ton of handheld, I might consider a used C300 Mkii package for peanuts or a C300 Mkiii.

My LLC is less than two years old (I registered it last winter, actually) so I don't qualify for Canon's 0% APR deal yet, but B&H has got me covered on that. I agree that is seems like a fair deal. I was thinking I'd like the C200 form factor better, but I've been shooting a lot with my X-T4 in a similar way to how I'd set up the C70 and have been liking the result better than my X-T3 set up mini-cine style with a pre-amp and V-mount battery.

The IBIS has been part of why I like it better, though I do have to deal with IBIS induced wobble/jello on some parts of some shots. I'm thinking that the C70's digital IS should be as helpful for getting usable handheld footage. I plan on using a IS lens for my main doc lens, probably the 24- 70 F4L with the .71x adapter. My only question there is if the 24-70 autofocus motor is as loud other L-series USM motors and if it tends to pulse when autofocusing. 

I do have a Ronin-S and I know you can balance the C70 on it. I tend to like the hand held look for doc videos over a hyper smooth gimbal look.

[BenEricson]

30 minutes ago, EphraimP said:

I do have a Ronin-S and I know you can balance the C70 on it. I tend to like the hand held look for doc videos over a hyper smooth gimbal look.

I'm with ya. This is why I would vote for the C300 Mkii or C300 Mkiii if you're doing a lot of handheld work. The weight of the camera, coupled with a view finder, makes for smooth handheld footage. 

It all depends. The Internal IS on the Canon is only okay to me. I would probably never risk using it on a paid job, maybe to fake a tripod shot in a pinch, but I couldn't imagine shooting that over an IS lens or choosing to warp stabilize in post.

[andrgl]

I probably could’ve bought a C200(B) due to how many times I rented them in 2019.

Awesome, awesome camera slapped with typical Canon bullshit, such as: 10-bit ONLY for 60fps, 12-bit ONLY for 24-30fps.

Why??? Let me fucking choose 10-bit RAW for lower framerates if I want.

I instead own a FS5 and two FS5MKIIs; worse autofocus, worse colour... but I get my choice of codec and bitrate. 120fps 4K is nice to have too.

tl;dr not holding my breath for a great improvement, but I’ll probably use one, especially if they go RF mount as a focal reducer would become viable

[EphraimP]

1 hour ago, BenEricson said:

I'm with ya. This is why I would vote for the C300 Mkii or C300 Mkiii if you're doing a lot of handheld work. The weight of the camera, coupled with a view finder, makes for smooth handheld footage. 

It all depends. The Internal IS on the Canon is only okay to me. I would probably never risk using it on a paid job, maybe to fake a tripod shot in a pinch, but I couldn't imagine shooting that over an IS lens or choosing to warp stabilize in post.

Yeah, I've thought about the C300 Mkiii. It's a bit of a stretch for where my business is at. I can comfortably budget ~$6,500 for a camera/cage and minor accessories and I already have 2 Ninja Vs, so the monitoring solution is taken care of. Though I'd love a full-size cine rig, I think the best bet for me is to go the C70 and step up to a C300 or 500 as I grow the business. The C70 will slot right in into B cam mode at that point and I can sell on of my Fujis or use it as a fulltime stills body, not that I shot much still photography these days.

[TomTheDP]

I was thinking on jumping ship to Canon but my Pana S1 continues to surprise me time and time again. Really hoping Pana puts out another Cine cam as the EVA1 doesn't really do it for me anymore. Tired of matching other cameras to my S1 rather it be Canon or RED or Sony. 

[herein2020]

On 4/24/2021 at 7:52 PM, EphraimP said:

Yeah, I've thought about the C300 Mkiii. It's a bit of a stretch for where my business is at. I can comfortably budget ~$6,500 for a camera/cage and minor accessories and I already have 2 Ninja Vs, so the monitoring solution is taken care of. Though I'd love a full-size cine rig, I think the best bet for me is to go the C70 and step up to a C300 or 500 as I grow the business. The C70 will slot right in into B cam mode at that point and I can sell on of my Fujis or use it as a fulltime stills body, not that I shot much still photography these days.

I would rent the C70 first to ensure you like it before buying it.  I have read that the IS on the C70 isn't that great (no idea if its true or not) but if I were considering the C70 I would definitely rent it and test it out especially with my gimbal and handheld before I bought it. 

For the work I do, the S5 perfectly meets my needs.....except for the terrible AF but the IS is nothing short of amazing. My gimbal is literally gathering dust now and I truly enjoy shooting handheld with it far more than I ever did with the GH5. The only time I use my gimbal now is for walking shots everything else is handheld. The S5 combined with IS, lens IS, and a VMount battery was a game changer for my relationship with shooting handheld.

[EphraimP]

Without autofocus reliable enough for a talking head interview, internal NDs and XLR ports, Panny cameras aren't in the ballpark for me. I already have an X-T3 and an X-T4, so I don't have any need for another hybrid mirrorless system. I'll be checking out the C70 in about a week or two. We shall see.

[TomTheDP]

12 hours ago, EphraimP said:

Without autofocus reliable enough for a talking head interview, internal NDs and XLR ports, Panny cameras aren't in the ballpark for me. I already have an X-T3 and an X-T4, so I don't have any need for another hybrid mirrorless system. I'll be checking out the C70 in about a week or two. We shall see.

The XLR adapter for the Pana has taken care of the Audio needs for me. Can't get around having no internal ND filters though. Definitely great to have. 

[Thpriest]

16 hours ago, herein2020 said:

The S5 combined with IS, lens IS, and a VMount battery was a game changer for my relationship with shooting handheld.

I know this isn't the thread for it, but do you have a photo of the V-Mount with the S5?

[BenEricson]

13 hours ago, EphraimP said:

Without autofocus reliable enough for a talking head interview, internal NDs and XLR ports, Panny cameras aren't in the ballpark for me. I already have an X-T3 and an X-T4, so I don't have any need for another hybrid mirrorless system. I'll be checking out the C70 in about a week or two. We shall see.

I'm just curious... Why use auto focus for a talking head interview? I've shot 100s of interviews with the C300 Mkii for years and now the C70. I would never do that, simply for the fact that it can be unreliable. I suppose if you're shooting on a gimbal or the person is moving around, or a unmanned camera, but a traditional interview I always have focus on manual. 

I could never work without NDs or XLR though. Kind of the number one selling point with the C70.

[TomTheDP]

1 hour ago, BenEricson said:

I'm just curious... Why use auto focus for a talking head interview? I've shot 100s of interviews with the C300 Mkii for years and now the C70. I would never do that, simply for the fact that it can be unreliable. I suppose if you're shooting on a gimbal or the person is moving around, or a unmanned camera, but a traditional interview I always have focus on manual. 

I could never work without NDs or XLR though. Kind of the number one selling point with the C70.

Yeah I never use AF for interviews. I assume its useful for very shallow DOF shots on close ups. 

[herein2020]

5 hours ago, Thpriest said:

I know this isn't the thread for it, but do you have a photo of the V-Mount with the S5?

 

As a matter of a fact I do:

 

 

[Xavier Plagaro Mussard]

20 hours ago, BenEricson said:

I'm just curious... Why use auto focus for a talking head interview?

Probably because the DOF is too shallow and need to change focus with every little movement of the talent. I also prefer a setting were the DOF is enough to allow the talent to move a bit and not be out of focus.