Vimeo to automatically mute videos with 'unlicensed' soundtracks

[Andrew Reid]

Have you seen this?

 

vimeo.com/blog/post:626

 

Essentially Copyright Match works like on YouTube where commercial music is matched to a database and flagged automatically. On YouTube the video is not removed, instead a link to buy the music or advertising is added under the player.

 

On Vimeo the match results in the user being marched off to an 'appeals process' where he must prove he has the valid license for the sound track in use, or that the video consitites 'fair use'. There are no hard and fast rules for what constitutes fair use.

 

Personally as an artist who likes to mix my cinematography with the best possible music, I see this as severely limiting my artistic freedom. I also see my personal work on Vimeo as purely artistic and not in any way 'for profit'. They are part of EOSHD's editorial but a completely separate entity to any part of the blog which makes money such as the Shooter's Guides and I don't run any advertising.

 

This decision by Vimeo means I will seriously have to consider removing 90% of my artistic work from Vimeo and placing it only on my local hard drive offline.

 

Copyright issues on the internet are universally dealt with by DMCA takedown notices and where money is involved, for example where someone is blatantly making money off the back of somebody's else's music in their commercial wedding videos, the issues is dealt with through the legal system.

 

I don't see why Vimeo need to get involved at all.

 

I also don't like how a company seemingly has the final say in what artistic expression I am allowed to make.

 

Also for those who use The Music Bed, the problem doesn't go away. Vimeo will still Copyright Match tracks on there. All music, at the end of the day, is copyright material. So everyone whether they have a license or not will have to go through the appeals process and risk the appeals people at Vimeo disagreeing.

 

Say goodbye to your Vimeo portfolio? Personally I am seriously considering moving out to YouTube or an alternative site. I didn't sign up to this shit!

[JHines]

Another service will pop up and everyone will migrate there. Copyright law is flawed in the internet age and it's going to be a while before it straightens itself out. Vimeo must of been pressured by the big wigs to tighten up. Sad day for Vimeo. 

[Andrew Reid]

Another service will pop up and everyone will migrate there. Copyright law is flawed in the internet age and it's going to be a while before it straightens itself out. Vimeo must of been pressured by the big wigs to tighten up. Sad day for Vimeo. 

 

Yes, I feel bad for them actually. YouTube have a pretty good system for dealing with this. Vimeo don't seem to. And the quality of music in their library for dubbing over videos is extremely poor overall.

[Zach Ashcraft]

As a musician turned video guy I'm not at all opposed to this. I hope that this encourages cinematographers/film makers to go find local musicians and work with them. I sincerely hope that it does! I started shooting a personal documentary on a local coffeehouse about a month ago, and two local musicians were practically begging to help score it. There are tons of musicians out there, just as there are videographers. Much like the video industry, it is now easier than ever to create music at home on a limited budget. 

 

Of course having the ability to write my own music makes this a non-issue for me, so I do understand why it is frustrating to so many. The way I see it though, the opportunity for more collaboration should only lead to better creative potential! 

[Andrew Reid]

Collaboration with up and coming talents, local musicians, I am all for it, I do it. Right now I am collaborating with two bands and a singer.

 

The subject at hand here is rather different.

 

Should those collaborators have tracks in the Deep Dark Database that Vimeo is using for their Copyright Match system, your Vimeo upload will be at the mercy of their appeals process and the onus will be on you to prove that you have permission to use the track... not always easy, and an extra bureaucratic headache one really should not have to deal with in all fairness.

 

There's so many more bad things about this development...

 

- It severely limits freedom of artistic expression on non-commercial personal or experimental work

- It harms music sales because tracks will get less airplay and a smaller audience. I hear music first on Vimeo or YouTube then I go off to buy it on iTunes so I can play it on my iPhone. I don't walk around with a playlist of videos on Vimeo playing on my phone. Vimeo is not an iTunes rival so having commercial tracks on there doesn't compete with the music industry.

