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Canon EOS R7 and R10 have released...


Dave Maze
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Ok video specs are still a little confusing but from what I understand: 

4K60p (oversampled)  = no crop line-skipped 

4K60p (1:1) = 1.6x + 1.8x crop

So both 4K60p modes suffer quality hit.

4KFine (30p) is where its at for HQ IQ. It's rated at 30mn overheat but Gordon Laing shows a test with over 2 hours without overheat as do other youtubers. If that's really the case then that is the mode where it's going to be at for video.

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8 hours ago, Django said:

4K60p (1:1) = 1.6x + 1.8x crop

I think the crop is 1.8, not 1.8 in addition to the 1.6 crop. I feel like that'd be utterly insane, even by Canon standards. Dan Watson was quite complimentary of it. 

 

12 hours ago, Avenger 2.0 said:

Saw the Jared Polin preview and he said the R7 didn't overheat on a hot (demo) day shooting video all day and there is no time limit on recording 😎 Also looks to have dual sd card recording for video and C.LOG3.

I don't think anyone had the camera for long enough to do any in depth overheating tests. 

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10 hours ago, Django said:

well this came out of nowhere !? seems like you've got the usual Canon limitations when you check the fine print:

ha, of course Canon does!

10 hours ago, Django said:

so that leaves you with: line-skipped uncropped 4K.

correction:

"so that leaves you with: line-skipped uncropped 4K 30fps."

  

9 hours ago, Django said:

Ok video specs are still a little confusing but from what I understand: 

4K60p (oversampled)  = no crop line-skipped 

4K60p (1:1) = 1.6x + 1.8x crop

So both 4K60p modes suffer quality hit.

4KFine (30p) is where its at for HQ IQ. It's rated at 30mn overheat but Gordon Laing shows a test with over 2 hours without overheat as do other youtubers. If that's really the case then that is the mode where it's going to be at for video.

Thanks for the clarification 

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4 hours ago, David Bowgett said:

It's worth remembering that the only other APS-C cameras that do 4k60 at all are the XT-3 and XT-4, and they have crops as well, albeit smaller ones (1.25x on top of the existing crop, so 1.88x overall).

Of course if you are not counting only stills cameras, then there are heaps more: such as the Sony FS7 & Pocket 6K

 

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4 hours ago, JurijTurnsek said:

Soft IQ is a godsend for feature films, as is 60p!

Is it?

Rhetorical question...

I've recently quietly removed and put away all my 1/8th Pro Mist filters plus turned my in camera sharpening back up.

Why?

Well ideally, I'd like to have kep the Pro Mist's but the reality is that in certain lighting conditions, green reflections show up in the footage. I can't stand that anymore so ditched them.

Re. sharpening,I've come to the conclusion that it's easier and better to soften in post than it is too sharpen and some footage just looks too soft without a degree of sharpening.

I don't like the digital look and want my wedding productions to look 'cinematic', but I always try not to do things for the sake of doing things because that's what you are 'supposed' to do.

YMMV of course and that's fine but my (again rhetorical) question is when is 'good enough' good enough and how far beyond 'good enough' are we?

But things have to progress I know and companies need to bring out new product etc...

Just musing really...

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15 hours ago, newfoundmass said:

I think the crop is 1.8, not 1.8 in addition to the 1.6 crop. I feel like that'd be utterly insane, even by Canon standards. Dan Watson was quite complimentary of it. 

 

again:

The R7's cropped 4K/60 applies a 1.81x crop on top of the sensor's existing 1.6x crop, relative to full-frame. This will be useful for achieving a zoomed-in look but means you're using just 1/4 of the camera's sensor, so there'll be a significant noise cost in all but the best light.

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32 minutes ago, Django said:

Dan Watson was quite complimentary of it.

I’m not really one to comment on others or label them as shills, but I had to stop watching that one halfway as I found it utterly sycophantic.

Everything he reviews is the best thing ever.

Sorry, but a lot of it simply is not.

