Hybrid Shooters - 1 body for both photo/video or 2 bodies?

[kye]

 

10 hours ago, SRV1981 said:

Thanks it does help!

My mind is only made up because I've yet to see Sony rival Canon's color/image to my eyes ... if it did I'd have no problem because brand loyalty is a non-issue for me, personally.  Are you aware of any videos comparing this?  It seems you are right that if I want to use Clog3 i'll have to learn a bit of colorgrading but it seems that dropping a rec709 lut and doing some minor grading is something I should be able to pickup - that does seem like a different process than me saying I am not sure i'd want to learn or spend time trying to get skintones/colors of a Sony file as close as I can to a Canon and still fall short with a bit of disappointment.  Am I correct?

You're thinking about colour all wrong.  I don't blame you for it - I think most of the internet thinks about colour wrong and you'd be forgiven for adopting that kind of thinking.  I did at first, and now several years later, have come out the other side and now understand what things are truly like.

@Mark Romero 2 was 100% right when he said:

Quote

I just don't think it will take you "a few months" to learn to color correct videos.

So, how long will it take?

It will take a few hours, and it will take many years.  Let me explain - there's good news and bad news.

The good news:
When you shoot with anything other than rec709, you're going to need to convert from whatever colour space and gamma you shot in to rec 709.  This could be via a conversion, or a LUT, or some combination of both.  The level of sophistication that goes into creating these things is absolutely huge (when done by people who know WTF they're doing - which is almost no-one on the internet by the way) and so your job is just to work out which conversion or LUT you will use.  From that point on you just apply that to all your footage and that's it - you've learned to colour grade.  If you find a conversion that gets great colours from Sony, which will be out there I can assure you, then job done.

The bad news:
The above method will only work on maybe 10% of shots, if you're lucky.  The reality of shooting events and travel and other uncontrolled situations is that the vast majority of your shots will look like garbage straight out of the camera.  This will be true regardless of what camera you have, and will completely overwhelm whatever advantages one brand has over another.

This is because the real world doesn't use lighting with matching colour temperatures, and even worse, with remotely acceptable CRI performance.  Colours will be *awful*.

An example.  Last week my wife and I went to get some food from some food trucks and I took a tiny camera to shoot a little test video with a very vintage soviet lens.  Let's look at some of the shots as they came out of the camera.  All of these are on auto-WB so the camera will have been trying to adjust as best as it could.  

Notice how the sky looks normal, the people in the foreground look brown/purple, and the various trucks look different in the background.

Too orange for the camera to compensate using auto-WB:

Interior of the truck is fine, and the outside is quite green:

BUT, you say, that's a cheap camera!

OK, here's a few shots from the XC10 - a Canon Cinema Camera shooting in C-LOG.

Background is fine, foreground is muddy purple:

A small statue that no-one has ever heard of - colour temp of interior lighting vs natural lighting coming from the skylight:

So far so good.

Let's look at some event photography.  The pub that hosted this bull-ride decided to buy a mixture of purple and green floodlights.  Take note that to the naked eye this was COMPLETELY INVISIBLE.  This shot is ungraded HLG too, if you convert to 709 then you've got a circus on your hands.

It was because of things like this that I have taken years to be able to get colour I'm happy with from my footage.  I've been shooting family trips and outings for years and the footage has been piling up waiting for my skill in colour grading to be good enough to colour grade the material I've captured to a standard that I can even live with, let alone love.

So, why aren't people talking about this?

It's simple.  Professionals mostly have control of their lighting and make sure it's done right, documentary shooters will hire a colourist to troubleshoot difficult sections they can't colour grade themselves, and amateurs who can't control the lighting and can't troubleshoot their own footage simply don't post their shitty footage to YouTube.

You, however, will be looking at the critical shot of whatever it was that happened, and wondering what the hell you do with it to make it even usable.  Screw the difference between Canon and Sony colours, your shot will look like your camera was broken and needs to be repaired.

