Any C100 users around?

[jgharding]

Now I know it's not a popular camera body  for many valid reasons, and that it may be away from the budget of many casual film-makers, but I've been using the C100 a lot recently, and wondered if anyone had any tips to swap.

 

I've also been programming some custom picture styles for this and C300 based on highly gradable modern film stocks.

 

If anyone is interested in such a discussion let's get stuck in!

 

Let me know how you use it and find it...

[nigelbb]

You have that wrong. The C100 is an incredibly popular camera used by thousands of working professionals. Admittedly it's not so popular with the cheapskate amateurs on this forum but that's only because they cannot afford one :lol:

[jgharding]

I did mean "not popular here" as opposed to the wider world, since I am asking here, that is the important thing. In short, I was being polite! It's pretty rare online though...

 

So do you use it, what are your experiences?

[QuickHitRecord]

I use one at work and it makes my life a lot easier. The NDs and waveform are wonderful. The amount of detail in the images is very pleasing. It's a workhorse, and that's why I chose it for us.

[Guest Ebrahim Saadawi]

Nigel: that's impolite.

Anyway, I used the Canon C100 & C300 over the past year extensively. And here are a few thought I believe worth mentioning,

1-These cameras are the best example for not judging a camera only by the spec sheet on a piece of paper.

Meaning While these cameras, spec-wise, are significantly inferior on paper than practically every other camera on the market, they managed to be the most successful line of cameras in the professional broadcast and news industry and wedding, documentary fields.

On paper, the C100 is an 8 bit, 4:2:0, AVCHD 24mbits camcorder. It does not even have a 720p 60p mode.

These specs on paper are identical to say a T2i, in fact, the t2i has more, it does 60p. That's why I will never judge a produst until I use it and see what it is. Otherwise I will think a T2i is better than a C100.

But the truth is much more than just specs. The truth is that these 8 bit, 4:2:0 AVCHD images are one of the highest quality images ever produced by an HD camera. They are clean at 20.000 ISO, have wide DR, tack-sharp detail, zero aliasing and moire, fast rolling shutter and wonderful colors. There is not a single flaw to the images coming out of these cameras. Not to my eyes anyway. Even banding in that 8 bit codec is extremely well handled, and all that in a highly compressed tiny-sized file, how they do it I don't know!

Combine a great image with great ergonomics, as in built in NDs, waveforms, Viewfinder, zebras, peaking, XLR inputs, Timecode, excellent button layout, weight and size, and an intuitive, easy to use menu UI, ENORMOUS battery life,

And suddenly you have one of the most attractive cameras on the market. They are a joy to use, and plus, deliver brilliant images. That balance between both image quality and practicality is what makes the Eos Cinema Line successful as it is.

Many companies for example got the Image quality part covered (BM), and others got the practicality part covered (small sensor professional camcorders),
but only VERY few got both parts covered, and the C100/300 line is one of them.

Again that's exactly why they're successful, and why they sell even when being a bit overpriced. They are practical camcorders that deliver the goods. Make money. Period.

What I find an absolute disgrace to the Cinema-line is the 1DC, it's a great camera yes, but at 10 thousand US dollars? That's not a bit overpriced, that probably the most overpriced camera made in the past couple of years. It's a DSLR with no video-camera DNA. None! That's another subject though.

_______________________

The reason they're not popular among low-budget filmmakers is that overpriced bit, plus the weak spec-sheet. Especially when that market is highly driven by specs and not by actual usage of equipment, they simply don't have access for actual usage.

Thus it's a bit hard convincing someone who never used it, to pay 5K for an 8 bit 4:2:0 AVCHD camera when he can pay 1K for a 12bit raw shooting camera, or 2K for a 4K raw shooting camera, or etc...

_________________

In terms of picture controls, I always use Wide DR for most shots, and Canon Log for specific shots that require the flattest image, at the expense of some tonal range loss and midtone banding. I am not a tweaker by nature and tend to use the factory defaults anyway. They're great on the C100!

[Guest]

Anyway, I used the Canon C100 & C300 over the past year extensively. And here are a few thought I believe worth mentioning,

Nice post Ebrahim. I'm going to be very interested in what you think of the A7S if you get one.

[jgharding]

Nigel: that's impolite.

Anyway, I used the Canon C100 & C300 over the past year extensively. And here are a few thought I believe worth mentioning,

1-These cameras are the best example for not judging a camera only by the spec sheet on a piece of paper.

 

I agree with everything in that post, after a few weeks of use. I've C300 incessantly over the last few years for work, I find the C100 even more enjoyable!

 

The specs don't look like much, but the final image is amazing, especially the colour.

 

The film styles I'm programming are all based around Wide-DR as it is the best balance, Log is just too much most of the time unless the situation is extreme.

 

I'll post some progress shots and examples for grading as I have the profiles tweaked. I need to research the matrix (LOL) a little more.

[jgharding]

I do want to try the GH4 though.

 

I'm sure it won't match the C100 for low light or dynamic range, probably not on colour, but I wonder if the 4K for 1080p in post will beat the C100s internal 4K to 1080p? We know unfortunately that the GH4s internal 4K to 1080 is not perfect, but controlling it in post should be good.

