How to cure banding in DSLR footage (and GH4 4K holds the key...)

[Andrew Reid]

The EOSHD Panasonic GH4 Shooter’s Guide is now available

8bit DSLR codecs get quite a lot of bashing for banding, and it is something we're well used too... A sky or a wall taking up half the shot with only 4 or 5 shades where there should be a silky smooth gradient with thousands of tiny steps in-between darker and slightly lighter areas of the image.

However one of the first things I noticed with the Panasonic GH4 was that banding was greatly reduced and it looked like my 10bit Blackmagic footage, even though it was still an 8bit codec (internally with 4K). Why such a turn-around for an 8bit codec? It turns out the 4K mode on the GH4 holds the key to hiding this banding... yet it is something we can apply to all DSLRS...

Here's how...

 

Read the full article here

[amanieux]

if you have 10bit per channel to convert to 8bit per channel, noise dithering is not the best algorithm, diffusion dithering is better the typical algorithm is Floyd–Steinberg - look at the difference with the noise or "random" algorithm it is day and night :  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dither

 vs 

[douglaurent]

so basically this might be the reason why banding disappears on the 1DC only if ISO is set to a value higher than 400, as they need that ISO gain to add the noise to avoid that banding?

[theSUBVERSIVE]

Just for fun, let's speculate.

 

But for what it was said - I may be wrong but that's why it's speculation - the clues seem very straight forward and they lead us to believe that soon enough there will be a Micro4/3 Metabones Speed Booster with electronic connectors for Canon's glass.

 

Super35-like image, OIS, electronic controls AND 1-stop more of light on a GH4/BMPCC.

 

Pretty nice indeed and this way the 5-axis IBIS will not be missed that much.

[Axel]

 

 

Recently in a few EOSHD forum posts I teased an upcoming announcement the day before it was due (June 3rd) for an unspecified product related to the Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera and Panasonic GH4. This announcement date has now changed and out of respect for the company I cannot reveal why or any details about what the product is. However I want to make something absolutely clear amidst the silence. This is a product that IS coming out, it has been slightly delayed NOT cancelled and it IS worth the wait…I am still involved in testing it and once all the bugs are ironed out, we will soon have something very exciting in our hands…

 

Looking forward.

[pablogrollan]

Dithering to hide 8bit shortcomings is not exactly new... In fact, if I recall correctly, many programs from 3D renderers to video encoders used to have -many still do- an option for "8bit dithering" so that you didn't have to manually compose it.

[AaronChicago]

What does it look like after an H.264 render for online? I love adding a little bit of grain but usually Vimeo or YouTube encoders have a hard time with it.

[Glenn Thomas]

Yeah, I've been doing this for years. Probably as far back as 2006 for videos I was using a program called Photozoom to upres DV videos to 1080P. It works. Although I normally don't need to do it. Editing 32bit in Sony Vegas usually takes care of any banding. Otherwise I use Neat Video noise reduction followed by either film grain or the Add Noise plugin in Sony Vegas set to 0.025.

A chroma blur plugin can sometimes help too.

I also noticed the mention of Premiere CC in this article. I installed that last night for some videos I have to edit with a client's CC license. OMG, Premiere has to be the most frustratingly awkward, fiddly and annoying software out there! Having struggled with it nearly all day today, I honestly don't understand how anyone would have the patience to do any kind of professional work with that program. Compared to Sony Vegas, Premiere CC is a total nightmare to edit with. I gave up after one video edit which took me all day, and then did the following one in Vegas in less than an hour. I'd figured how to use Premiere, but the user interface and extreme lack of functionality drove me nuts. If my client wants me to edit any more videos in Premiere, it's not gonna happen. Apologies for the rant...

[AaronChicago]

Yeah, I've been doing this for years. Probably as far back as 2006 for videos I was using a program called Photozoom to upres DV videos to 1080P. It works. Although I normally don't need to do it. Editing 32bit in Sony Vegas usually takes care of any banding. Otherwise I use Neat Video noise reduction followed by either film grain or the Add Noise plugin in Sony Vegas set to 0.025.

A chroma blur plugin can sometimes help too.

I also noticed the mention of Premiere CC in this article. I installed that last night for some videos I have to edit with a client's CC license. OMG, Premiere has to be the most frustratingly awkward, fiddly and annoying software out there! Having struggled with it nearly all day today, I honestly don't understand how anyone would have the patience to do any kind of professional work with that program. Compared to Sony Vegas, Premiere CC is a total nightmare to edit with. I gave up after one video edit which took me all day, and then did the following one in Vegas in less than an hour. I'd figured how to use Premiere, but the user interface and extreme lack of functionality drove me nuts. If my client wants me to edit any more videos in Premiere, it's not gonna happen. Apologies for the rant...