Another example.  Recently my daughter graduated high-school.  I took my GH5 and 12-35/2.8 as I thought it would be long enough, would mean I could quickly take a wide or mid-shot if required, would have AF for quick compositions, and I thought I'd value the stabilisation from the camera and lens.  I contemplated taking my Voigtlander 42.5/0.95 prime, but decided against it.  
Turned out that for the critical moment of her walking across the stage and receiving her certificate, the 12-35 at 35mm wasn't long enough so I cropped in 2X (which the GH5 can do without a loss of quality).  This is fine, but at 2.8, which was needed as it was indoor and stage lights aren't that bright, the lens is quite soft.  I should have taken the Voigtlander, which is sharp as hell when stopped down a couple of stops to f2, and would have been longer.  Oh well, I got what I got and content is king right?  

This is the real world.  Almost all cameras can get great colour, but none will look good in difficult conditions and all will require some skill in post to colour grade.  Also, if you're colour corrected still photos before, but not video, then this is where having RAW makes a huge difference.  If you have WB challenges with mixed lighting or clips that need more correction and you've shot anything other than RAW or Prores, you will adjust the sliders and what you expect to happen (and happens on RAW / Prores footage) will not happen, instead you will be greeted with bizarre mush and strange tints and all manner of other challenges.

[IronFilm]

Many people (both photographers and videographers) will have two bodies, because:

1) you need a backup! Could be just "something/anything" to get you out of a pinch in an emergency, but ideally it would be an identical body (or at least, very similar). 

2) photographers will often run two bodies at once simultaneously, so they can switch from one to another very quickly. (for instance doing a wedding with a 24mm prime on a D760, and 85mm prime on the other D760. Or perhaps they'll use two zooms, such a Sigma 18-35mm on a D500, and a 50-150mm on the other D500. These setups could also change during the course of the day, same two bodies, but different pairings of lenses)

3) videographers often shoot with two cameras (or more!) rolling at the same time, so they've got another camera they can cut to during the edit that's in the same moment of time

Thus you've got many reasons here to go for two bodies, rather than just one. 

Unless you're working on the very high end for photography (and need something specific that's specialized from your camera kit), I'd go with a Panasonic S1H + S5 pairing as a starting point. 

If you really need high resolution, beyond 24megapixels, then I might go instead S1H + S1R, or a Nikon Z7mk2 + Z6mk2. 

But it is unlikely that's a genuine "need", as for most people, even the average professional, the DSLRs have for a long time reach "good enough" standards for photography. (unlike with filmmaking, where each step forward with camera bodies in recent years has been more worthwhile)

Heck, even an anciently old Canon 5Dmk2 or Nikon D700 is still "good enough" for many pros to use as their secondary backup! And even an old D810/D750/5DS is still a main camera for many! (Scott Choucino only just "recently" upgraded to the 5DS a couple of years ago)

 

 

As you can, I really really like Tin House Studio / Scott Choucino! He doesn't talk about gear too much (these videos are some of the exceptions! ha. But in a way, he "talks about gear" only just enough to address this and say "it doesn't matter") But he talks a lot of the philosophy / business behind what he does, which is broadly applicable not just to food photographers like himself, but even what I do as a Production Sound Mixer. Scott provides good food for thought. 

[Mark Romero 2]

3 minutes ago, IronFilm said:

Many people (both photographers and videographers) will have two bodies, because:

1) you need a backup! Could be just "something/anything" to get you out of a pinch in an emergency, but ideally it would be an identical body (or at least, very similar). 

2) photographers will often run two bodies at once simultaneously, so they can switch from one to another very quickly. (for instance doing a wedding with a 24mm prime on a D760, and 85mm prime on the other D760. Or perhaps they'll use two zooms, such a Sigma 18-35mm on a D500, and a 50-150mm on the other D500. These setups could also change during the course of the day, same two bodies, but different pairings of lenses)

3) videographers often shoot with two cameras (or more!) rolling at the same time, so they've got another camera they can cut to during the edit that's in the same moment of time

Thus you've got many reasons here to go for two bodies, rather than just one. 

Unless you're working on the very high end for photography (and need something specific that's specialized from your camera kit), I'd go with a Panasonic S1H + S5 pairing as a starting point. 