 

C100 plus Ninja is pretty formidable...

 

GH4 does have the edge of frame rates too.

 

Anyway, I digress.

 

Does anyone else use any other Custom picture styles?

 

I've been experimenting with the AbelCine ones as well as my own programming

 

http://blog.abelcine.com/2013/07/25/canon-c100-scene-files-from-abelcine/

[Zach Ashcraft]

I just received a C100 about 2 weeks ago and am loving it so far.

I've been shooting a personal documentary on a local coffeehouse to get more time with the camera before my next run of weddings and real estate videos.

So far I've been sticking with the stock picture profile and have used the Wide DR in cases where the highlights get a little out of hand. Unbelievable amounts of detail and just an ove great feel to the image.

The amount of tweakability in the picture profiles is ridiculous, and I know I've barely scratched the service. I'm really going to dive into this this week

[Guest]

I agree with everything in that post, after a few weeks of use. I've C300 incessantly over the last few years for work, I find the C100 even more enjoyable!

 

How do you find the C100 EVF + LCD after using the C300 a lot? It has a bad rep on that side of things. Z-Finder?

 

The Ninja Star is going to pair well with the C100 I imagine ...

[dafreaking]

How do you find the C100 EVF + LCD after using the C300 a lot? It has a bad rep on that side of things. Z-Finder?

 

The Ninja Star is going to pair well with the C100 I imagine ...

 

If you are willing to pony up for those CFast cards then fo sho!

[Damphousse]

You have that wrong. The C100 is an incredibly popular camera used by thousands of working professionals. Admittedly it's not so popular with the cheapskate amateurs on this forum but that's only because they cannot afford one :lol:

 

 

I think you mean financially prudent amateurs.  Do you think it would be intelligent for someone who only shoots travel videos a couple of times a year and the odd birthday or sports game to drop $5K on a C100 body only?  The thing is going to be obsolete and lose thousands of dollars before the owner makes 10 solid edited movies.  Something like the GH4 makes sense.  Even in the worst case scenario you would lose maybe $1K in depreciation if you kept the thing for years.

 

A pro with paying jobs that demand quality, reliability and fast turn around is not irresponsible for getting a $5K C100.  Just like an amateur who doesn't have paying jobs lined up isn't a cheapskate for getting something less expensive.

[Guest d5f8611fa423d0e628c016f9d5c93b47]

If you are willing to pony up for those CFast cards then fo sho!

Oh yeah. Forgot about that. But they should drop in price soon apparently ...

[jgharding]

I think you mean financially prudent amateurs.  Do you think it would be intelligent for someone who only shoots travel videos a couple of times a year and the odd birthday or sports game to drop $5K on a C100 body only?  The thing is going to be obsolete and lose thousands of dollars before the owner makes 10 solid edited movies.  Something like the GH4 makes sense.  Even in the worst case scenario you would lose maybe $1K in depreciation if you kept the thing for years.

 

A pro with paying jobs that demand quality, reliability and fast turn around is not irresponsible for getting a $5K C100.  Just like an amateur who doesn't have paying jobs lined up isn't a cheapskate for getting something less expensive.

 

Indeed, it's horses for courses, but always seems to cause a lot of fights for some reason. I think we should all get along!

 

The other day I was assisting a Phantom Flex, then I was on a 600D, I'm always using different bodies. Some may just buy one body and not use anything else. I don't think there should be so much fighting over camera bodies. discussion yes, but not fighting.

 

I'm still refining picture styles daily, it's definitely fun but you can get lost in it! Still, I think practice will make perfect.

[jgharding]

Here's a test grading using Wide-DR stock profile,

 

password is test

 

it's remarkable how the secondaries come out. I secondaried the skin, and considering the compression it was jolly clean

 

It must be due to beyering at 4k not 1080p

 

[mdebono]

Looks nice! 

 

I love WideDR when shooting solo. I've used it for a documentary & for a TVC (latter recorded externally to a Ninja, which works perfectly with the C100 combined with the triggering) and was super easy to get a good looking image out of it.

 

I'm still trying to optimize my wedding workflow though since I have another shooter with a 6D. I've been using Neutral Flat on the 6D and a modified version of EOS Neutral (found online) to match them. Does anyone have any tips for matching DSLRs with the C100? Would love to use the WideDR profile, however not sure which picture style would come closest for DSLRs.

[jgharding]

Perhaps try using technicolor cinestyle on the 6D, and match the C100 to that?

[mdebono]

Not really a fan of cinestyle. I think it involves too much hassle to get good-looking footage and the tests I've done a while back did seem to increase a bit of noise.

 

I still need to try out Flaat and Canon's own Camera X-Series Look. 

[jgharding]

It's a fair point, I switched to VisionColor because CineStyle was too flat for the camera to handle really...

[mdebono]

It's a fair point, I switched to VisionColor because CineStyle was too flat for the camera to handle really...

 

That sounds like another good alternative. Have you tried mixing footage (in VisionColor) with WideDR by any chance?