 

Na man. You're just not used to it. Tons of pros are switching to Premiere for fast turnaround. Integration with After Effects is amazing. Check out this timeline for an SNL edit done in one day.

 

[Andrew Reid]

Glenn, not unexpected to be frustrated with a user interface after 1 day of use.

 

I've been using Premiere for 10 years and it still has annoyances ;)

 

But you get used to it believe me... I like it...Straight forward and quick. It's FCPX I couldn't get my head around. Maybe I'll try again one day.

[pietz]

awesome, thanks andrew!

 

regarding Premiere: i just love it. not having to render anything in after effects because i can just drop the ae project in the premiere timeline is just a killer feature. i tried fcpx for a while, but i couldnt get used to it. and i think i never will as it seems to be for people who edit something from the left to the right. i on the other hand drop the footage in different places and fill the gaps that are left. with this workflow using fcpx feels like i have to workaround everything i do. i just cant wrap my mind around why i cant just import a second video layer and move the footage freely. i dont want to connect this clip to any other clip. its so weird to me...

[Andrew Reid]

if you have 10bit per channel to convert to 8bit per channel, noise dithering is not the best algorithm, diffusion dithering is better the typical algorithm is Floyd–Steinberg - look at the difference with the noise or "random" algorithm it is day and night :  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dither

 vs 

 

Good luck doing that in your NLE :)

 

If there is a way, do correct me if I'm wrong :)

[johnnymossville]

There's gotta be a floyd steinberg dithering plugin out there somewhere right?     I used to use it all the time back in the day of 256 color computers and my Amiga days. 

[Christina Ava]

!!!!this is why i love this forum <3

[Andrew Reid]

so basically this might be the reason why banding disappears on the 1DC only if ISO is set to a value higher than 400, as they need that ISO gain to add the noise to avoid that banding?

 

That's an interesting thought.

[C@illou]

Nice tip to hide the banding. However, when you do Dithering, you usually do it when downsampling your signal, so here it would be when the camera encodes the video files, it should use Dithering to have smoother looking gradient. Adding noise in post will just distract the eye from the banding, I think. Also, the banding that you see in the first place with an 8bit codec on the GH4 is most likely due to the H.264 compression, for instance if you look at those three pictures I have included, one is in PNG 8bit/channel, no loss of information, the other one is JPEG 8bit/channel, lossy. You can clearly see the banding in the JPEG picture whereas I can barely see it in the PNG one, or maybe what I see is due to my shitty laptop TN display.

 

PNG gradient: http://postimg.org/image/wb5o7976z/

JPEG 75%: http://postimg.org/image/mrxc0lj1b/

JPEG 100%: http://postimg.org/image/u5ouxfsvp/

note that I chose such a slight gradient on purpose, as the less difference there is in the gradient, the more likely you will have banding.

 

The only way you can see the banding due to using "only" 8bit is by grading/color correcting it heavily, like I did here for the previous picture:

http://postimg.org/image/oc2ogiz1j/

 

Again, that doesn't remove any value from your tip here, I am no videographer and I just wanted to add some technical precision so that you know what causes what.

[Damphousse]

Nice job Andrew!

 

Finally someone posts one of the real reasons I still shoot analog film in my stills cameras!  In addition to realistic shots I also like to do extreme things like using a contrast filter and stacking a polarizer on it with B&W film.  I also use a polarizer sometimes with Velvia 50.  I turn chunks of sky black!  With analog film this looks striking.  You get some very rich dark gradients.  With digital unless you can expose to the right without blowing highlights get ready for banding city in many situations.  Everyone says digital is wonderful because you can to so much edititing after you've got the shot.  Yes and no.  There are many times those rich dark gradients look like crap out of the camera and other times they just fall apart if you try and push them around too much.  It's an expensive hassle but if you want idiot proof dark gradients that fill the sky shoot film.

 

Nice solution for video.  I will have to keep that in mind.

[Damphousse]

There's gotta be a floyd steinberg dithering plugin out there somewhere right?     I used to use it all the time back in the day of 256 color computers and my Amiga days. 

 

You would have to wonder about the horse power to analyze and pull that off on every frame.

[Andrew Reid]

DSLRs are internally colour grading the image don't forget. Photo styles.

 

Yes I feel you're right about compression - that is one of the major causes of the banding.

[Lenscamera]

Can this be done in Final cut?