Lenses

[jonpais]

15 hours ago, mercer said:

Resist the temptation, Jon. For the money of the Atlas, you can buy a C200 or EVA1.

I went through a lens buying phase a couple of years ago and now I’m stuck with a hundred lenses lying around I don’t use. Of course, I bought vintage lenses, so I didn’t spend all that much, but some of them are stinkers that are hard sells. 

I don’t know a lot about anamorphics but they seem to be a lifestyle choice that are entirely unnecessary for your street shooting. But then again, it’s your money and time... so do as you please.

I would expand my cameras if I were you. To see comparison videos between your current lenses on an Olympus camera or a BMMCC would be interesting for your YouTube channel. Or pick up another branded mount entirely like Canon or Nikon or Sony.

Shit, get an Ursa Mini Pro and shoot some Raw or ProRes.

I don’t know if you have monetized your YouTube channel but you have enough equipment and reviews that an expansion of cameras or systems may make more sense than effing around with expensive anamorphics that most of your audience can never afford. 

Just my opinion. 

Sorry, but the ability to shoot HLG high dynamic range video and internal 10-bit, combined with outstanding in body stabilization and focus peaking (critical for shooting 4K in flat profiles), all topped off with a small sensor that is ideal for anamorphic shooting, along with anamorphic desqueeze,  4K 60p, ETC mode (which effectively doubles the focal length of any lens) and full HDMI out make purchasing a Canon, Nikon, Sony , Olympus or BMPCC seem like a huge step backward. And even though I agree that it’s possible to get something like Panasonic’s wonderful EVA 1 for the cost of one Atlas Orion 65mm T2, for example, the combined cost  together with a GH5 is still one third the price of a new anamorphic cine lens! 

To sum up:

Advantages of purchasing the Orion: one-stop solution, impeccable build and image quality

Disadvantages: supremely heavy; I will have to sell one of my kidneys

[Cinegain]

Yeah, I have the impression you enjoy the freedom of just shooting whatever YOU like and how you like to shoot it as well. That you're so kind to go 'well, I might as well share my experiences with others' is just a superb bonus for us folks. To start to cater for others in order to grow your channel would kinda be like betraying your own believes and interests, so I'd say: just stay true to yourself, then you'll enjoy it the most.

[Julien416]

@jonpaisBuying one single atlas Orion optics for recreationnal use sounds like pure folly if you're wisely counting your bucks honestly. What we tried to demonstrate on the atlas thread is that you can achieve a very similar look easily for a fraction of that price (and that weight)... The recipe is already known. 

A taking lens, probably a sharp one as you tend to favor clean look, a cinelux ES (or isco ultra star), and a rectilux (HCDNA) is the recipe you're looking for. An example of what you can shoot with it 

 

It really seems infinitely wiser to go this route when you're an enthusiast shooter IMO.

[mercer]

6 hours ago, jonpais said:

Sorry, but the ability to shoot HLG high dynamic range video and internal 10-bit, combined with outstanding in body stabilization and focus peaking (critical for shooting 4K in flat profiles), all topped off with a small sensor that is ideal for anamorphic shooting, along with anamorphic desqueeze,  4K 60p, ETC mode (which effectively doubles the focal length of any lens) and full HDMI out make purchasing a Canon, Nikon, Sony , Olympus or BMPCC seem like a huge step backward. And even though I agree that it’s possible to get something like Panasonic’s wonderful EVA 1 for the cost of one Atlas Orion 65mm T2, for example, the combined cost  together with a GH5 is still one third the price of a new anamorphic cine lens! 

To sum up:

Advantages of purchasing the Orion: one-stop solution, impeccable build and image quality

Disadvantages: supremely heavy; I will have to sell one of my kidneys

Yes, the GH5 is an amazing camera, but it’s still a consumer/prosumer camera in the cinema world, no matter the quality or features and to marry a $7500 lens to it seems a bit backwards, especially when you can get some used Super Speeds for a grand.

And for every shooter that loves their GH5, I can find one that loves their a6500, or D750, or 5D4, or C100, or E-M1ii.

With that said I actually like the anamorphic look a lot but they’ve always seemed more work than I want to get involved in. The single focus options are interesting. I’ve seen some great stuff with the SLR Magic and the Panasonic and for the GH5, they may make more sense? JMO.

And the only reason I mentioned the other cameras was because you said you were interested in shooting Raw.