- It is impractical to get a license or permission for most music, especially the best cinematic stuff (Radiohead, Pink Floyd, for example)

- It is cost prohibitive to get a license in many cases

 

Really if I could pay something, easily and quickly to a major record label for artistic fair use of a track, I would, but there's absolutely no way of doing so. They are missing out on a huge business opportunity here.

 

By all means for wedding videographers who just got paid $20k for a video and they are ripping off a band by using copyright music in that commercial project without permission, these people should pay for a license.

 

For fair use, artistic stuff, with no commercial earnings behind the video, this stuff is all so very wrong.

 

All the best music is copyrighted material and it is virtually impractical to get the proper permissions to use, say, Pink Floyd, whilst fair use has no hard and fast rules and leaves you at the mercy of a judge. Copyright law needs reform big time.

 

As for Music Bed... Not satisfied with the vast majority of stuff in their library. It's too bland and boring on the whole. Very hard to find something that really inspires.

[Nikkor]

How long does copyright hold for interpretations?

[Andrew Reid]

This appears to be the source of the trouble. Sad for Vimeo. Let's hope they can work their way out of this and that their users are not also impacted.

 

http://www.theverge.com/2013/9/20/4752576/record-labels-win-right-to-take-vimeo-to-court-in-lip-synching-lawsuit

 

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/thr-esq/record-companies-lawsuit-vimeo-heads-668334

[sunyata]

A problem I've had with youtube is that they have flagged music that I know is not in their database.. music I have personally recorded and that has never been recorded before in studio or live. I have no idea how to get it unflagged, I'm sure it's a slow and laborious process, so I just let it go.

 

If it's a legitimate violation I have no problem not posting. 

 

But I think these algos are taking over personally and it's bigger than just music on the internet.. From drone strikes, to front running stocks, to wire taps, or my credit card getting cancelled because I decide to buy diapers for a baby I don't have.. it's getting ridiculous. Maybe I want to make a giant diaper wall... screw you algo.

[Zach Ashcraft]

Legitimate question to you Andrew, not trolling here. Would you be okay with me downloading footage that you have shot and re-editing it or repurposing it somehow for my own creative use without permission? Uploaded to vimeo for as a personal or experimental project

[Richard Wait]

Thats cruddy...

 

Have a look at www.mobygratis.com if you like his music for your videos. Credit to him for letting us use his stuff.

 

Looks like its back to Youtube  - what is the score with them now?

So I add a famous audio track to my video - what happens? An automatic link below to the track? My video is taken down?
And what about Ads? A lot of videos I see now, have overlaid ads - is this a choice you can make?

 

@Zach, I think anything you make/distribute/make available for free is fair game for nonprofit use, as long a credit is mentioned. Not sure anyone would want to use my videos - they are pretty bad! 

[varicam]

YouTube's content matching algorithm is so good that it flags anything that remotely resembles what is on their database. Like others, I have had 300-year old classical pieces that I recorded on site being flagged for copyright violation.   I even have had something I created 100% originally flagged!!!

 

I was hoping switching to Vimeo would solve this nonsense.   Looks like it won't. 

 

YouTube offers the big guys different options. Some might let you keep your audio and put ads or links to the CD. Others might mute your audio. Yet some others would suspend your video and give your account a strike unless an appeal is successful. If your account gets three strikes, it is suspended.

[Christina Ava]

this is sad, and if that rule was applied 99.8 of the content uploaded in vimeo would have to be taken down.

surely they are being faced with lawsuits, and huge pressure from known vampiric record labels.

 

yes i dont mind, and people have used my work in their projects!

 

excuse me if i cant get adele to sign a lease for the 30 seconds i used in a wedding video of a couple dancing....

where do we go from here, does anyone know any other service similar to vimeo? i expect a russian equivalent...

i will have to use classical pieces now, and obscure songs, or worse local greek song or do i have to find a lease from mozart...

utter b%&^#it

 

secondly do you know how this scanning will work? i mean will it scan like the 30 first seconds of the video? there has to be a workaround from this..

 

http://www.reelseo.com/list-video-sharing-websites/

[varicam]

Classical music is not safe.   The record companies hold copyright to the sound recordings.

