SOOC color - 1/2 Cameras ? Xt4 vs r6

[Django]

16 minutes ago, SRV1981 said:

Do you suggest any videos or blogs to improve competency for the camera. The XT2 was legit I turned it on and boom amazing color.  I’d love to get to that point. You think the R6 color equals XT4?

Sorry I don't know any specific R6 blogs/videos. This forum is one of the best places though! Been shooting Canon professionally for years. The advice I just gave you is the best I can think of. Well one more important thing, try setting your AWB settings to "priority white". Because by default R6 goes to a (imo) unpleasing yellow cast in mixed lighting.

I think R6 surpasses Fuji colours but that's purely subjective. Color science is a very personal thing. 

Fuji does have some of the best white balance and that can make a substantial difference in overall color science. So again check your AWB setting!

What bothers you with R6 colours exactly, can you be more specific?

[webrunner5]

This is a new video review of sorts of the latest Sony Xperia out. It has a true zoom lens in it. Sony does some crazy stuff.

 

[webrunner5]

Well, I think this Sony video of the phone I have is way better looking than I can shoot, so you can see what it can do in the video. I think it is pretty amazing. The specs on it are crazy also. It has a 10 bit 4K screen that has the same look as the 10,000 dollar Trimaster Sony screens. So it is a equal match. It is that kind of stuff that really stands out. It even shoots 4K 120. It can shoot either 264 or 265.

 

[webrunner5]

Sorry hit wrong key, senior moment.

[Thomas Hill]

3 hours ago, Django said:

@webrunner5  I don't understand, you bought a Sirui anamorphic lens.. for a Sony Xperia ? How is that even possible to interchange a lens on a smartphone? 

This dude shot a feature on an iPhone with Nikon lenses in 2014. There's also an article about it on fstoppers.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=byvaxMFUuww&t=17s

[kye]

14 hours ago, SRV1981 said:

Thanks!  Good insight.  So I am not a professional, I am a hobbyist/enthusiast - overthinking/nerd.  

I want to create memorable and cinematic family videos, roadtrip/travel videos, and shoot the athletes I work with (indoor gyms/outdoor tracks) ... mostly video but some photo.  The SOOC color/cinematic look is by far the most important to me. I've been making mistakes jumping from system to system over a few years because I keep thinking I'm going to have the time/desire to learn to color grade etc.  But I'm conceding I do not have interest or time to do so. 

 

Option A - Figure out how to get the Canon R6 to get SOOC colors on par with Fuji

Option B - Replace the Canon R6 with an all-in-one Hybrid system that can cover my needs for SOOC color/cinematic feel

Option C - Replace the Canon R6 with a dedicated video camera and another dedicated photo camera 

I understand most are paid professionals here but that is why I come to this forum - if you were in my position or advising a close friend/family member what would you say?  

I'm having a vague recollection that we've had this conversation before?

I remember someone saying that 1) colour was a very high priority for them, 2) canon colours weren't good enough, and 3) they weren't willing to learn to colour grade.

I remember the thread went no-where because it's not a solvable problem.

2 hours ago, webrunner5 said:

Well, I think this Sony video of the phone I have is way better looking than I can shoot, so you can see what it can do in the video. I think it is pretty amazing. The specs on it are crazy also. It has a 10 bit 4K screen that has the same look as the 10,000 dollar Trimaster Sony screens. So it is a equal match. It is that kind of stuff that really stands out. It even shoots 4K 120. It can shoot either 264 or 265.

 

Interesting video.  I'm reminded of the GoPro promo videos where each 10s section was shot by a 5+ person production team over the course of a week - highly highly highly cherry-picked shots.

I think for someone who doesn't want to do any work in post, a phone will actually be less usable than a larger sensor camera.  Yes, the footage can look great, but if you wave the camera around and then just apply a LUT in post then an Alexa will create the most usable shots, an ILC camera will create less, and the phone will create the least, just because it has a narrower set of circumstances where all factors are within its sweet spot where it creates a great looking image.

2 hours ago, webrunner5 said:

Sorry hit wrong key, senior moment.

If only they were limited to being a senior - I've been having them my whole life!

[webrunner5]

Well for the average person you are going to get a Ton more keepers using a smartphone than a normal camera. And now even for people that want to experiment they have a lot more options now than before. How many cameras can shoot Pro Res that are affordable? Raw on Android phones. 

I have just reached a point where I just want to carry the least I can get by with. I am not going to have even a Sony RX100 with me all the time. I bought a new Tripod for the phone, heck it is like 2 pounds instead of like 8 pounds for my Manfrotto Carbon Fiber. It is just easier. That to me is a huge plus. Nobody is really going to buy a damn 30 pound old Alexa.  I have had stuff like that in the past. It is a total pain in the ass to set it up tear it down, and there is always something that goes wrong using it. All that work, drive 30 miles to shoot and the battery is dead, forgot the media, forgot the monitor cable, on and on. Nah I want footage not problems. I am willing to sacrifice some quality for that. Hell not counting the overall cost is peanuts and heck you can even call people with it.

And yeah my senior moments are getting worse by the day. Old age sucks I can tell you that.

[MrSMW]

1 hour ago, webrunner5 said:

I am not going to have even a Sony RX100 with me all the time.

That is/was me.

Tiny beast though it is (RX100V and now ZV1) I simply do not/forget/cannot be bothered to carry it at all times.