I’m pretty uninspired by what’s being produced these days but at the same time, makes me quite pleased…smug even, I have switched and have stuck to Panasonic and L Mount.

Other than the grossly exaggerated size/weight/cost and less than stellar tracking AF, I still think it’s the best all round system out there. For me.

Will they carry on with it and bring out a next gen S2 line?

I hope so and hope equally as hard, they don’t fuck it up.

Canon just seem intent on beating themselves to death.

Sony arguably has the best all round kit all factors considered, but it’s boring as hell to me. 

Nikon seem to have finally upped their game with the Z9 and if they can now, as I presume they will, trickle that down into some smaller, more affordable and actually available bodies, then good for them.

Still waiting to see what Fuji do with these XH2’s.

OM-1 highly interesting, but still not entirely convinced and seems to be very adventure and wildlife orientated, which is fine and it’s the camera I’d most like to test.

GH6 got more interesting than I thought it would, but the AF still concerns me as for part of my work, I do have a need.

Holy Grail, still as yet, undiscovered.

R7 summary, I suspect it will be great for stills, but as a serious video machine for say us wedding video people? Nah, it’s the R7 Double Cripple Special.

The R10 I kind of get, sub 1k entry level mirrorless, but the R7…

Is it deliberate or are they just willfully obtuse over at Canon Towers?

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@MrSMW Please rectify your quote. I never mentioned Dan Watson nor did I even watch his video review!

As for camera systems, Canon has a pretty solid mirrorless line-up (R3, R5, R5C, R6, R7, R10, R) and lens system (EF, EF-S, RF, RF-S).

With 6K/8K RAW Light, DPAF2 and imo the best ergonomics and menus, I'd go as far as saying they've taken back their leadership position. Politics aside.

And despite a few gotchas R7 can do 10-bit oversampled 4K, Log, DPAF2 & 4K60p which none of the same category Sony APS-C cameras can.

If the overheating really isn't an issue in 7K oversampled 4KFine mode, I really don't see why the camera wouldn't be a perfectly solid choice as an APS-C hybrid for wedding or any other pro assignment. It's pretty much the new 7D.

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Ah sorry @Django didn’t purposely attribute that comment re. Dan Watson to you but the forum software did when I quoted the line! Apologies sir!

Actually I agree to an extent re. some of Canon’s stuff…

In fact if I wasn’t shooting what I am using, as I have said elsewhere, it would probably be a pair of R6’s and an R5.

R3 looks pretty decent also as does the R5c.

I always state ‘for my needs’ and this is where the R7 just fails for me and that is because I shoot 4K 50/60p and a 1.6 + 1.8 crop is just a bit nuts to my mind!

I accept that I have a 1.5x crop shooting FF Panny, but coming from Fuji, I’m used to it.

1.6 + 1.8 though is pretty lame.

 

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I think these are overpriced and under spec'd for video, the crops in 4k 50p are indeed lame in 2022, the Fuji XT3 has been out many years and offers more. I am being asked for 4k 50p footage a lot these days so that it can be used as slow mo if needs be. These cameras are no good for this.

Also a bit disappointing there are no reasonably fast crop lenses to go with the cameras or for the C70. Hopefully soon 

For wildlife photography though am sure the R7 will be a big seller

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There is a non crop 4K60p mode but its not oversampled (probably line skipped). 

XT3 doesn't have IBIS. and XT4 is currently 1700€ so more expensive and much worst AF.

I do agree though that RF-S (prime) lenses need to happen if they want this APS-C line to be successful, although you could always use Canon/Sigma EF-S with an adapter.

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I'd imagine the non crop 4k 50p will be rubbish like Canons line skipping of old. 

On closer inspection the R7 isn't really a 7d replacement with poor buffer, no top lcd, no battery grip (so far) and lack of decent weather sealing. Disappointing really even for wildlife photography, wonder how serious Canon are with aps-c if this is their flagship, the 7d was top of the line and a solid and very popular stills camera 

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