If you really need high resolution, beyond 24megapixels, then I might go instead S1H + S1R, or a Nikon Z7mk2 + Z6mk2. 

But it is unlikely that's a genuine "need", as for most people, even the average professional, the DSLRs have for a long time reach "good enough" standards for photography. (unlike with filmmaking, where each step forward with camera bodies in recent years has been more worthwhile)

Heck, even an anciently old Canon 5Dmk2 or Nikon D700 is still "good enough" for many pros to use as their secondary backup! And even an old D810/D750/5DS is still a main camera for many! (Scott Choucino only just "recently" upgraded to the 5DS a couple of years ago)

 

 

As you can, I really really like Tin House Studio / Scott Choucino! He doesn't talk about gear too much (these videos are some of the exceptions! ha. But in a way, he "talks about gear" only just enough to address this and say "it doesn't matter") But he talks a lot of the philosophy / business behind what he does, which is broadly applicable not just to food photographers like himself, but even what I do as a Production Sound Mixer. Scott provides good food for thought. 

Agree that two bodies are better than one (particularly for the reasons you mentioned), and doubly agree that if they are similar bodies, it's going to be a lot easier.

It's easy to switch from the S5 to the S1 (despite having two different batteries), but a bit harder when switching to my Oly E-M1 MK II, and trying to switch back and forth between my Panasonic bodies and Sony bodies is just stupid. 

I am lucky in that I am using Godox flash and the transmitter works (to a certain extent) with all camera bodies, although it only provides TTL flash with Panasonic and Olympus bodies. 

[kye]

@SRV1981 Another couple of points that @IronFilms post also reminds me of are:

The particular colour peculiarities you will get with a camera will take years to truly understand, so having a single system will be much much better than having to learn how to colour correct and troubleshoot different cameras.

The more you know, the less the equipment matters.  All through my journey of learning to make videos the biggest limitation was me, and knowing what I know now, I can get pretty decent results from almost any camera.  At the moment I'm having heaps of fun with my Panasonic GF3 from 2011 and the 14mm f2.5 lens that it came with when I bought it.  I love this combo because it's small and light enough to take wherever I want and no-one bats an eyelid at it, and it's good enough (combined with my ability to process the footage in sophisticated ways in Resolve) to get results I think are usable but isn't too good which makes me think too much about the technical aspects of the image and lets my perfectionism get in the way of content and story.

[IronFilm]

22 hours ago, MrSMW said:

2: Fuji GFX50Sii stills, XT4 video. I came from Fuji and know their video is good, their AF good enough and the stills I think are still the best. Just.

No way to effectively share lenses though?
 

22 hours ago, MrSMW said:

4: Nikon Z7ii stills, Z6ii video. Great all-rounders though possibly the weakest video spec? Great image though.

If you're happy to add an Atomos Ninja V (or a Blackmagic recorder) then I don't think they've got weak video specs at all.  Plus when it comes to stills, you've got a good advantage that you can tap into the Nikon ecosystem. 

  

10 minutes ago, kye said:

The particular colour peculiarities you will get with a camera will take years to truly understand, so having a single system will be much much better than having to learn how to colour correct and troubleshoot different cameras.

This is also a good reason why a person should stick with one camera system for as long as possible, rather than jumping back and forth every other year. 

As let's be honest, even the "worst choice" (if picking a current model) in what is now nearly 2022 is still going to be damn good at both video and especially stills! 

So stick with it, and get 100% out of it. Rather than choosing "the best" and only getting 80% out of it. 

[MrSMW]

1 hour ago, IronFilm said:

No way to effectively share lenses though?

True and ‘The Compromise’ with that option.

1 hour ago, IronFilm said:

f you're happy to add an Atomos Ninja V (or a Blackmagic recorder) then I don't think they've got weak video specs at all.  Plus when it comes to stills, you've got a good advantage that you can tap into the Nikon ecosystem. 

Tried it. Hated it. I’ve got a camera on each hip and the sheer bulk/awkwardness just didn’t work for me.

