S1H full range... internal vs BMD BRAW vs NINJA V ProRes

[thomashogben]

Shooting internal, compared to Ninja V & BMD Video Assist shows clipping at different levels... but none go full range.. why is this? I thought the HDMI out and internal were both full range when in V-Log? Same exposure / same scene for each clip..

ProRes

 

Internal 5.9k

 

BRAW

[kye]

Is it to maintain consistency across different models of camera?  

IIRC C-Log is like this, with clipping of their lower-DR cameras reflecting their lower clipping point compared to the higher-DR cameras, which allows the same settings on different models to generate the same exposure in the files and therefore allow compatibility in post.

[Mark Romero 2]

In clip attributes, do you have the data levels set to full?

In the settings monitor page, do you have data levels set to full as well?

What are your project-wide gamut / color settings?

The screenshot below is internal V-LOG from S5.

[thomashogben]

Thanks Mark, thats correct.. the Ninja V adds a tag to the video in the ProRes files that references it as full range, whilst the other videos are at Video in the clip attributes menue in davinci. Once i change them all to video it corrects the waveform so all the clips show the same exposure.

[HockeyFan12]

5 hours ago, thomashogben said:

Thanks Mark, thats correct.. the Ninja V adds a tag to the video in the ProRes files that references it as full range, whilst the other videos are at Video in the clip attributes menue in davinci. Once i change them all to video it corrects the waveform so all the clips show the same exposure.

Out of curiosity, does braw allow highlight recovery as with the P6K and P4K? To me that's kind of their killer app – it gives you as much dynamic range as an Alexa (more or less). And the S1H is almost there even without it...

Also do any improve the color rendering? I'm not in love with the S1H's default colors, or just have trouble working with them. They're different from the EVA1 or GH5, which is confusing. 

[Robert Patts]

@HockeyFan12 I think others have mentioned online that it does not allow highlight recovery.

[TomTheDP]

On 10/2/2021 at 4:16 PM, HockeyFan12 said:

Out of curiosity, does braw allow highlight recovery as with the P6K and P4K? To me that's kind of their killer app – it gives you as much dynamic range as an Alexa (more or less). And the S1H is almost there even without it...

Also do any improve the color rendering? I'm not in love with the S1H's default colors, or just have trouble working with them. They're different from the EVA1 or GH5, which is confusing. 

The raw codec is definitely more flexibile color wise though its very similiar in terms of the look. I personally like S1 color better than the GH5. I noticed shadow dynamic range is way way better with RAW. No banding in the shadows even when 6 stops under exposed and it retains the information. It does get noisy but the noise is much more organic than with the internal codec. 

[HockeyFan12]

18 hours ago, TomTheDP said:

The raw codec is definitely more flexibile color wise though its very similiar in terms of the look. I personally like S1 color better than the GH5. I noticed shadow dynamic range is way way better with RAW. No banding in the shadows even when 6 stops under exposed and it retains the information. It does get noisy but the noise is much more organic than with the internal codec. 

Thanks! Good to know.

One thing I've noticed (not sure how Resolve handles it) is that Adobe's implementation of h265 has a lot of banding and blotchy color compared with the same file transcoded in Finder to ProRes. But transcoding in Finder to ProRes throws off the gamma. Not just true of the S1 but with all h265/HEVC files I've tried so far (granted all from Panasonic cameras).

 

[Mark Romero 2]

On 10/5/2021 at 6:18 PM, TomTheDP said:

The raw codec is definitely more flexibile color wise though its very similiar in terms of the look. I personally like S1 color better than the GH5. I noticed shadow dynamic range is way way better with RAW. No banding in the shadows even when 6 stops under exposed and it retains the information. It does get noisy but the noise is much more organic than with the internal codec. 

Thanks for the note. Can you elaborate on "how" the noise is better? You mentioned it looks more organic, so does that mean it is more luminance noise and less chroma noise? 

Also, how is the noise / shadows if you DON'T capture in RAW but instead capture in something like DNxHR or ProRes (non-RAW)? Do you get better shadows without the noise penalty?

I'm worried that shooting RAW will slow down my computer so much when I have to denoise it. (I only have an RTX 2060 Super 8GB VRAM.

[TomTheDP]

10 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

Thanks for the note. Can you elaborate on "how" the noise is better? You mentioned it looks more organic, so does that mean it is more luminance noise and less chroma noise? 

Also, how is the noise / shadows if you DON'T capture in RAW but instead capture in something like DNxHR or ProRes (non-RAW)? Do you get better shadows without the noise penalty?

I'm worried that shooting RAW will slow down my computer so much when I have to denoise it. (I only have an RTX 2060 Super 8GB VRAM.

Prores noise seems to look a little better too. Not exactly sure how to describe it. The fixed noise pattern doesn't go away unless shooting in RAW though. 

[Mark Romero 2]

45 minutes ago, TomTheDP said:

Prores noise seems to look a little better too. Not exactly sure how to describe it. The fixed noise pattern doesn't go away unless shooting in RAW though. 

Thank you!