V-Log on GH4 is coming

[johnnymossville]

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[Julian]

Interesting!

 

Panasonic actualy announced an upcoming GH4 / YAGYAYEHA firmware update today, but it doesn't mention V-log.

 

http://av.jpn.support.panasonic.com/support/global/cs/dsc/info/update_gh4_yagh.html

 

• With this firmware, time code and RSS(Recording Start/Stop) signal can be embedded to the HDMI output signal*.
  * Available when DMC-GH4 or DMW-YAGH are connected with the products of Atomos Global Pty. Ltd. or the products complying with the extended specifications of Atomos Global Pty. Ltd..
• FHD at 30p/25p native output via HDMI is available while recording video in FHD at 30p/25p.
• FHD at 30PsF(Over 60i) / 25PsF(Over 50i) output via SDI is available while recording video in FHD at 30p/25p.
  * When DMW-YAGH is used for SDI output.

[johnnymossville]

They did mention a firmware update for this week, or next week last month I believe. For the GH4 itself.  So maybe we'll see it soon.

[Juan Le]

For DSLR newbies, what is V-LOG and why should I be excited? 

[johnnymossville]

For DSLR newbies, what is V-LOG and why should I be excited? 

 

 

A simplified explanation as far as I know,... Theoretically in LOG you can get the flattest and widest dynamic range video possible from the sensor. In the GH4's case it could be 10 bit recorded externally, or they may try to cram that DR into an 8-Bit (Sony A7S has 8-Bit S-Log I believe) image for internal recording.     The footage will need grading in post to look good, but in the right hands it could make for very high quality footage. 

 

Pros here can correct me if I'm wrong.  

[AaronChicago]

Very nice.

[MaxAperture Films]

Great find OP!!  This pretty much guarantees more control over highlights, if released.  Panasonic does not appear to be pulling any punches, so far they've shown decent firmware support for the GH4.  V-Log is actually a high-end Varicam gamma curve for the new cinema and broadcast cameras described as -

 

"To maximize the dynamic range of the recorded images, Panasonic has developed a new log curve (V-Log) which elegantly maps the 14+ stops of image data to the recorded file. The VariCam 35 permits the assignment of various LUTs to individual recording channels and camera outputs. For example, shoot UHD and record non-destructively with the V-Log LUT, but assign a â€baked-in†709 LUT on the HD / proxy recording for a real-time normal contrast look for editing and pre-grading. The camera’s monitor, EVF and EVF outputs have similar selectable LUT capabilities."

 

I doubt the LUT capability will be there on the GH4 (the image looks very flat on the monitor) but who knows!!

[ntblowz]

Hopefully it will be a nice xmas present from Panasonic.

[JazzBox]

Great news! I hope V-Log will work also internally! 

[PatrickN]

More info with video of the firmware.

http://www.newsshooter.com/2014/11/20/panasonic-gh4-v-log-picture-profile-spotted-in-the-wild/

 

quote from newsshoter

" By technical editor Matt Allard:

A GH4 on the Panasonic stand at the Inter BEE show in Tokyo today was running beta firmware with the V-Log picture profile. This Log profile is similar to the one in the much more expensive Varicam 35. This would be a very welcome enhancement for anyone trying to get the best possible image from the GH4, and a huge advantage for colourists trying to match the GH4 with other cameras.

 

I spoke to a Panasonic representative who told me that the V-Log Picture Profile was only being tested at the moment and isn’t confirmed for the next firmware release. Interestingly enough though I did run into a Japanese shooter who had V-Log operational on his GH4.

Lets hope that it is indeed scheduled to be included in Panasonic’s upcoming firmware update."

[johnnymossville]

Here's the video showing it.

 

[Guest Ebrahim Saadawi]

V-Log is a feature of their very highend line, it's "Varricam-Log".

All I care about is for it to have:

-Absolute Zero sharpening

-a different colour reproduction, because Cinelike D dialed down in 4K preserves almost the entire dynamic range vs the raw stills output as far as my tests could see. This camera just needs the Varricam unique colour science.

The ergonomics of shooting with that camera is second to none and that resolution pop is unrivaled, it's just dragged down by the digital sharpnening and colour reproduction. Both seem easily fixable with a new V-Log profile.

[Guest Ebrahim Saadawi]

Look how flat it is vs Cinelike D. Also interesting that the picture profile parameters are locked out in V-Log and you can't alter the contrast, a good sign it's actually a proper log curve.

