zenpmd Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 In particular on the A7s. I am thinking of buying it. What I cannot fathom is why metabones say their adapters don't work on the full frame bodies. Is that really correct? Or is it more accurate to say it will only work in APS-C crop mode? If the latter, does this lens become a 35-105? Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ebrahim Saadawi Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 What I cannot fathom is why metabones say their adapters don't work on the full frame bodies. Is that really correct? Thanks! Do you mean the metabones speed booster adapter? if so, yes it wont work in full frame mode as it shrinks the lens circle to APS-C for wider fov + increased light intensity. It will vignette enormously in full frame mode as the effectively becomes an aps-c lens. normal metabones EF to E mount that has no glass will work fine, it just allows mechanically coupling of the lens to the body. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zenpmd Posted October 28, 2014 Author Share Posted October 28, 2014 As I see. Here it is. Yes non-speed booster. Their website is hard to navigate! http://www.metabones.com/products/details/MB-EF-E-BM4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ebrahim Saadawi Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 Where is the mention? I see no mention of not being supported in full frame mode. I am quite sure you can use Canon full frame EF lenses on the A7s in full frame mode with the metabones EF to E mount, many of my collegues are shooting with that exact combination. The only mention in that page that's closely related is where they say the mk IV version supports the Auto APS-C function of the A7s when used with EF-S lenses, which means that when you put an EF-S lens (APS-C lens) the camera with automatically jump in APS-C mode. It works. Just make sure you get the latest mark IV version. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trias Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 I'm using this lens on the A7S with the metabones adapter, and love it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zenpmd Posted October 30, 2014 Author Share Posted October 30, 2014 If I use it in crop mode does it become a 35-105? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ebrahim Saadawi Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Yes zenpmd the 24-70 on a crop sensor (aps-c) will give a similar field of view to a 35-105mm on full frame photographic format. It will also give an equivalent depth of field to an f/6 on a full frame. So in terms of FOV and DOF it effectively becomes a 35-105mm f/6 IS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 It will also give an equivalent depth of field to an f/6 on a full frame. So in terms of FOV and DOF it effectively becomes a 35-105mm f/6 IS. DOF doesn't change. F-stop (I.e. light gathering ability) changes, but DOF remains the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julian Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Oh no, not the cropfactor vs dof discussion again :) http://***URL removed***/articles/2666934640/what-is-equivalence-and-why-should-i-care Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Yes this is a minefield. I see that Ebrahim was talking in 35mm equivalent dof-to-fov now. At the end of the day a lens is a lens though. You cant change the image it produces by using a different sensor. That's the way my brain works anyway... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ebrahim Saadawi Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 To simplify it Matt think of what changing the sensor "effectively" does rather than technically, when you have a 50mm lens with a certain dof on a full frame sensor, it has a certain field of view, then you put the same lens on a s35 sensor, yes nothing happens to dof, the lens is just cropped, then what you do is that you move the lens away from the subject to match the same field of view as full frame, and with changing the distance you will focus more toward infinity and get a deeper depth if field. So effectively when using a lens on full frame vs s35 at the same field of view you get a shallower depth of field on the full frame, it gives the ability to get closer and focus closer, knocking the background out of focus. That's why full frame has a special look. If you have a 50mm f2.8 lens on a full frame sensor, to match that image on a s35 sensor, you go back farther to match the fov, and open the iris to 1.8 to match the dof. For example if you want to match 50mm 1.2 fullframe on a s35 or m43s, good luck. That why full frame sensors make it much easier to get a shallow depth of field vs smaller sensors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy lee Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 I'm not a fan of full frame for the reason you can get such wierd looking narrow dof and people go mad with it . Super 35/ APSC for me has a look we all know as 'film' from 100 years of cinema and movies we all like. This extreeme full frame super narrow DOF just looks too arty OTT for me, I never use it. (Super 35mm /apsc /micro 4/3 with speedbooster ) at f2 is about my max I go to any more than that and it becomes unusable for me - too wierd! