Shooting with a 4K pocket camera - the exceptional Panasonic LX100

[Guest Ebrahim Saadawi]

I couldn't get the colours to look as good as this with any Panasonic camera. And most GH4 videos I've seen online don't look this good in colour. The Colours here just look fantastic, what's your secret Andrew? Or does the LX100 have something special in colour vs the GH4?

[PrebenR]

Great writeup Andrew! I just got my LX100 and I'm having fun testing it.
But I must say, it definitely does NOT have auto ISO with manual ss and manual aperture in video mode. You can set the ISO to auto, but I can confirm that as soon as you hit record it switches to a fixed ISO. Too bad.. On the other hand, you can change ISO during a shot.
A big plus for stills shooters that I haven't seen mentioned is that flash sync goes all the way up to at least 1000th/sec. shutter speed, at least for the external flash I tried. The GX7 only goes up to a 250th I think.

One can increase flash sync in compacts because you cannot change the lens you can use a leaf shutter. You cannot do that with interchangeable lenses unless you put it in the lens.

Wonder how a 77mm ND vario filter would look like on this camera :)

[PrebenR]

The sensor is reported to be a FT sensor, not mFT. If that is correct what are the differences? Google did not produce anything helpful on this.

[nvldk]

Another constructive forum post ehh

 

Don't get me wrong. The write-up is good. I just dont undertand the hype around 4k cameras with 8bit colors...

[miguel]

Hi.

I'm new to the forum, but I've been a reader to the blog for a while now. Congratulations for the great work you do here.

 

I generally find the colours on Panasonic cameras to be a little artificial out of the camera (as many members of the community do). In the video the skin tones vary a lot (compare 1:11 vs 1:14). There seems to be a lot of magenta in some shots. Are those from the LX100?

[SteffenH]

But hasn´t Andrew just proven that it does not really count if a camera is technically 8 or 10bit if the end result is of good quality? Sure, this is not an Alexa, it´s not 4:2:2 ProRes recording and no 14bit raw video .. but it shoots damn good pictures you have to go quite far to find something similar in 10bit. With stills capability. That size.

 

Wrote a little bit more about mixing LX100 footage with 10bit raw(log) footage here: http://hackermovies.com/panasonic-lx-100-vs-5d-mk-iii-english

[Cinegain]

The sensor is reported to be a FT sensor, not mFT. If that is correct what are the differences? Google did not produce anything helpful on this.

It's always been a FT sensor in these cameras. Only the mounttype is called differently to make a distinction between SLR and mirrorless, the mount these days is a MFT/M43 one, it used to be FT when the cameras where still using mirrors (to allow light being redirected to the optical viewfinder). So it still uses a 4/3" sensor (1.33"), but the mount flange focal distance due to being mirrorless (no mirror, so no optical viewfinder, that's why mirrorless cameras have either no viewfinder or a digital one) is greatly reduced.

[neverending]

LX100 mistakes... No mode dial (LX7 had a mode dial), no separate creative movie mode replaced by annoying video "mode" (LX7 had it), lack of all CINE profile, lack of mic-in, no live HDMI monitoring, no tiltable screen... Clear panasonic choice to protect GH4...

 

for me FZ1000 is a clear winner for video even if has a smaller sensor and "darker" lens

[tosvus]

LX100 mistakes... No mode dial (LX7 had a mode dial), no separate creative movie mode replaced by annoying video "mode" (LX7 had it), lack of all CINE profile, lack of mic-in, no live HDMI monitoring, no tiltable screen

 

for ma FZ1000 is a winner even if has a smaller sensor and "darker" lens

 

How many times are you planning on repeating what you don't like about the LX100, and that you plan to get the FZ1000? I'm sure Andrew will make a thread about it soon, or you can make one yourself.  Others like the fact that it does not use a mode dial, and most people understand that this was not meant to be a camera to replace the GH4.

 

Don't get me wrong. The write-up is good. I just dont undertand the hype around 4k cameras with 8bit colors...

