Nikon Z9 / Firmware 2.0 Official Topic

[Chad Andreo]

1 hour ago, JurijTurnsek said:

Well, it makes sense ... no cine line to protect. That EVF resolution seems a bit dated, but PROs will probably value battery life more. Kudos for no including a mechanical shutter!

Hopefully others follow suit. 

[herein2020]

This is the first time I've ever wished I was a Nikon shooter, definitely a fascinating camera, and I like that they went with two CFExpress cards vs the mixture of SD and CFExpress; I'd rather just pay extra for two of the same card vs always having to carry two different readers and backups for two different types of media.

I would imagine this will also do dual slot video recording and possibly have a WFM for video so the only thing it is missing in my book is some sort of XLR audio input adapter solution.  Also, I am guessing there won't be any compressed ProRes options due to the Red patent.

Last but not leas, can ProRes be edited in Davinci Resolve? I know they have limited support for ProRes but I haven't followed too closely exactly what the limitations are.

I will admit, if this were a Canon camera with these features at this price since I have so much EF glass I'd probably order one. Great video options, great photography options, this could be the perfect hybrid camera (if an XLR adapter is possible).

[Andrew Reid]

2 hours ago, Eric Calabros said:

who would have thought the first still camera maker that introduce internal Prores HQ and Prores RAW will be the same company everybody were saying "not serious about video", and not those companies that have been in Cinema camera business for decades.

 

Looks like Apple may have a custom chip, which didn't exist before. Low power, works in a thin chassis. The iPhone 13 Pro and now the Z9, something seems to have happened with ProRes encoders...

[ND64]

Waveform monitor comes with firmware update.

[IronFilm]

10 hours ago, Marcio Kabke Pinheiro said:

My curiosity is who is making this sensor. The readout speeds are insane.

Video rolling shutter rates
8K/30/24~14.3ms
4K/30/24 oversampled (from 8K)~14.3ms
4K/120/60 subsampled~7.8ms

I'd assume/hope you could have a 4K/24 subsampled with 7.8ms? That would be incredible! Better than ARRI in this regard. 

[ND64]

They have licensed the raw technology from a company called intoPIX. Its kinda a surprise, because their new raw technology announced just one month ago!

Here is what they call TICO-RAW:

https://www.intopix.com/tico-raw

 

[ND64]

Ok, I want this RAW, RIGHT NOW!

High Efficiency raw size is LESS than size of high quality Jpeg!

 

[Video Hummus]

5 hours ago, BTM_Pix said:

So they've compensated with a wild spec body to keep them (more than) relevant and give a reason to go with them while the 400 is still not there.

They could steal the show my releasing a better, faster, smaller 400mm f/2.8. 

[IronFilm]

11 hours ago, stephen said:

Hm. I wonder what N-RAW could be. Nikon name for Blackmagic BRAW codec ? As said having in mind Nikon will use the same Exceed 7 processor for all cameras following Z9, we may see a more affordable hybrid camera shooting RAW video internally.

Bring on the Nikon Z90!! (well, the D3/D300... D5/D500.... pattern suggest the pro mirrorless baby would be called "Z900"?? But I suspect a zero will be dropped from the name)
 

 

6 hours ago, Eric Calabros said:

who would have thought the first still camera maker that introduce internal Prores HQ and Prores RAW will be the same company everybody were saying "not serious about video", and not those companies that have been in Cinema camera business for decades.

Nikon has always always being criminally underrated for video. 
Just a few of the highlights from Nikon:
Nikon D90: first ever HDSLR. 
Nikon D5 / D500: first ever (non-cinema) 4K DSLR. 
Nikon Z6: first ever 4K raw external hybrid camera. 

[IronFilm]

4 hours ago, herein2020 said:

I would imagine this will also do dual slot video recording and possibly have a WFM for video so the only thing it is missing in my book is some sort of XLR audio input adapter solution.  