Also, on freestanding monopod, the S5 plus lens I can trust, but the S1H is literally tipping the balance.  
On that basis I wouldn’t trust a Z6 plus external recorder with battery.

Internal recording is a must for me shooting hybrid and juggling 3 cameras as a one man band.

I do like Nikon and shot the system (film and then DSLR) for 10 years prior to Fuji and nearly went Z6 instead of L Mount approximately 1 year ago.

[MrSMW]

1 hour ago, IronFilm said:

This is also a good reason why a person should stick with one camera system for as long as possible, rather than jumping back and forth every other year. 

Indeed and one of the most overlooked…if not the most overlooked aspects for those seeking improvement in their photography or filmmaking.

[Thpriest]

I think price also plays an important part. 

For the price of a Sony A7SIII you can get a Panasonic S1 and S5. If you add in a A7IV then you could get a couple of lenses and sd cards for the Panasonics.

 

[herein2020]

I know everyone here will laugh at me, but in all seriousness, if I were in your exact dilemma and were shooting for non-professional non paid use and mixed photos/videos I would get a used EOS R or possibly a pair of them; one set up for video and one set up for photos an EF adapter and used EF lenses. You also get 30MP vs 20MP which is better for cropping in when needed.

It has the same sensor as the 5DIV, it is $1000.00 less than the R6, it has Canon colors, DPAF, and does not overheat. There is no way I'd trust the R6 for any video projects because it overheats in all modes. At least the R5 has a few modes where it does not overheat. The EOS R does not overheat in any modes. I very briefly had the R6 and took it back within 48hrs, you can read more about my experience with the R6 here. I ultimately ended up with the S5 which you can read about here, but it has its own list of compromises (mainly CAF), which you can read about here.

But I digress; I agree with what almost everyone else here is saying, one body to do it all sounds great but seems nearly impossible in the real world. For me; even if the perfect hybrid camera existed I would still need two of them and they would be set up completely different.

Photos - For the photo body I would need a battery grip; since I shoot a lot of portrait work I need the vertical shutter button and back button focus, I would also need the additional battery for long photo shoots like weddings and events, and I would need a shoulder strap mounted to the top mount on the camera. Last but not least, my tripod adapter plate needs to be mounted inline with the bottom of the camera body.

Videos - For video work I need a camera cage, no battery grip for easier balancing on gimbals, and no shoulder strap mount since it would get in the way of video work. I need the camera cage to mount accessories like mics, video lights, and top and side handles. I would also need the tripod adapter plate to be mounted perpendicular to the camera body so that I can slide it into the receiver plate of the NATO rails/V-Mount battery setup for long form work and for gimbal work. Below is a picture of my long form setup.

Now it would be absolutely great to be able to have two identical bodies so that I could share batteries, lenses, accessories, etc. and each one could backup the other one when needed (like for a wedding I could just rig both for video or both for photos); but I am still waiting and it still hasn't happened yet. 

Panasonic - Unusable CAF and needs L-Mount lenses if you are going all in which I won't due to the CAF situation.

Sony - Not even a consideration for me, not a fan of their ergonomics, build quality, proprietary accessories, and would need all new lenses.

Canon - R6 overheats in all modes, no XLR options for the R5, R5 overheats in most modes, hard to edit H.265 4:2:2 video files, would need an adapter or all new RF lenses, no WFM. C70 can't be used for photos, is missing IBIS, and has known flip out screen quality issues.

Nikon - who? 

If Canon were to release an R5 Mark II with XLR options, no overheating (except in 8K which I couldn't care less about 8K), an eND filter, an H.265 4:2:0 10 bit option, and WFM for video, I would sell all of my gear and standardize on two of them with all RF lenses.

 

[Thpriest]

I think all of this shows that if Panasonic were to fix their AF they could really start taking a larger share of the market. They have got just about everything else right, ergonomics, colours, image, reliability, price...the L range of lenses is starting to grow. If the S5 had good AF it'd sell bucket loads.