I think the point is that your post gives nothing in this discussion. If you only can accept 4k with more bits, then there are cameras there for you but they are x thousands of dollars, and there is certainly no-one in this thread about a relatively cheap compact camera that happens to take great video that think it will replace those. The Lx100 is a camera that will take nice quality 4K, and downscaled to 1080p (which is what most probably will do at this point anyway), it seems to compete favorably to far more expensive 1080p cameras. Also, there is an old discussion about downscaling it could yield 1080p 10-bit. (Math seems to support it, but I don't recall any definitive confirmation in testing the quality differences when doing so)

 

People, generally, if you don't feel this is the camera for you, there is nothing gained by moaning here about missing features. It is what it is. Focus on other cameras instead, or maybe make a wishlist thread for future LX cameras. (but be realistic :))

[animan]

Hey neverending, its not a competition, people are also enthousiastic for the small size / form factor, wider angle etc..

 

 (For my own needs FZ1000 is a clear choice too but not everyone is the same)

[Andrew Reid]

Hi.

I'm new to the forum, but I've been a reader to the blog for a while now. Congratulations for the great work you do here.

 

I generally find the colours on Panasonic cameras to be a little artificial out of the camera (as many members of the community do). In the video the skin tones vary a lot (compare 1:11 vs 1:14). There seems to be a lot of magenta in some shots. Are those from the LX100?

 

No they are from the D750 and A7S. I toned down the magenta in the grade, then Vimeo brought it back again. It would be really nice if we had better colour handling from screen to screen and platform to platform, not to mention the camera side.

[Hitfabryk]

I have an omd em5 with 7.5 Samyang, 12-40mm Olympus, 17.5mm Nokton, and 40-150 mm Olympus.

Mainly use camera for family stills and video. Love the weather sealing and image stabilized videos with kids as it comes in handy sometimes.

Question is should I sell everything, start fresh, and just get the Lx100?

I would not do that! The 12-40mm, the Nokton 17,5 and the 40-150mm (is that the new one?) are great lenses. Keep that and buy an extra or new cam (LX100) for video. Do you need 4k? Maybe a GM1, LX7 or GH4 or..? You can use you're lenses.

If not, please give it to me and I will give you a new LX100 ;) ..

[MattH]

How many times are you planning on repeating what you don't like about the LX100, and that you plan to get the FZ1000? I'm sure Andrew will make a thread about it soon, or you can make one yourself.  Others like the fact that it does not use a mode dial, and most people understand that this was not meant to be a camera to replace the GH4.

 

I think the point is that your post gives nothing in this discussion. If you only can accept 4k with more bits, then there are cameras there for you but they are x thousands of dollars, and there is certainly no-one in this thread about a relatively cheap compact camera that happens to take great video that think it will replace those. The Lx100 is a camera that will take nice quality 4K, and downscaled to 1080p (which is what most probably will do at this point anyway), it seems to compete favorably to far more expensive 1080p cameras. Also, there is an old discussion about downscaling it could yield 1080p 10-bit. (Math seems to support it, but I don't recall any definitive confirmation in testing the quality differences when doing so)

 

People, generally, if you don't feel this is the camera for you, there is nothing gained by moaning here about missing features. It is what it is. Focus on other cameras instead, or maybe make a wishlist thread for future LX cameras. (but be realistic :))

 

I didn't know this was the "Be 100% possitive and nothing else about the new camera of the week" forum.  But thanks for setting us all straight.

 

Personally I find it a little puzzling that the issues the camera labs review exposed about the camera havent been addressed in this discussion.  And like all enthusiast gear lust cameras its over priced.   A new camera is a write off for a gear reveiwer but not everyone can spunk over every camera that comes out.  Is this post too negative?  here's a challenge: write a possitive response to it.

[tosvus]

I didn't know this was the "Be 100% possitive and nothing else about the new camera of the week" forum.  But thanks for setting us all straight.

 

Personally I find it a little puzzling that the issues the camera labs review exposed about the camera havent been addressed in this discussion.  And like all enthusiast gear lust cameras its over priced.   A new camera is a write off for a gear reveiwer but not everyone can spunk over every camera that comes out.  Is this post too negative?  here's a challenge: write a possitive response to it.