Hope it gets WFM, isn't Panasonic the only folks doing this with their stills cameras??

The Tascam add on could be a good third party audio option until Nikon brings out their own. (if ever)

Although, I'd say just get a Sound Devices MixPre3 instead, a much better all round option. 

4 hours ago, herein2020 said:

I will admit, if this were a Canon camera with these features at this price since I have so much EF glass I'd probably order one. Great video options, great photography options, this could be the perfect hybrid camera

Apparently EF lenses already perform well on Nikon Z bodies with an EF to Z adapter. Wouldn't let having EF lenses ever hold you back from buying a Nikon Z body. 

  

6 hours ago, BTM_Pix said:

I think Sony might have forced their hand to go no holds barred.

The deal that Sony did to supply Associated Press that they have now followed up with the same type with the Press Association must have spooked them a bit.

At the end of the day, as soon as Sony fleshed out their lens lineup to include the 400mm f2.8 then Nikon and Canon had a problem.

Nikon are the ones now playing catchup as it is them that don't have a native 400mm f2.8, which makes deals like the ones with AP and PA off the table for them.

So they've compensated with a wild spec body to keep them (more than) relevant and give a reason to go with them while the 400 is still not there.

 

And they've gone aggressive with the pricing too! 

Nikon Z9 is priced much more sharply than the Sony A1 (thousand dollars cheaper!) or the Canon R3 ($500 cheaper). 

2 hours ago, Eric Calabros said:

Waveform monitor comes with firmware update.

WOW! That's incredible. May it please come speedily to their lower end cameras soon as well. 

 

1 hour ago, Video Hummus said:

They could steal the show my releasing a better, faster, smaller 400mm f/2.8. 

They are indeed doing exactly that:

[herein2020]

54 minutes ago, IronFilm said:

The Tascam add on could be a good third party audio option until Nikon brings out their own. (if ever)

Although, I'd say just get a Sound Devices MixPre3 instead, a much better all round option. 

Apparently EF lenses already perform well on Nikon Z bodies with an EF to Z adapter. Wouldn't let having EF lenses ever hold you back from buying a Nikon Z body. 

 

I want to use the hotshoe to feed the audio directly to the video track but the camera body would need the proper hotshoe support to do that. Canon is doing it with the R3, Panasonic has been doing it for awhile, and I think Sony can do it as well. One less cable to deal with. I have to imagine this Nikon body has some kind of support as well.

I have the MixPre6 but its a PITA IMO in run and gun situations. Its great when it can be properly setup for talking head scenarios.

Even with the adapter, it'd be a hard sell for me to get a Nikon. I'm going to wait and see what the R5c, R5 Mark II, or the S5 Mark II offers; admittedly that could be a long wait. 

 

  

3 hours ago, Eric Calabros said:

Waveform monitor comes with firmware update.

 

Nice..even the red recording box and WFM made it

[cookietub]

5 hours ago, Eric Calabros said:

They have licensed the raw technology from a company called intoPIX. Its kinda a surprise, because their new raw technology announced just one month ago!

Here is what they call TICO-RAW:

https://www.intopix.com/tico-raw

 

How do you know this? Source, please.

[ND64]

57 minutes ago, cookietub said:

How do you know this? Source, please

https://www.nikon-image.com/products/mirrorless/lineup/z_9/features04.html

 

 

[kye]

19 hours ago, gt3rs said:

I used to use PW remotes for my remote camera, now in most cases I just start video recording and select the image after from the video, is much quicker to find the right moment in Resolve that culling many images. The big advantage for me no more miss fires, buffer full and so on. Also the fact that now camera are fully silent is a big plus too in some environment that I place the remote

Good stuff and makes sense.  It's not as fast (exposure time to published time) as the method @BTM_Pix outlined (which I was guessing at) but would definitely work.

19 hours ago, BTM_Pix said:

It is already there on the existing cameras.