[herein2020]

22 minutes ago, Thpriest said:

I think all of this shows that if Panasonic were to fix their AF they could really start taking a larger share of the market. They have got just about everything else right, ergonomics, colours, image, reliability, price...the L range of lenses is starting to grow. If the S5 had good AF it'd sell bucket loads.

You've nailed it, I'd probably have two S5's and all L mount lenses right now and possibly an S1R as a dedicated photo body. Panasonic has everything else as you mentioned....accessories, XLR options, reliability, no overheating, no record limits, dual slot video recording, WFM, VLOG Varicam color science, right price, perfect size, great build quality, great photography features, etc. But none of it matters if your footage is not in focus or you are constantly dropping to manual focus when it just won't focus on something that should be simple. Even their focus peaking leaves much to be desired.

[Django]

1 hour ago, herein2020 said:

I know everyone here will laugh at me, but in all seriousness, if I were in your exact dilemma and were shooting for non-professional non paid use and mixed photos/videos I would get a used EOS R or possibly a pair of them; one set up for video and one set up for photos an EF adapter and used EF lenses. You also get 30MP vs 20MP which is better for cropping in when needed.

It has the same sensor as the 5DIV, it is $1000.00 less than the R6, it has Canon colors, DPAF, and does not overheat. There is no way I'd trust the R6 for any video projects because it overheats in all modes. At least the R5 has a few modes where it does not overheat. The EOS R does not overheat in any modes. I very briefly had the R6 and took it back within 48hrs, you can read more about my experience with the R6 here. I ultimately ended up with the S5 which you can read about here, but it has its own list of compromises (mainly CAF), which you can read about here.

EOS R has that horrible 1.7x crop when shooting 4K. Its basically a FHD FF camera. Also it doesn't do internal 10-bit 4:2:2 or Clog3. I had EOS R and honestly do not miss it one bit for video. R6 on the other hand has the nicest FF IQ I've seen on any Canon.

The overheating on R6 is real but since the latest firmware updates I haven't experienced ANY overheating. I've been on ALL DAY 4k shoots and no overheat. I don't shoot more than 10mn clips though so my user case may certainly be different than others but thankfully for me the overheat has become a non-issue. I even left the camera on accidentally during 12 hours once and it was ready to shoot the next day no problem so it looks like they've been using some clever power management which wasn't the case at first when it was timer based.

Btw, Potato Jet made the A7IV overheat in like 12 minutes in his 100 degree test. I guess if you're shooting in that kind of heat, most hybrids will fail after X amount of time.

[herein2020]

41 minutes ago, Django said:

EOS R has that horrible 1.7x crop when shooting 4K. Its basically a FHD FF camera. Also it doesn't do internal 10-bit 4:2:2 or Clog3. I had EOS R and honestly do not miss it one bit for video. R6 on the other hand has the nicest FF IQ I've seen on any Canon.

The overheating on R6 is real but since the latest firmware updates I haven't experienced ANY overheating. I've been on ALL DAY 4k shoots and no overheat. I don't shoot more than 10mn clips though so my user case may certainly be different than others but thankfully for me the overheat has become a non-issue. I even left the camera on accidentally during 12 hours once and it was ready to shoot the next day no problem so it looks like they've been using some clever power management which wasn't the case at first when it was timer based.

Btw, Potato Jet made the A7IV overheat in like 12 minutes in his 100 degree test. I guess if you're shooting in that kind of heat, most hybrids will fail after X amount of time.

 

I have gotten used to dealing with crops since the S5 has a crop at 4K60FPS and the GH5 which I used for years had a pretty serious crop factor due to being a 4/3rd sensor so I pick wider lenses to accommodate the crop. But that's good news for the R6, when I got it, it had the original firmware and watching that countdown timer was pure torture for me. I live in FL where it is typically 95 degree heat and 100% humidity in the summer so overheating is a real concern of mine. Speaking of which even my C200 overheated once and I had to turn the fan on high to keep it going.