 

By all means, constructive posts are fine, and maybe you can contribute to this thread by being clear about the points in the camera labs review that concerns you the most. I'm sure there are valid concerns that could/should be addressed in a FW update for instance, or if you need to point out certain uses the camera is not going to be great for.

 

The posts that I referred to were either *a* Complaining that a $899 camera doesn't have 4K 10-bit, when Panasonic is pretty much revolutionizing the compact segment to even include 4K. and *b* People that practically cut and paste their own post several times saying why they don't like the camera and another camera is better. That adds nothing to the discussion after the first time.... 

[Ungermann]

So, to fine-tune shutter speed one would use a front ring? But if I wanted to use the front ring for focusing or zooming then I would adjust with the rear wheel, right?

 

In any case, front ring, rear wheel or plain buttons, to me this seems breaking the retro experience. I understand that I cannot set all the possible speeds with just one small dial on top, so I would employ the EV dial for fine-tuning instead of using re-programmable front ring or the rear ring. To me, using EV dial is more in line with retro approach than using the front ring or the rear wheel. This can perfectly work for manual mode, will not work for shutter priority mode though because still need to set EV correction somehow.

 

Also, other people noted that it is easy to bump the front ring and change settings inadvertently. A stiff clickable dial like the EV dial on top is much better suited for the job, IMHO.

 

Opinions?

[noone]

Thanks,

 

I was already 90% sold, you have just made it a certainty for me.

 

One thing, just below the butterfly wing photo you have written GX7, did you mean G7X there (regards 20mp camera)??

[Husah]

I would never put a camera into my pockets, that place is full of dust and you won't get it out a camera with fixed lens. You also don't want to stress the aligment between lens and sensor.

 

That's why this not a RX100 competitor. RX100 is designed to fit in a pocket. The lens retracts and has built-in cover on the lens. This camera is much larger. Look at the size of the lens.  It's not a pocket camera like RX100 series.  

 

Different segment. 

[Benjamin Chan]

Was wondering about image stabilization. Is it decent? There are apparently 3 settings : one "normal" mode, one "active", one "off"  (a bit like RX100). I'd like to know if the modes are effective, and if they reduce resolution and picture quality like the RX100 does. And would they also crop the image/change the focal length in doing so?

[Jacek]

That's why this not a RX100 competitor. RX100 is designed to fit in a pocket. The lens retracts and has built-in cover on the lens. This camera is much larger. Look at the size of the lens.  It's not a pocket camera like RX100 series.  

 

Different segment. 

 

But are you talking about RX100, RX100 II or RX100 III ? Because they are totally diffferent segments! ;)

 

LX100 is 14% wider and taller and 34% thicker than RX100 III

but RX100 III is 14% thicker than RX100 !

 

So just be clear which segment you are talking about: kid's trousers back pocket segment, kid's trousers front pocket, kid's jacket pocket, adult's trousers back pocket, adult's trousers front pocket, adults jacket pocket, snowboarder trousers back pocket...

 

I, for example, am interested only in adult's winter jacket internal pocket segment.

[tosvus]

Was wondering about image stabilization. Is it decent? There are apparently 3 settings : one "normal" mode, one "active", one "off"  (a bit like RX100). I'd like to know if the modes are effective, and if they reduce resolution and picture quality like the RX100 does. And would they also crop the image/change the focal length in doing so?

 

I wasn't aware there are multiple settings on the LX100, but the discussions I have seen on other forums, from people owning the RX100 and/or the GH4, is that the between the LX100 and RX100, the RX100 has more effective stabilization, but does not maintain the quality level (sharpness, detail), due to active mode doing electronic stabilization on top of optical.

 

A couple of people owning the GH4 as well as the LX100, say that when moving around it is better controlled with GH4 + 12-35 2.8 OIS, but standing still, the LX100 OIS is better. 

 

On a sidenote, as Andrew noted as well, others state moire does not seem to be quantifiable worse than on the GH4, and probably better than GH3.

 

I should get my LX100 on Friday, so looking forward to testing it out.