MrSMW Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 Did you know (do you even care…) that the venerable S1R can shoot 10 bit, 5k 30p internally? I didn’t until the other day but discovered it does so just for some amusement, tried it. Holy cow, - it’s better than the 4k 60p I have been getting out of all the S cameras shooting the Natural profile. It’s a 3:2 format, but so what. There’s no log available but the Flat profile is quite gradeable. I kind of knew it existed actually but had simply dismissed it as the 6k doesn’t look as good as the 4k so just ‘assumed’ 5k wouldn’t either. Wrong! I shot a few scenes back to back against my usual setting and it’s much nicer so giving it a run out at this weekends wedding… Had to flip everything to NTSC on all 4 cameras and will be working on a 24p timeline instead of my usual 25, but I can squeeze a little more out of my slo mo as it will be 60p @ 40% instead of 50p @ 50%. All the 30p will be @ 80% and only the static talky bits will be in real time, ie, 24p timeline shot at 24fps. So: 24 @ 100%, 30 @ 80% and 60 @ 40%. Could be a ‘game upping’ weekend… 🤔 newfoundmass, webrunner5, zlfan and 1 other 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Owlgreen Posted June 17, 2022 Share Posted June 17, 2022 Aside from cropping in the sides of the sensor to output a 4:3 4992x3774 pixel image from the 3:2 sensor, does the 5K mode also crop vertically, the way it does in the 4K modes? Also, what is the bitrate and how do you find the compression? It'd be interesting to know whether the camera is line-skipping or binning to arrive at the 5K image. Based on the poorly compressed YouTube clips I have seen of the mode, I would guess, and hope, it's via binning. It would be very enlightening if you could upload or link a full-res clip or single frame from the 5K mode, showing a scene with a lot of fine detail, for us to gauge the image quality. Cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSMW Posted June 17, 2022 Author Share Posted June 17, 2022 Don’t ask me technical questions! 🤪 I will have a full production in a couple of weeks plus happy to chuck up a couple of unedited clips on Vimeo ungraded. But you will need to wait until I have shot and edited this job with 1.5 jobs still to edit! Owlgreen 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herein2020 Posted June 18, 2022 Share Posted June 18, 2022 On 6/16/2022 at 11:58 AM, MrSMW said: Did you know (do you even care…) that the venerable S1R can shoot 10 bit, 5k 30p internally? I didn’t until the other day but discovered it does so just for some amusement, tried it. Holy cow, - it’s better than the 4k 60p I have been getting out of all the S cameras shooting the Natural profile. It’s a 3:2 format, but so what. There’s no log available but the Flat profile is quite gradeable. I kind of knew it existed actually but had simply dismissed it as the 6k doesn’t look as good as the 4k so just ‘assumed’ 5k wouldn’t either. Wrong! I shot a few scenes back to back against my usual setting and it’s much nicer so giving it a run out at this weekends wedding… Had to flip everything to NTSC on all 4 cameras and will be working on a 24p timeline instead of my usual 25, but I can squeeze a little more out of my slo mo as it will be 60p @ 40% instead of 50p @ 50%. All the 30p will be @ 80% and only the static talky bits will be in real time, ie, 24p timeline shot at 24fps. So: 24 @ 100%, 30 @ 80% and 60 @ 40%. Could be a ‘game upping’ weekend… 🤔 I know nearly nothing about the S1R other than its the high resolution version of the S series but I did know they all shoot above 4K depending on the rigging. Even the S5 can output 5.9K over HDMI. Panasonic really didn't hold anything back with these cameras. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newfoundmass Posted June 18, 2022 Share Posted June 18, 2022 I've been looking at the S1R because of how cheap they are. I've been thinking at getting into photography, but would also use it for video too. Gonna need to watch some videos to see if it would be okay for video use. TomTheDP 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSMW Posted June 18, 2022 Author Share Posted June 18, 2022 2 hours ago, newfoundmass said: I've been looking at the S1R because of how cheap they are. I've been thinking at getting into photography, but would also use it for video too. Gonna need to watch some videos to see if it would be okay for video use. The ‘problem’ is there is so little info out there… When it launched, plenty of initial reviews. Since, a couple of long term reviews. But since the 5k firmware update, you have to look really hard and what there is, isn’t great. It’s simply a combo of time + the fact it’s Panny full frame which doesn’t get a whole lot of love, mostly due to the ‘AF issue’. I couldn’t see any mention of the 5k mode being only pixel to pixel and have spent hours trying to get it out of that mode but it turns out it’s a default and can’t be changed. No biggie, I like to shoot a bit longer than most and if I understand it correctly, the crop factor is 1.56 and it looks about that to me. This makes my 35mm f2 just over 50mm and my 65mm f2, just over 100mm. Perfect, 50 mil is bang on for me inside and 100 mil great for outdoors. I have the 20mm f2 also which works out just over 30 mil and is great for tighter stuff like dance floor at weddings. Overall, it’s beginning to edge it for me as ‘ultimate hybrid’… Yes, spend a lot more and you can get a Canon R5 or a Sony A1 or in a couple of years, a Nikon Z9, but right now, for around 1500 $€£ you can pick up a ‘like new’ body