I am pretty sure I could get my S5 to overheat if I tried hard enough but for normal shooting I've never had the GH5 or S5 overheat. One trick I do is if it is something like a wedding in the middle of the summer, I will cover the body with a white towel and leave the cameras off until the last possible second. Sometimes I keep it covered with the white towel even while shooting. I learned that trick from a news crew who was covering one of the projects I was filming; they shot the whole segment from underneath white towels on the camera. Direct sunlight here in FL is a real problem.

[kye]

5 hours ago, herein2020 said:

I live in FL where it is typically 95 degree heat and 100% humidity in the summer so overheating is a real concern of mine.

Most people live in areas that don't get very hot, so we're both in the minority.  In the northern parts of Australia there are places that have daily average max of 107 deg, had a record heatwave of hitting over 100 deg for 170 consecutive days and has hit over 120 deg.

I did a trip there once and had my iPhone overheat and had to submerge it in the river to cool it down enough to resume filming.  No-one talks about iPhones overheating, but there are places it happens!  When manufacturers test cameras at 75 degrees it's almost a practical joke.

[IronFilm]

Shoot indoors in small sets, with tonnes of crew (bionic mobile heaters is what people are!), and heaps of lights (some are heaters first, and light emitters as an after thought!) then it will quickly get very hot in there indeed during even a normal summer. 

But thank goodness LEDs are on their way in, and space heater style lights are on their way out. 

[SRV1981]

On 10/24/2021 at 1:02 AM, IronFilm said:

'd go with a Panasonic S1H + S5 pairing as a starting point. 

But the AF wouldn't be helpful for sports, etc. in Video or Photo so that feels like a non-starter?  I am not opposed to 2-cameras but I am *not* a professional. I am doing this for personal travel, family and for the students I work with as their teacher (mini-docs/sports - video/photo)

 

On 10/24/2021 at 1:18 PM, Django said:

The overheating on R6 is real but since the latest firmware updates I haven't experienced ANY overheating.

This gives me more confidence to snag an R6 this week.  I really do like the images of the S5/S1H but the autofocus is a huge dealbreaker.  I like some of the images of the a7IV but the skin tones and color just need too much work for the amount of time i'm willing to invest.  I'm convinced, thanks to this forum, that I will need to step-up my color correction game in the coming months when I shoot but I'd rather start with a product I know will produce images/color I like such as Canon.

If I go with an R6 i don't believe i'll need a separate body as I think the video/photo output is top of its class.  If Panasonic had phenomenal AF for video but not photo then I'd can a Canon EOS R for photo and Panasonic S5/S1H for video but alas that's not reality.  I could also wait for Panasonic to maybe come out with AF that is good enough, but when will that be?  How many chances to create will be missed?  It's truly amazing and frustrating how fast technology is moving.

[Thpriest]

Depends when you need the camera and where you will be showing your work. Maybe the GH6 will be a great all rounder if they improve the AF and your photos are for social media.

There's always a next camera.

[Mark Romero 2]

8 hours ago, SRV1981 said:

I could also wait for Panasonic to maybe come out with AF that is good enough, but when will that be?  How many chances to create will be missed?  It's truly amazing and frustrating how fast technology is moving.

Panasonic won't be releasing a full frame camera for a while, I believe. I mean, they announced the development of the GH6 AT THE SAME TIME they released the GH5 II, so I don't think they would hold back on announcing development of a new S1 / S5 camera.

[IronFilm]

10 hours ago, SRV1981 said:

But the AF wouldn't be helpful for sports, etc. in Video or Photo so that feels like a non-starter?  I am not opposed to 2-cameras but I am *not* a professional. I am doing this for personal travel, family and for the students I work with as their teacher (mini-docs/sports - video/photo)

Well with that context, for nonprofessional standard of sports photography, then I'm sure the Panasonic S1H or S5 is overkill, and is more than good enough for your needs. You don't have your next mortgage payment riding on the fact if you can snap that next front page image before anybody else does. 

Heck, if had to shoot a friend's sports event tomorrow for free/fun (not that any of that is happening right now... in lockdowns) then I'd grab my Nikon D90 with the Nikon 70-300mm f4.5-5.6G lens that I've got. (or perhaps my Panasonic GH4 with the Panasonic Lumix G Vario 45-200mm f/4.0-5.6) And I'd be happy! And my hypothetical "friend" would be stoked with the images too. 