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ebrahim Saadawi Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Yes it's purely down to personal taste Andy but remember that having a full frame sensor means you just have more choice, you can get the look of s35, m34s, 2/3".. Anything, you stop down the lens. But it doesn't work the other way around. If you're used to s35 you can multiply the numbers with 1.5 and just use that on full frame and get a s35 image. (for example consider the highest you can go on full frame is f/3.5) Using a smaller aperture does affect lowlight performance but full frame sensors are usually much better in low light and that renders the issue not a problem.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy lee Posted November 2, 2014 Share Posted November 2, 2014 I shot on Super 35mm and 16mm film for 15 years , then Digi Betacam for 3 years , then I shot on 5D for 3 years ....all hi end expensive pop videos for MTV -I just dont ever use the Canon anymore as I dont like the look I only use it for taking stills now!! with 5D you have to shoot f4 - 5.6 to get the Super 35mm filmic look , but the sweet spot on most lenses - the bit that actually looks great is wide open or one stop down from that - that is where the 'character' is - all the great cinematographers like Owen Roisman, Darius Khondgi, Gordon Willis , Barry Ackroyd , Jack Cardiff etc etc do this - thats the area I always play in as thats where you get the great looks and style from a lens , you cant do that on full frame as you have having to stop down heavily all the time thats why I dont like the look of full frame as you are not working in the lens sweet spot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ebrahim Saadawi Posted November 2, 2014 Share Posted November 2, 2014 Interesting. I always thought we all prefered our lenses at their sharpest aperture setting, from 2.8_8 on most lenses, slightly stopping down greatly increases sharpness especially in the corners, eliminates viggentting and reduces colour fringing and chromatic aberations. But I do get the point. If you ask my heart rather than my mind I do agree and like to shoot wide open with a slight softness to the corners and a slight viggette, instead of a perfect setting, especially for close ups of people, but I prefer to use the clinical/higher quality setting for wide scenes, softness and imperfections look horrible in wide detailed shots. It's interesting hearing so many professionals prefer the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy lee Posted November 2, 2014 Share Posted November 2, 2014 thats why lens choise is so important - with great cinemotography you are playing with light in a pleasing artistic way for the human eye, and that artisty for me tends to happen wide open or 1 stop down from there , it doesnt happen at f5.6 - all lenses looks good and clynical at f5.6 .....they loose their soul and artistry . If you are shooting pack shots for a commercial then you will be stopped down so it looks clynical - but anything with feel and soul I shoot wide open in that area - I just looks so much better . So pick your lenses carefully - most cinema lenses are designed to be shot side open - I used to shoot on Zeiss for 10 years and we shot wide open all the time just to get the look. Now there are so many great lenses out there that have these desirable characteristics ...like the Nikon 28-70mm Bourne lens , thats why you hear me banging on about certain lenses on this forum - its not because they are good at f5.6 - its because they are great all day long when you shoot WO . get the NDs out - get that lens wide open!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nikkor Posted November 2, 2014 Share Posted November 2, 2014 Well, get the nikkor 70-200 2.8 VRI, it's never really sharp but always good looking. Strange lens. But honestly, the real zeiss cinema lenses are terribly sharp at every stop. And 65mm films look filmic to me, try to find any 65mm lens that is not super sharp from f4 onwards (65mm would mean f8-f11 to achieve the "cinema dof") Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hmcindie Posted November 2, 2014 Share Posted November 2, 2014 So pick your lenses carefully - most cinema lenses are designed to be shot side open - I used to shoot on Zeiss for 10 years and we shot wide open all the time just to get the look. Never shot anamorphically? I mean those are way more artsy than spherical lenses and the look is also closer to fullframe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy lee Posted November 2, 2014 Share Posted November 2, 2014 I shoot on Schneiders and Iscos, first on 16mm film in the 90's and later on digital - I've been championing those lenses on this forum for along time now, have a look on the anamorphic forum . this is my Blackmagic rig with an Isco, these later integrated ones are great lenses http://www.eoshd.com/comments/gallery/image/180-tecnoir-blackmagic-anamorphic-cinema-rig-lores/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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