You use the lock button to protect the three or four selects from a burst and if you are using the Ethernet or WiFi ports this then automatically instigates the transfer of only those images to the local laptop or down the line to the remote editor if you are using one.

The burst can then be cleared using delete all on the camera and it will delete everything except those that have been locked *

If you are ingesting manually off the card you then use the "only locked images" option on your editor to ingest only those images.

The dedicated Lock button is a big deal for a live editorial workflow (something Sony missed with the A9) and its going to take some getting used to on the Z9 that Nikon have for reason decided to swap its position with the Playback button.

 

* In reality, clearing cards like this is not something that I would do regularly as when working live its easy to miss or underestimate the importance of a seemingly innocuous incident that becomes "the story" later on so it was prudent to leave everything on the card in the event that you might have a piece of it.

Perfect!

I genuinely had no knowledge of these features, but makes complete sense.  I'd imagine that if you were doing time-critical things then the laptop you were sending the images to would be accessible to by on-site or remote editors who can then do final selects, grade the image, maybe write some blurb, and push out to social media.

I'm reminded of an article from some important event (was it the 100m at the Olympics?) that showed how the photo of the winner crossing the finish line was published to social media some incredibly short time after the race had been run. I can't find the article now, but IIRC it was only minutes (or seconds?) from taking the photo for it to be shared on social media.  The article was great as it described the whole process from camera to publication.  I knew from reading that article that they'd be on top of it, as "first to publish" is a big deal sometimes.

We sometimes get pretty irritable because the incumbents don't take video very seriously and aren't very innovative, so it's easy to lose sight of how cutting edge they are for their target customers, which are people like the photographers at the olympics etc.

[androidlad]

10 hours ago, IronFilm said:

I'd assume/hope you could have a 4K/24 subsampled with 7.8ms? That would be incredible! Better than ARRI in this regard. 

Alexa LF is actually 7.4ms so it's technically slightly better than Z9.

Pixel binned 4K 24 to 60P may be added in a future firmware update. Along with other framerates such as 24.00P and 48P.

[Django]

While this camera ticks many boxes, it remains a 6000€ sports hybrid.. just like A1/R3. 

I think it takes a very specific (Nikon) consumer to drop that kind of cash on that type of mirrorless.

It's great news though Nikon have finally made all these breakthroughs, and one can only hope some of it trickles down (ProRes/ProRes RAW/NRAW) to a more affordable all-rounder like a Z6 III. Competition is good for us consumers no matter what system you're on!

[BTM_Pix]

30 minutes ago, kye said:

I genuinely had no knowledge of these features, but makes complete sense.  I'd imagine that if you were doing time-critical things then the laptop you were sending the images to would be accessible to by on-site or remote editors who can then do final selects, grade the image, maybe write some blurb, and push out to social media.

No, its an either/or.

You configure the network connection of the camera to ftp the images either to your own laptop, if you are working solo, or directly the agency's server where the remote editor pulls them down and works on them.

There is usually minimal adjustment of the image (or what there is will be an automated preset on ingest) so the time drain is the embedded captioning for the news desks as you need to identify the players in the shot, their teams, a description of the incident, the name of the event etc.

The use of code replacements that you have prepared prior to the game massively speeds up the process (typing "l11f" for example will produce "Mohamed Salah of Liverpool FC") but its still time consuming to identify the players and accurately complete the rest of the requirements when the game is still going on around you and there is time pressure to get the images out as fast as possible. So this is where remote editors are an absolute boon as you can just instigate the transfer a few candidate images and get on with shooting.

Rights issues would normally preclude pushing images out directly to social media and as I once had the misfortune to caption an image saying that a player "takes a shit at goal" its probably not a bad thing !

53 minutes ago, kye said:

I'm reminded of an article from some important event (was it the 100m at the Olympics?) that showed how the photo of the winner crossing the finish line was published to social media some incredibly short time after the race had been run. I can't find the article now, but IIRC it was only minutes (or seconds?) from taking the photo for it to be shared on social media.  The article was great as it described the whole process from camera to publication.  I knew from reading that article that they'd be on top of it, as "first to publish" is a big deal sometimes.