Either way, I always enjoy the look of your videos. Just curious what you could do with other systems. For instance, your B&W Fuji Video is my personal favorite of your work. So as subjective as that is, your best work isn’t with the GH5 king.

[kidzrevil]

A camera is only as good as the operator ?

 

[jonpais]

9 hours ago, mercer said:

Yes, the GH5 is an amazing camera, but it’s still a consumer/prosumer camera in the cinema world, no matter the quality or features and to marry a $7500 lens to it seems a bit backwards, especially when you can get some used Super Speeds for a grand.

And for every shooter that loves their GH5, I can find one that loves their a6500, or D750, or 5D4, or C100, or E-M1ii.

Either way, I always enjoy the look of your videos. Just curious what you could do with other systems. 

Thanks, Glenn, I appreciate your input!

Online, I see professionals pairing up the GH5 with pricey cinema lenses all the time. Same goes for Sony mirrorless. Not sure whether they're renting or buying, but heh... 

You've got to admit that your statement, for every shooter that loves their GH5, I can find one that loves their _____ [fill in the blank], is not the quite the same as presenting solid reasons why someone prefers one camera over another.

For sure, I'd like to play with RAW someday, but none of the cameras you mention have all  the features that I so like about the GH5: HLG, ETC. IBIS, 10-bit internal, full HDMI, Anamorphic de-squeeze, 4K 60p, etc. 

As far as color goes, I think @ntblowz demonstrates in another thread that if you white balance correctly and are good in DaVinci, Premiere Pro or what have you, you can get adequate results. =) And he was shooting RAW with the Canon C500.

 

But rather than changing the topic to different camera systems, let's talk about lens choices. =)

I don't think the Super Speeds are anamorphic, are they? Because I'm after the anamorphic look. For sure, I'll check out the lenses recommended by @Julien416, for one, because I'm still on the fence about the weight and cost of the Atlas, and I'm not sure I'll even be able to get it anyhow because of the ridiculous duties here in Vietnam. Even ordering vintage lenses online is going to be a tremendous hassle. Fly to Hong Kong or Singapore?  Absolutely more doable.

But whether I decide to get the Rectilux and some vintage lenses with swirly bokeh or go with the more modern anamorphic look of the Atlas, I still believe that delivering 4K (or 6K!) anamorphic HDR will rock.

[jonpais]

I should add that, just like the Sigma ART lenses in my collection, as well as the Veydras (which, you may recall, are compatible not only with MFT, but can also be used with Fuji X-mount, C mount and Sony E mount), the Atlas anamorphics will be compatible with any camera I decide to purchase in the future, be it Canon, Kinefinity, BMD, or whatever. Thinking only in terms of your present camera is shortsighted, as many filmmakers eventually upgrade from crop sensor to S35 or even full frame. As far as the various diabolical formulas that would limit the price of lenses to one-third that of the camera body, a set of G Master zooms can easily surpass the going rate for a used Sony a7s severalfold. Another thing to keep in mind is that the GH5 sensor can out-resolve most lenses on the market today, and if I were filthy rich (instead of just wealthy ?), I wouldn’t hesitate to buy a full set of Cookes or Compact Primes. But I’m not looking to replace my entire kit, I just want to be able to mix some anamorphic in with my spherical stuff. And if @Jordan Drake hasn’t already bought the very last Isco over at eBay, maybe I can find a less crushing alternative.

[PannySVHS]

@jonpais,well Jon, I agree, you got an awesome camera at your hands with the GH5. But I must say, the awesomest footage I´ve seen from you and pretty awesome in its own right is that one bw vignette of streetlife you shot withy our Fuji and the Zhinxx???:) crane. Awesome feel for the subjet(s) and action and place and point in time. And, awesome black and white look.

Would love to see some vignettes of streetlife with the Laowa and your GH5. Maybe also give it one of the pretty nice Lumix BW modes a try.

[jonpais]

Thanks, @PannySVHS There’s a reason I haven’t dusted off my G85 and X-T2 and put them on craigslist - the GH5 hasn’t suddenly made them obsolete. And if I were to do another vignette of streetlife (I like that!), I’d most likely shoot it with the Laowa on the G85 and Zhiyun. Which brings us back to why we choose one piece of gear over another, and for me anyways, ergonomics, ecosystem, battery life, UI, workflow and so on, are every bit as important as image quality. 