[ntblowz]

Whoa that is really flat

[jax_rox]

-a different colour reproduction, because Cinelike D dialed down in 4K preserves almost the entire dynamic range vs the raw stills output as far as my tests could see. This camera just needs the Varricam unique colour science.
 

You won't see Varicam colours out of this. You will be able to grade it a lot to get it where you want, but you won't be getting Varicam colour science out of a camera 1/10 the price. Not to mention that the gamma curve doesn't change the way the camera captures information - it's still the same colours, and the same dynamic range, it's just mapped in a way that allows you to take full benefit from it. 

[Guest Ebrahim Saadawi]

Different profiles and tweaks on the GH4 allow for some strong alterations of colour reproduction therefore I am hoping this would bring it closer to the V name in colour science 8) It's definitely possible if they wanted to...

And it does seem this is designed for the 10bit 4K ProRes quality shooting with an External Recorder, it's configured that way in those photos. Makes since as a 10bit 4K image will be able to handle Log properly vs 8 bit 1080p, which introduces all sorta of issues when pushing the curves at any directions. Perhaps it's why it isn't being released until now, for the Shogun arrival.

[johnnymossville]

I believe they could very closely match the color of the Varicam on the GH4.   Now, the resolution and DR, maybe not, but the Color should be doable.  Canon manages to match their colors across their lines pretty well, No reason why Panasonic can't. 

[PeterGregg]

For DSLR newbies, what is V-LOG and why should I be excited? 

You mentioned DSLR, so I am guessing you have a decent understanding of the process to take pictures. You can shoot either a jpg image or a RAW image. With video though, you can only shoot what amounts to a jpg image in video mode. The jpg system in the camera "bakes in" the settings that you set the camera to work with, and in the process it clobbers the file making it much harder to "processes later in your computer. Video people have their own language and they don't call it processing the video, they call it "grading" the video. You know, like teenagers have their own language, video people have their own language :)

 

So in an effort to do the very least clobbering of the file, and leaving as much of the information still to remain in the video, an effort is made to to do as little damage to the file as possible. To do this, the video is shot as "flat" as possible. This means little contrast, little color saturation, little sharpness - basically the most untouched the file can get. This leaves as much of the original data as possible to still be there to addressed and called upon when you get the video into the computer.

 

Companies recognize this process and they try to help. Just like you would have color calibrations called vivid, portrait, landscape, natural, standard and so on, they add special color choices for video. Sony has s-log, Panasonic is adding v-log, and so on. It is as dumbed down as the file can get and still get recovered in the computer.

 

The joke, or facts are, it still doesn't get as good as a raw file you would be using for pictures, and you are still using a partially baked compressed file that is just "less clobbered". In my pro work, I shoot raw for stills. For video i shoot as flat as I can get the video, but it still ain't no raw file. On the other hand, raw files for video are not easy to work with like raw files for still images. And there are not that many cameras that even offer it, plus the knowledge it takes to process the video - or "grade" the video is harder to do.

 

Vlog is Panasonic's attempt to hardwire a very flat file for us to work with. They had CineD before this and I personally didn't like it. I found "natural" on the GH4 with everything turned to the flattest setting and for me is better to work with. In low light I like "vivid" with everything turned flat and seem to get lower noise. I am eager to see if this vlog will give a nice flat file to work with. For you, you need to remember your video shot in vlog will look terribly flat and bland. You will have to work it once in the computer, it isn't  a set-it-and-forget-it type of setting.

 

Hope that helps some.

 

Peter

[Juan Le]

Awesome, thanks a lot Peter! Btw, I follow you on youtube often haha keep up the great reviews!

 

When you're shooting in log then, what I assume is just similar to shooting RAW but in video mode, but not quite as good as RAW due to the nature of video compare to taking a still image.

[Kevin Lloyd]

Awesome, thanks a lot Peter! Btw, I follow you on youtube often haha keep up the great reviews!

 

When you're shooting in log then, what I assume is just similar to shooting RAW but in video mode, but not quite as good as RAW due to the nature of video compare to taking a still image.

​I think you need to digest his second to last paragraph again. It seems to me it's actually more like a jpg file that has the most dynamic range (but unlike a raw file doesn't contain data outside of the visible range, hence the term "baked", or fixed.

How it makes colour better for grading I'm not quite sure, maybe it's better because none of the colour channels are clipped as easily when processing, or bullying the file in post.

I'm a newb at this myself, so please anyone correct me if I'm wrong.