[pablogrollan]

I personally don't see a problem with keeping an eye on copyright violations as long as they do it right. Bots are not capable of subtleties and personal attention from Vimeo will be a must. If your video gets flagged but you are given a fair chance to let them know the content is yours or fully licensed or for personal use -which would be questionable, since it is for everyone to see-, then it's OK.

 

Youtube has so many users that it is impossible to look at every claim individually. A bot does the work and the innocent get caught in the process with the guilty. It is a great chance for Vimeo to differentiate itself from its competitors, offering a more personalized and exclusive service, which is what they claim all along and the reason they charge a premium.

[wolf33d]

Legitimate question to you Andrew, not trolling here. Would you be okay with me downloading footage that you have shot and re-editing it or repurposing it somehow for my own creative use without permission? Uploaded to vimeo for as a personal or experimental project

 

You guy did not understand at all. I 100% agree with Andrew, and this is a disaster. 

Now let me tell you why : 

 

1 - your exemple and comparison is wrong. Because in one case you use audio format (a music) to use it on a different industry : make a personnal video. So it is not copying the music to do the same music, but something else. SO you can't compare with video saying that it would be the same for exemple to copy my video and using it in another video (because you stay on the same support, same industry : video). 

 

2 - Come on man ? If you think 2 seconds about it : first of all I buy the music that I put in my video so the artist should be happy I bought it, secondly puting it in my video is an advertisement for him (see under videos how many comments what is this song blablabla) so it benefits DOUBLE for the artist. If tomorrow you copy my video and use it as a rush in your video, it doesn't give me money (cause you did not pay my video) and it does not make any add for me because people will think this is 100% your video. 

 

The rule should be to pay the track, and give credit to artist in the description, that's all. But when I say pay the track I mean pay the normal one, and not 10 000 USD to have to rights on it. I mean, if you do a commercial and make profit with your video it is normal that you have to pay more, but for creative work, is that not enough to pay the song and credit the artist ? Come on.....

 

The digital world is becoming less and less free, just like the real world. FUCK Vimeo if they do that seriously.

[Christina Ava]

obviously you dont get the meaning of licencing... its not paying for the song, but obtaining a lease for songs to be used in non commercial or commercial work, 

this means that you cant use any POPULAR songs even in your kids birthday party video! since the bot will scan that you used old macdonald had a farm, or be asked to pay ridiculus money because believe me big bands will not licence any music to you..

 

this is wrong on 100 levels and it will kill vimeo if put in effect. if you check the options in vimeo music store, that are limited to 6.000 songs they ask 100 dollars for a lease on unknown music to indie/small biz, if i want to use 3 soundbites i will have to pay 300 dollars? how much will they ask for known songs that are handled by vultures like universal?

 

no way.

[sunyata]

Just read their definition of fair use.. I started using Vimeo recently and I think one of my uploads that uses a known 70's disco track would be okay because the video is just an "educational purposes only" quality test.. the other though is a Video that highlights my favorite shots in Bernardo Bertolucci's "The Conformist".. They're just short edits, but probably not kosher. This might be only going forward though, I think the flag only happens when you upload.

 

Should I take it down?? I'm going to live on the edge and let it stay. 

 

http://vimeo.com/93735999

[andy lee]

this is a good thing as the music industry has been decimated in the past 10 years by internet free downloading.

(I have personal experiance of this , budgets have been hugely slashed by record labels as everyone is downloading for free)

If you use copyright material you should pay for it and have permission. nuff said.

This has happened on Vimeo as the Music Industry is finally reacting and trying to get its house in order 10 years too late.

Too many people think the internt is a free for all.

[varicam]

Even if you are using music with proper licensing or under fair use, there are still many vultures that will be happy to speak with your lawyer once the music is matched.  If you cannot afford one to fight, your video is gone.

 

Maybe it is time to support only artists who release some of their works under a Creative Commons licence.

[andy lee]

Legitimate question to you Andrew, not trolling here. Would you be okay with me downloading footage that you have shot and re-editing it or repurposing it somehow for my own creative use without permission? Uploaded to vimeo for as a personal or experimental project

exactly !