People sh*t all over the Panasonic S series AF performance, but I'd be surprised if it is worse than either of those two cameras that I mentioned. 
 

People forget how in the photography world that their DSLRs have become "good enough" for many years now for the majority of casual amateur photographers. (heck, even smartphones are "good enough" for many. That's why the P&S genre of cameras are almost extinct) This "plateau" of "good enough" for photos got hit many years earlier for DSLRs than it did for videos with HDSLRs/mirrorless. (I'd say that happened only just very recently, when internal 4K 10bit became mainstream in mirrorless)

That's why I'll make the controversial statement (for a gear geek forum! As we pixel peep too much, and argue over small 5% differences in performance) "for the majority of casual snappers a Nikon D90 with good glass is going to be good enough image quality". (and if you splurge a little more for say a Nikon D700, that only costs a couple of hundred extra bucks on eBay, then you've got a camera that's got "good enough" image quality for not just the majority of casual snappers but I'd say 90%+ of them!)

Just browse for instance the pics from a Nikon D700 on 500px:
https://500px.com/gear/cameras/nikon/d700/ 

Now, are there reasons other than the photos why an average casual photo snapper might want something other than a D90/D700? Such as better video, WiFi, lighter, modern UI, etc etc etc 

Yes! Of course. 

But I don't think photography image quality or even stills AF should be ranked in the top three concerns for most casual snappers. Look at the broader picture of what else you want/need. (such as price / weight / compactness / lens selection / ergonomics / UI / etc )

I linked before to a few videos Tin House Studio did about gear selection, and he uses a Canon 5DR! Do I think that's a great camera body??? Oh hell no!! The Nikon D850 / Sony a7Rmk4 / Nikon Z7mk2 / Panasonic S1R all are objectively bodies with more features, better design, and better image quality. 

But even though he is a professional photographer, and thus has far far higher standards of image quality than any of us in this thread, the Canon 5DR makes more sense for him, because the image quality easily exceeds "good enough" 95%+ of the time (and those few rare times it doesn't he can just hire in a Hasselblad or whatever) and all those other factors are important to him such as: lens selection (FE / L / Z mount for instance don't have any of the lenses he needs for his work), ease of transitioning over (almost zero downtime for him in moving over from a 5Dmk3 to a 5DR, and "time = money"), and slots into his existing ecosystem (everything he has already for his half a dozen 5D bodies he already has can be interchangeably used with his 5DR as well). 

 

 

[Django]

5DS/R is still a studio workhorse. Few FF cameras still surpass its 50.6 MP resolution including R5. And with the lowpass filter cancelation its sharpness is another asset for certain types of photography.

Like a lot of filmmakers, my passion started out with photography at a young age. My first SLR was a Nikon and it got me infatuated with FF lenses. Fast-forward to the Canon 5D series which was my gateway into FF digital. I actually still own and use my OG 5D mk1. It has this look I attribute to early digital sensors I can't get from newer Canons. Same thing with Nikon which I actually went back to right around D700/D750. D700 also has a special mojo sensor imo. Same with Leica and why I'm sticking to the pre-CMOS (CCD) M9.

And then obviously there is film, which has made a huge comeback (well some will argue it never left). So yeah basically I agree, not only do I think still bodies plateau'd a long time ago, there are instances where older tech gives out a nicer image, subjectively speaking. Kind of like how in cinema the OG ARRI Alexa still gets praised even though the sensor and resolution are archaic by current tech standards. Let's not even get started with vintage lenses!

That said this is all coming from a sort of irrational nostalgic pov where mojo trumps DR, Resolution, AF etc.

For video/cine its indeed a different story. codecs, resolution, AF, exposure aids, media storage etc have been constantly evolving in the last ten years.

Things like eye-track AF can be life savers in solo run & gun situations. Having such a reliable AF means I can focus on other things (no pun intended) during a shoot.