But my phone. Always.

However, start adding attachments such as cages and lenses and…

For me, nah, because it is no longer that handy pocketable device that you have with you at all times.

Armoured case and that’s it.

But back on topic, R6 vs XT4. The best of that pair is the one you already have but if neither, then either. 

[SRV1981]

On 5/23/2022 at 6:13 PM, Django said:

I have an R6 and I find it has some of the best SOOC color science out there. 

Canon is considered a leader in that domain but the competition has mostly caught up.

That said, some people don't like Canon colors so maybe its just not for you.

Make sure you check various picture profiles though as Standard may be a bit to vivid/contrasty.

But of course for best results and a cinematic look you have to shoot Clog.

Clog is very easy to shoot with the view assist on. 

Grading Clog is also very easy and if you're a starter/amateur just go with LUTs.

Only thing is you'll need a very recent computer (M1 Mac) to edit the h265 footage.

I had an XT2 by the way and it did have a nice look thanks to the film simulations which are probably the best picture profiles out there (especially Eterna on later models).

 

@webrunner5  I don't understand, you bought a Sirui anamorphic lens.. for a Sony Xperia ? How is that even possible to interchange a lens on a smartphone? 

Jesus Christ I’d kill my grandmother to find a camera and easy workflow to get color like this:

What in the actual hell! 

[webrunner5]

Doesn't look that special to me, workflow is easy if you are great at using Resolve. If you do that all day I would hope you are good and fast.

But yes I have seen a lot better footage from the C70 than this video. Great camera no doubt. Getting great color from a Canon camera is not too hard of a task.

[SRV1981]

20 minutes ago, webrunner5 said:

Doesn't look that special to me, workflow is easy if you are great at using Resolve. If you do that all day I would hope you are good and fast.

But yes I have seen a lot better footage from the C70 than this video. Great camera no doubt. Getting great color from a Canon camera is not too hard of a task.

I’m a school teacher and really want to get into photos be video but don’t want to get into complex editing. Fast turn around etc is important.  
 

I have the R6. I’m curious how I’d go about getting a similar look on FCP and R6. 
 

also for photo this was amazing and why I love the Fuji colors 

 

[webrunner5]

If you want to get great at shooting Photos start out by doing nothing but B&W. To get a great look in black and white you have to nail the exposure. And that teaches you to take your time, use a light meter and a white balance card. Great photos are rare just snapping a shot you have to take your time look at different angles and think, think a lot. Maybe even come back at a different time, different day.

Once you get a good eye for it apply the same for video. Shoot a lot of short stuff and stich it all together and try to make some sense of it in editing. Then try to match each sequence color wise, exposure wise. Doing all of it over and over is the only way to learn anything, your camera and the editing tools.

Slow things down and think that is the secret to all of it.

[webrunner5]

You want to shoot your stuff using an indecent light meter and you really need to do both photo and video on a tripod. Sharpness is the key to all of it along with perfect focus. Manual focus is really the way to go. Slow and easy, only way it works. Use a timer or a shutter release for photos. 

[MrSMW]

2 hours ago, webrunner5 said:

You want to shoot your stuff using an indecent light meter

When the lighting in the production is really good, that’s what they use on porn videos I suspect.

[webrunner5]

I actually bought a lot of Sony gear back in the day to start a company with my daughter, she was and is a writer, can't say my wife was too fond of this idea, and we went out to California to talk to a few companys doing it and sort of found out at the time most of it was kind of controlled by the mob.

Well, I figured we lived at the time in a mob-controlled city, not uncommon in the Midwest and out East in the 70's early 80's. that this might not be a good time to start this up lol. So we changed gears and started that Ad company I talked about on here. We are still both alive I guess because of that faithful decision. There was, and is a crazy amount of money to be made in the Porn industry if you live to tell about it! I have done some crazy shit in my life.

[MrSMW]

6 hours ago, webrunner5 said:

There was, and is a crazy amount of money to be made in the Porn industry if you live to tell about it!

and use indecent lighting.

[webrunner5]

Well, it is supposed to be incident light meter but could not change the spelling lol. I guess I had porn on my mind in the original draft.

[MrSMW]

Ah, slips of the tongue/keyboard.

At one of my weddings recently, during the speeches, the Father Of The Bride, kept referring to the celebrant as the celibate.

I knew what you meant from the start but do like to milk a faux pas 😜

[kye]

On 5/25/2022 at 9:30 AM, SRV1981 said:

Jesus Christ I’d kill my grandmother to find a camera and easy workflow to get color like this:

What in the actual hell! 

I thought the colour on that video was all over the place actually?  Some shots green and faded, others with more contrast and more of the Canon reds.  It all looked like Canon colours though, which you said you didn't like?

[SRV1981]

8 hours ago, kye said:

I thought the colour on that video was all over the place actually?  Some shots green and faded, others with more contrast and more of the Canon reds.  It all looked like Canon colours though, which you said you didn't like?

The files labeled "Video" are from the c70 they used and I find it to be absolutely stunning, If i could achieve that on my R6 I would keep it and ask how to do this.

(1st three that pop up are x100v; rest are c70)

The rest are from the Fuji X100V, which I was wondering if I should pick up for photography and use R6 for video? - I reached out to the guy that edited these because I find them to be amazing.