Panavision working with NASA on digital cinema camera technology?

[Andrew Reid]

[html]

[img]http://www.eoshd.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/panavision-jpl-control-room.jpg[/img]

Ground control to Major Tom – Today Panavision unveiled a new Dynamax sensor for the TV and scientific industries, which does 12bit 2K and 1080p with a global shutter. It turns out this sensor contains [url="http://image-sensors-world.blogspot.de/2012/05/panavision-32mp-bsi-sensor-uses-jpl.html"]NASA developed[/url] technology from the US state funded Jet Propulsion Laboratory.

[url="http://www.eoshd.com/content/8003/panavision-working-with-nasa-on-digital-cinema-camera-technology/"]Read full article[/url]

[/html]

[Tzedekh]

Blackmagic Design hasn't confirmed that its Cinema Camera uses the BAE/Fairchild CIS2051 sensor.

[tony wilson]

panavision slow kill from unsustainable debt levels and bulky old film cameras.
value only in optics in the store rooms.
nasa slow kill ex space agency that today have too rely on the russians to get into space.
nearly as bad as the brits with aircraft carriers but axed the plane programme.
so aircraft carriers with no aircraft and a space agency that relies on the old enemy too get into space.
like all nasa projects the technology will be given underhand to china or a group of developers will leave and set up a company.
nasa have relied mainly on kodak,phillips and dalsa over the years i cannot believe the funding for this has come from nasa,who are dieing from obama's cuts.
unless it is connected with a earth based kill technology which seems to be america's biggest growth area.
my guess from someone that has purchased a lot of old nasa optics.
the investment in sensor is more too do with drone surveillance systems a rapid expansion of which is going on for use in the american homeland.
with all the corruption in the uk,usa and france sometimes the best technology does not get the investment back handers prevail.
dalsa are a superb sensor company who have lost out in the last few years not to superior competitor product but simply not paying off the proper people.

[cameraboy]

but in standard mode (not HDR ) its only 62 db (10.6 stops of DR) less than kodak ccd sensor in ikonoskop ...

[Tzedekh]

[quote author=cameraboy link=topic=690.msg5041#msg5041 date=1336465340]
but in standard mode (not HDR ) its only 62 db (10.6 stops of DR) less than kodak ccd sensor in ikonoskop ...
[/quote]
Then leave HDR mode on. The [url=http://www.arri.de/camera/digital_cameras/technology/arri_imaging_technology/alexas_sensor.html][u]Arri Alexa's sensor[/u][/url] would probably have only about 10 stops of DR if it didn't perform a dual readout of its pixels. In other words, it's in HDR mode by default. Strangely, this sensor seems to be virtually identical to another Panavision Imaging sensor, the [url=http://www.panavisionimaging.com/PDF/D11_PB0017_2011_11_04.pdf][u]Dynamax-11[/u][/url], announced last November. And viimagic's [url=http://www.viimagic.com/fileadmin/pdf/viimagic-9221-9222-Product-Brief_V04.pdf][u]9221/2[/u][/url] and [url=http://www.viimagic.com/fileadmin/pdf/viimagic-9225-9226-Product-Brief_V03.pdf][u]9225/6[/u][/url] sensors have similar specs.

[Andrew Reid]

[quote author=tony wilson link=topic=690.msg5021#msg5021 date=1336415090]
panavision slow kill from unsustainable debt levels and bulky old film cameras.
value only in optics in the store rooms.
nasa slow kill ex space agency that today have too rely on the russians to get into space.
nearly as bad as the brits with aircraft carriers but axed the plane programme.
so aircraft carriers with no aircraft and a space agency that relies on the old enemy too get into space.
like all nasa projects the technology will be given underhand to china or a group of developers will leave and set up a company.
nasa have relied mainly on kodak,phillips and dalsa over the years i cannot believe the funding for this has come from nasa,who are dieing from obama's cuts.
unless it is connected with a earth based kill technology which seems to be america's biggest growth area.
my guess from someone that has purchased a lot of old nasa optics.
the investment in sensor is more too do with drone surveillance systems a rapid expansion of which is going on for use in the american homeland.
with all the corruption in the uk,usa and france sometimes the best technology does not get the investment back handers prevail.
dalsa are a superb sensor company who have lost out in the last few years not to superior competitor product but simply not paying off the proper people.
[/quote]

Enjoyed reading this, cheers Tony. Dalsa are more CCD specialists and the trend is for CMOS tech. But I do agree a lot of corruption goes on disguised as business. The world has not changed as far as underhand dealings go - just got better at branding it.

[cameraboy]

@Tzedekh
arri alexa Dual Gain Architecture is different than HDR (2 frames to combine them for HDR)...
working with HDR image is similar as working with VFX...go to reduser forum and read about their experience with EPIC HDR  ... its not free lunch ... i like that my camera image sensor have native high DR than all that tricks...

[Tzedekh]

[quote author=cameraboy link=topic=690.msg5052#msg5052 date=1336492206]
@Tzedekh
arri alexa Dual Gain Architecture is different than HDR (2 frames to combine them for HDR)...
working with HDR image is similar as working with VFX...go to reduser forum and read about their experience with EPIC HDR  ... its not free lunch ... i like that my camera image sensor have native high DR than all that tricks...
[/quote]
There are several ways to accomplish HDR, and one of them is with dual gain. In the Alexa, two 14-bit images -- a high-gain one and a low-gain one -- are captured simultaneously and combined into a single 16-bit composite image. That sounds like an HDR approach to me.

[shijan]

[quote author=Tzedekh link=topic=690.msg5018#msg5018 date=1336410615]
Blackmagic Design hasn't confirmed that its Cinema Camera uses the BAE/Fairchild CIS2051 sensor.
[/quote]
its clear that it uses that sensor without BM confirmation. Just look here even 30 fps limit match to BM http://ridl.cfd.rit.edu/products/sCMOS/scmos_white_paper_8mb.pdf mera specs.

[Tzedekh]

[quote author=shijan link=topic=690.msg5066#msg5066 date=1336504866]
[quote author=Tzedekh link=topic=690.msg5018#msg5018 date=1336410615]
Blackmagic Design hasn't confirmed that its Cinema Camera uses the BAE/Fairchild CIS2051 sensor.
[/quote]
its clear that it uses that sensor without BM confirmation. Just look here even 30 fps limit match to BM cahttp://ridl.cfd.rit.edu/products/sCMOS/scmos_white_paper_8mb.pdf mera specs.
[/quote]
Some of the specs match up, but others don't. The CIS2051 has a global-shutter mode, whereas the BM camera is rolling shutter only (or so it's been claimed by those supposedly in the know). The 2051 can do 105 fps at 2,560 x 2,160 (52.5 fps with a global shutter) and far higher frame rates in various windowed modes. The lack of a global shutter and higher frame rates may be a function of system bandwidth, particularly since the BMC's raw is uncompressed. It's possible that with a comparatively easy-to-process compressed raw codec (like CineForm RAW, which, according to David Newman, takes less processing power than ProRes), higher frame rates might be possible. Only BMD knows for sure.