There are a lot of variables (not least of which is good network infrastructure at the stadium) but getting the image out of the camera to a remote editor and them then taking care of it can produce those sort of turnaround times.

Shooting solo with wireless ftp out of the camera to the laptop then from pressing the shutter to pressing upload of the final processed and captioned image to the agency's ftp server (which then relay distributes it to the news desks) my typical end to end time would be under two minutes for a critical image. 

[androidlad]

Continuous stills shooting duration:

Full res High Efficiency RAW 20fps: 60 seconds.

Full res JPEG 30fps: 7 seconds

11MP (no crop!) JPEG 120fps: 6 seconds

 

Also 4k 120P video records audio!

[kye]

1 hour ago, BTM_Pix said:

No, its an either/or.

You configure the network connection of the camera to ftp the images either to your own laptop, if you are working solo, or directly the agency's server where the remote editor pulls them down and works on them.

There is usually minimal adjustment of the image (or what there is will be an automated preset on ingest) so the time drain is the embedded captioning for the news desks as you need to identify the players in the shot, their teams, a description of the incident, the name of the event etc.

The use of code replacements that you have prepared prior to the game massively speeds up the process (typing "l11f" for example will produce "Mohamed Salah of Liverpool FC") but its still time consuming to identify the players and accurately complete the rest of the requirements when the game is still going on around you and there is time pressure to get the images out as fast as possible. So this is where remote editors are an absolute boon as you can just instigate the transfer a few candidate images and get on with shooting.

Rights issues would normally preclude pushing images out directly to social media and as I once had the misfortune to caption an image saying that a player "takes a shit at goal" its probably not a bad thing !

There are a lot of variables (not least of which is good network infrastructure at the stadium) but getting the image out of the camera to a remote editor and them then taking care of it can produce those sort of turnaround times.

Shooting solo with wireless ftp out of the camera to the laptop then from pressing the shutter to pressing upload of the final processed and captioned image to the agency's ftp server (which then relay distributes it to the news desks) my typical end to end time would be under two minutes for a critical image. 

Two minutes sounds about right, and is truly impressive for an entire end-to-end media production pipeline.

My (vague) memories were that the camera would push images to a nearby computer, which would then automatically sync those images to a remote server.  The remote editors would have an automated process that would download the images from the remote server, then they'd colour (if required - as you say default profiles are useful) and perhaps crop, then either they or a social media person would write some copy, get it reviewed and approved by the social media manager and upload to social media.  I recall that the process was rehearsed and everyone was in-place in preparation to ensure no delays occurred.

I have (also vague) memories of a process where the "remote" editors were actually onsite but in a building somewhere else that had lots of internet connectivity, and would do the work from there.  

Anyway, the pipeline is very well thought-out and there weren't any things that came to mind that could improve things much.  This, of course, is contrary to our experience with video where one look at an iPhone makes most cameras look archaic and like the people making them don't know about modern technology or care about the people that do!

Maybe voice recognition might be a shortcut to tagging images?  It's something you could do intuitively without taking your hands/eyes off the camera.  

Sometimes I wish that I was still taking still images instead of video.  My little GF3 shoots 12MP RAW stills, my 700D has PDAF and Canon colours and the 24MP RAW stills look great.  No choosing between things that no-one wants to give you all of simultaneously!

[gt3rs]

11 hours ago, IronFilm said:

They are indeed doing exactly that:

Canon was one of the first putting a 1.4x TC on the 200-400, I never understood why they did not add it to all new big lens.

Nikon is doing it right it, it is super convenient the embedded TC. So now they have 180-400 F4 and the 400 F2.8 with TC and I'm sure they will do the same with the 500 and 600. It is so logical...