[PannySVHS]

But still Jon, your Fuji has some real mojo. Okay, I´ll stop bugging you now. Good night, too much of long night grading sessions  for me.

[Aussie Ash]

On 11/20/2017 at 3:54 AM, mercer said:

I went through a lens buying phase a couple of years ago and now I’m stuck with a hundred lenses lying around I don’t use.

Mercer -and I thought twenty was a lot !!

[jonpais]

5 hours ago, PannySVHS said:

But still Jon, your Fuji has some real mojo. Okay, I´ll stop bugging you now. Good night, too much of long night grading sessions  for me.

I still can’t help but wonder how the Fuji clip might have looked had I been shooting anamorphic.

[jonpais]

A shop here is going to hunt down a Kowa 8z and Helios 44-2 for me. I can play around with that first, see if I like it, before asking John Barlow if he can make a Hardcore DNA for me.

[mercer]

6 hours ago, Aussie Ash said:

Mercer -and I thought twenty was a lot !!

I’m exaggerating a little... but not by much... sadly. Good news is, it’s a blast trying to sell a bunch of lenses nobody wants. 

[kidzrevil]

Fuji camera color rendering sounds promising to me. It looks like the closest thing to film on digital bodies

[PannySVHS]

4 hours ago, mercer said:

I’m exaggerating a little... but not by much... sadly. Good news is, it’s a blast trying to sell a bunch of lenses nobody wants. 

You have the Soligor 35-70 2.8-3.5 in your arsenal? If so, would you give it a run on your beautiful Canon RAW beauty? What are your lenses not many seem to want? I read the Canon 28mm F2.0 is a real stinker to be sold for around 50 dollars! You wanna sell that one?

 

1 hour ago, kidzrevil said:

Fuji camera color rendering sounds promising to me. It looks like the closest thing to film on digital bodies

Kidz, how can color rendering sound like anything?:) Just, teasin. You should give it a try. But please don´t give up that beautiful Panni. Not sayin Panny due to some amount of weirdness going along with that.

 

7 hours ago, jonpais said:

I still can’t help but wonder how the Fuji clip might have looked had I been shooting anamorphic.

If that is a good reason to see you shoot more with the Fuji, yeah, wanna see that too. But don´t pay a fortune for these lense you have been praising so much for the last couple posts. I think the Veydras are expensive enough. Though a super bargain, of course

[mercer]

11 minutes ago, PannySVHS said:

4 hours ago, mercer said:

 

You have the Soligor 35-70 2.8-3.5 in your arsenal? If so, would you give it a run on your beautiful Canon RAW beauty?

No, I don’t have that one. I did have the Soligor 21mm a while back. They had a few really good lenses. 

I want to build three decent sets of lenses and I think I’ve narrowed it down to a set of Canon EF lenses for obvious reasons. The L glass is amazing... modern but with neutral character. I am also building an ai-s set of Nikkors. Right now I have the 35mm 1.4 and I am searching for an 85mm 1.4. I actually have a bunch of non-ai lenses but I want to sell and replace with the best ai-s versions I can find. And finally I am building a set of Super Multi Coated Takumars for that vintage look and b&w. I’ll keep a few random cool lenses, but 90% of them need to go. 

[webrunner5]

Well this opens up a few more options for the GH5.

http://www.newsshooter.com/2017/11/20/mtf-pl-to-m43-adaptor/

[PannySVHS]

Okay, three lenses in the mix and a rented GH5 in 8bit 100mbps natural profile. FD 28 and 100, both stellar lenses, and a fun slr magic 12mm. all lenses shot at f4 and 800iso. Trailer is for my shortfilm I shot end of august. Trailer is for the soundguy, so he gets a feel before rough cut is finished.. I really like the cam and the FDs on a focalreducer. I think with a 28 and a 100 on a focal reducer you are set. Might put up a PW. It will be boxcar.

 

[PannySVHS]

3 hours ago, mercer said:

No, I don’t have that one. I did have the Soligor 21mm a while back. They had a few really good lenses. 

 

Soligor 21mm, sounds interesting. A lens retailer told me the 28 f2 is supposed to be nice too, one of the good f2.0 lenses in that focal length. I have been a bit disappointed by my sample of Olympus Zuiko so my search for the nice bargain price 28 f2 is still goin strong. I think I will settle for the Canon FD version some time.