and that is insane value. The sensor is exceptional. Arguably the version in the Leica SL2 and Q2 is even more exceptional as they tweak the thing further, but it’s easily the best I have had in any camera for stills. Easily. Then, batch run the raw files through DXO PureRaw2 and it takes the files to another level. OK, they are now whoppingly massive DNG files, but when I import those into Lightroom with my custom import preset, there isn’t a whole lot more I need to do other than some straightening, exposure, sometimes WB and any cropping. And re. cropping, I can crop those 65mm shot files like they were shot on anything up to 150+mm and have an end result better than anything shot on a 24mp sensor. Niggles? I don’t like the position of the on/off switch though I have got used to it. Much better on the S1H. The top screen on the S1H is far classier being square and lights up black or white, ie isn’t an orange rectangle. Err, struggling now… It’s built like a tank yet is NOT as massive and heavy as some make out. I don’t have the biggest hands but I’d say it’s pretty Goldilocks in the size, weight, handling department. The stability I’d say is about 1/2 to 1 stop behind the S1H, but still really great. So for me right now, it’s just a question of whether the pixel to pixel, 5k 30p 10 bit 420, as part of the overall bigger picture, makes the S1R my best option right now. I think so… If I want to shoot hybrid anyway and have hi res stills and great SOOC video in a single unit. As for the AF, I have a new technique which is use the AF to acquire a lock and then flick the lens switch to manual. Muscle memory soon catches up. But, utterly useless for tracking. Anyone walking towards you, forget it, utter trash. Instead, S5 on tripod in 4K 60p at f5.6 or 8 with native zoom lens and I’d say with the right custom tracking settings, 100% WILL track 95% of the time. There’s only a handful of times every job when I need that so the above is my go to. But S1R, I’d give it 9/10 as a total package for my kind of hybrid needs which is hi res stills and great video of people chatting, wedding ceremonies, etc and maybe 9.5 if the 5k works out for me like I expect it to. newfoundmass 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newfoundmass Posted June 18, 2022 Share Posted June 18, 2022 Yeah, I'm having trouble even finding solid info on recording limits. The early reviews said it had a 15-minute recording limit in all 4K? Even in 8-bit 4K 30p? Does it let you set it to shutter angle? What about other video focused features? Good luck getting an answer in any videos! But they're going for under $2k used, so it's tempting, especially if I decide to expand on photography. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
projectwoofer Posted June 18, 2022 Share Posted June 18, 2022 36 minutes ago, newfoundmass said: Yeah, I'm having trouble even finding solid info on recording limits. The early reviews said it had a 15-minute recording limit in all 4K? Even in 8-bit 4K 30p? Does it let you set it to shutter angle? What about other video focused features? Good luck getting an answer in any videos! But they're going for under $2k used, so it's tempting, especially if I decide to expand on photography. Never used an S1r but everything you ask is in the manual. For example it states that 4K modes have a 15 minute limit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSMW Posted June 18, 2022 Author Share Posted June 18, 2022 Yes, 15 min limit and yes to shutter angle. Not sure if the manuals have been updated after firmware upgrades, but printed ones obviously not. For stills, IMO it’s a massively overlooked camera. As a hybrid, if everything continues as it has been so far for me, it’s turning out to be a better option than the S5 and the S1H. A couple of months if you asked me to pick one, it would easily have been S1H. Today, I’d pick the S1R if I could only shoot with one. Not that the others are going anywhere as they have a role. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
projectwoofer Posted June 18, 2022 Share Posted June 18, 2022 15 minutes ago, MrSMW said: Yes, 15 min limit and yes to shutter angle. Not sure if the manuals have been updated after firmware upgrades, but printed ones obviously not. https://eww.pavc.panasonic.co.jp/dscoi/DC-S1R/E_/DC-S1R_DVQP1848ZG_full_web_eng.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newfoundmass Posted June 19, 2022 Share Posted June 19, 2022 Eh, 8-bit 4K having a 15 minute record limit definitely is a deal killer for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSMW Posted June 19, 2022 Author Share Posted June 19, 2022 4 hours ago, newfoundmass said: Eh, 8-bit 4K having a 15 minute record limit definitely is a deal killer for me. Could be for many… I have used it for ‘emergency purposes’ a couple of times and found it to be quite decent, but depends on your needs of course. As a pure video tool, you wouldn’t choose this camera. It’s a stills-orientated camera with a video capability. As a hybrid, maybe, for anyone that only shoots short clips, doesn’t shoot log and is happy with 8 bit (which is actually OK most of the time and for most things), but really, it becomes a better hybrid using the 5k 24/24/30p 10 bit 420. I think it’s 422 over HDMI, but IMO, if you were going to rig something up, any of the other S cameras offer better options. So I’d say it is, for hybrid/video purposes, a pretty niche machine but not really for hardcore videastes. newfoundmass 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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